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Shammm

Another desperate Sub noob

5 posts in this topic

Hello guys, my main spec was assassination and i had pretty decent dps, however since sub spec is superior i decided to switch. But i just dont get the spec, i dont understand where does the dmg come from. Im trying to maintain as much uptime of SnD/Rupture/Hemo/FW but dps is still lower then assassination. I dont have any logs because i dont feel like im doing everything right yet. This so fhard to watch everything and also not delay dance/vanish cuz of low energy, refreshing snd/rup and that snd consuming ur main cps so u have to build new 5 even tho u hav few anticipation stacks is just pissing me off.

 

I feel like mb im missing smth very important, smth that allows u not to worry about maintaining Rup/SnD during Dance/FW and just maximizing ambush/evi casts.

 

1) From what ive read u have to maintain rupture/snd at all times, u dont bother about hemo uptime during FW (like u never use hemo during FW?).

 

2) Since we need to keep FW as much as possible we have to use Dance/Vanish on cooldown ? And thats what i dont get aswell, like we cant enter dance w low energy (not sure about cps) so we have to delay them anyway.

 

3) When there is more than 1 target im just lost, what do u do ? From icy veins guide it says u switch to FoK and consume cps for CT and apply rupture on all of them with a buff. But there is nothing about dance/vanish etc. And usually i just hemo 2nd target instead of wasting 5cps on CT to buff the rupture not sure if its right.

 

4) And last thing, the key to this spec is ur time management ? Like every time to be able to enter dance with a lot of energy and cps while having rup/snd/hemo up and also not delaying dance/vanish cuz of those ? Because atm this seems impossible to me

 

Thanks for reading this noobwall, any help is appreciated sad.png

Edited by Shammm

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Hello guys, my main spec was assassination and i had pretty decent dps, however since sub spec is superior i decided to switch. But i just dont get the spec, i dont understand where does the dmg come from. Im trying to maintain as much uptime of SnD/Rupture/Hemo/FW but dps is still lower then assassination. I dont have any logs because i dont feel like im doing everything right yet. This so fhard to watch everything and also not delay dance/vanish cuz of low energy, refreshing snd/rup and that snd consuming ur main cps so u have to build new 5 even tho u hav few anticipation stacks is just pissing me off.

 

I feel like mb im missing smth very important, smth that allows u not to worry about maintaining Rup/SnD during Dance/FW and just maximizing ambush/evi casts.

 

1) From what ive read u have to maintain rupture/snd at all times, u dont bother about hemo uptime during FW (like u never use hemo during FW?).

 

2) Since we need to keep FW as much as possible we have to use Dance/Vanish on cooldown ? And thats what i dont get aswell, like we cant enter dance w low energy (not sure about cps) so we have to delay them anyway.

 

3) When there is more than 1 target im just lost, what do u do ? From icy veins guide it says u switch to FoK and consume cps for CT and apply rupture on all of them with a buff. But there is nothing about dance/vanish etc. And usually i just hemo 2nd target instead of wasting 5cps on CT to buff the rupture not sure if its right.

 

4) And last thing, the key to this spec is ur time management ? Like every time to be able to enter dance with a lot of energy and cps while having rup/snd/hemo up and also not delaying dance/vanish cuz of those ? Because atm this seems impossible to me

 

Thanks for reading this noobwall, any help is appreciated sad.png

 
 

1) Correct. SnD is your Energy Regen so it's very important, while Rupture is your highest damage skill

 

2) Yes, use them on cooldown. You pool energy before you enter Dance - read through the proper use of Shadow Dance thread at the top of this forum

 

3) You still use your cooldowns as normal. Just keep your bleeds up on both targets.

 

4) Yeah pretty much. It's arguably the most difficult DPS spec in the game and takes a lot of practice to master. I suggest using my WeakAuras from the UI thread or making your own, and give the Shadow Dance thread a good read. 

 

As a point of note, Anticipation Charges are only consumed with OFFENSIVE finishers. This means anything that affects an enemy - SnD and Recup do not consume them, but Rup / Evis / KS do

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I went through the same as you. I rejoined Wow as Assassination when WoD came out. Tried to keep up with guild raid progression and switched to Sub to give me the required DPS increase.

 

I still have some question marks here and there, but this is what worked for me.

 

Go to Shadowcraft and click the advanced tab. It will show you the damage breakdown for you spec based on best possible scenario. Then go kill some bosses and check your damage breakdown (I use recount, just click the DPS). I learned from there that I was using less Ambush that I could and too many Hemos.

 

1) I care about Hemo only if it is down and I have nothing better to cast. Also when my Rupture and SnD are going to end at the same time, I just use Hemo, then Refresh SnD and refresh Rup later. I almost completely dropped it. Now my Rupture upkeep is so good that I am thinking of dropping that glyph altogether for some fights. Hemo does about 2% of the overall damage.

 

2) I macroed SR + SD + trinket and Vanish + Prep as cast sequence. I enter the fight in stealth and premed, prepot, SnD when I get another CP from HaT, Ambush and then push my macro. When I am done and FW drops, I pool energy, Vanish + Prep macro and Ambush again. FW drops, but my vanish is ready, repeat. When I am done, next SD is really close. I delay all as neccessary to pool enough energy to spam abilities. This all changes at Imp though when I save at least one CD for the intermissions.

 

3) FoK is nice on 3+ targets, but not that great on 2. On fights like Bracken, I simply leave big rupture on boss when switching to add, burn add, go back to boss, Hemo, and put rupture as soon as possible. For trash and Tectus, FoK+CT is good. The target switching along with positioning for backstab will probably cost you more than the possible gain, so just forget it if you are not confident. I use CDs on current target except if the add is about to die, then I delay them (same with rupture).

 

4) Keep practicing. It will be frustrating in the beginning. There are too many keys, so try to find macros that will work for you. It will never be perfect, but that's the beauty of sub. There is no fixed order. Same as the poster above, I use weak auras. I only show SnD, Rup, Hemo, FW as bars and I make them more prominent when it is time to refresh. I use another set of icons that show me which of my CDs are currently available (like huge icons) and when I have 5 CPs (with sound). I hid stuff such as shattered bleed because the information has little value.

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Wow thanks a lot guys ! smile.png  I guess its all about practice like always. Btw i wanted to ask about tectus fight, when there are 5+ targets, do we simply FoK+CT and dont enter dance ? and if yes whats the number of targets we give up dance on. Also since my main spec is sub now, im thinking about offspec (i still think that assassination gonna do more dps on braken/twins not sure about tectus) , never tried combat is it better than assa dpswise ?

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Assassination is always second best. It's alright at everything but not great. Combat is much better for Tectus and Bracken

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