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Affliction is by far the best raid DPS spec?

14 replies to this topic Started by rooter, Jan 04 2013 06:53 PM
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Posted 04 January 2013 - 06:53 PM

#1
rooter
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I keep hearing this, but in my simple testing I never got the same results. So, I loaded up the simcraft application to see what I am doing wrong. Simcraft is giving me 79.5k DPS as destruction and 77.5k DPS as affliction. What gives? I am using the talents and glyphs recommended by this website. I checked out the simulations on Elitist Jerks and they are showing ~11% advantage for affliction. My armory http://us.battle.net...m/glargh/simple

Posted 04 January 2013 - 07:23 PM

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Zagam
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I ranked 4th in the world on Gara'jal at 125k DPS on normal difficulty while my friend played his similarly geared Arcane Mage and did 130k and ranked 125th. Fights are subjective to mechanics and the player's execution of mechanics and manipulating their playstyle to maximize damage. With that out of the way, I'll address your actual question. Don't listen to Simulationcraft. It's good for finding GENERAL stat weight values, but it is incredibly not useful for estimating DPS. I simulated at 102k and did 125k in terms of a real situation. That's a HUGE difference for a program that is supposed to simulate your maximum potential. I simulated last night as Demonlogy at 78k and did 91k. Simulationcraft can only model things on Patchwerk type fights, and even then you can outplay a computer program with a class so dynamic that changing things based on procs is how you maximize DPS. Affliction is better than all the other specs because you can prolong buffs with perfect use of snapshotting stats and Pandemic. In order to successfully use Simcraft to find your stat weights, you need to find your stat scales. Something sounds horribly wrong for you to sim 2k lower as Affliction...so wrong that I feel you had an input incorrect to generate such an outlying output. When modeling yourself for stat weights, make sure that you put on 10,000 iterations, go to the options tab and check the boxes for Intellect, Hit, Haste, Crit, and Mastery. Make sure you logged out in the exact reforging and spec that you want to simulate. Once you do that, log back into the game, change specs, change reforges appropriately, then log off. Reimport your character and repeat. If you do this, I can guarantee you that none of your figures will have Destruction coming out ahead of Affliction.

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 07:38 PM

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Gravyspasm
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My armory
http://us.battle.net...m/glargh/simple


(OP is short 600 haste)

edit:

possible solution to the short haste issue

Posted Image
  • removed reforges on Shoulder, wrist and hands.
  • changed waist full mastery gem to hybrid hit/haste gem (lightning)
this will put you UNDER hit by .08, but you will be just over the haste breakpoint of 4717

Edited by Gravyspasm, 04 January 2013 - 07:54 PM.

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 07:55 PM

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Don't listen to Simulationcraft. It's good for finding GENERAL stat weight values, but it is incredibly not useful for estimating DPS. Affliction is better than all the other specs because you can prolong buffs with perfect use of snapshotting stats and Pandemic.

In order to successfully use Simcraft to find your stat weights, you need to find your stat scales. Something sounds horribly wrong for you to sim 2k lower as Affliction...so wrong that I feel you had an input incorrect to generate such an outlying output. When modeling yourself for stat weights, make sure that you put on 10,000 iterations, go to the options tab and check the boxes for Intellect, Hit, Haste, Crit, and Mastery. Make sure you logged out in the exact reforging and spec that you want to simulate. Once you do that, log back into the game, change specs, change reforges appropriately, then log off. Reimport your character and repeat. If you do this, I can guarantee you that none of your figures will have Destruction coming out ahead of Affliction.


I know what Simcraft is. I want to know why mine doesn't pan out like everyone else, and only now. I have been doing it for years and always found the information to be useful. You use it to see if a stat or talent change is beneficial in general, not to see what your DPS will be in every situation. With my result being so off, something must be wrong.

I didn't input anything, I just imported from the Armory and hit simulate (10,000x). I tried again with clicking on the stat weights and got the same results 77570 vs 77572 DPS for affliction.



(OP is short 600 haste)


I wasn't sure what you were talking about, as the guide here doesn't say anything about it, only that mastery is valued more highly than haste. Then I found this awesome post: http://www.icy-veins...s/#entry5310��I will reforge and see if that fixes anything. Thank you!

Edited by rooter, 04 January 2013 - 08:50 PM.

Posted 04 January 2013 - 07:57 PM

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(OP is short 600 haste)

edit:

possible solution to the short haste issue

  • removed reforges on Shoulder, wrist and hands.
  • changed waist full mastery gem to hybrid hit/haste gem (lightning)
this will put you UNDER hit by .08, but you will be just over the haste breakpoint of 4717



You are awesome! Thanks!

Posted 04 January 2013 - 08:06 PM

#6
Gravyspasm
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You are awesome! Thanks!


nice and clean cheat sheet provided by one of the icy veins readers

http://www.totemspot.../entry.php?b=44

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 08:23 PM

#7
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Gravy is the king at using reforging to help you hit your stat budget. I wasn't trying to insult your Simcraft usage or knowledge...I'm just in quite a bit of disbelief that Destro came out higher than Affliction as I've now thoroughly played all three specs in T14 and found it to be Aff > Demo > Destruction. I have no idea why your values are coming out that way, though.

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 04:50 PM

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Thanks for all the help guys, but I'm getting the exact same results, even after reforging for the extra 600 haste. See for yourself...

Affliction 77525 DPS
Destruction 79470 DPS

In previous expansions, I would think that I had picked the wrong talents or glyphs, but those are pretty hard to screw up these days. I must be doing something wrong, but I can't figure out what it is.

Edited by rooter, 05 January 2013 - 09:14 PM.

Posted 05 January 2013 - 08:35 PM

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I notice you have the Glyph of Everlasting Affliction for your Affliction spec and I don't think that glyph is really recommended. If that's the case you may notice a dps increase if you drop that glyph for something else. Just my observation, but perhaps it'll push Affliction past Destruction.

Posted 05 January 2013 - 08:51 PM

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Gravyspasm
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Thanks for all the help guys, but I'm getting the exact same results, even after reforging for the extra 600 haste. See for yourself...

Destruction 79470 DPS
Affliction 77525 DPS

In previous expansions, I would think that I had picked the wrong talents or glyphs, but those are pretty hard to screw up these days. I must be doing something wrong, but I can't figure out what it is.


your links are reversed for their titles, fyi

“I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.” - Bill Hicks

Previously a.k.a Augos @ Deathwing/Ravenholdt/Shadowsong/Garrosh/Turalyon servers.

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 09:59 PM

#11
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I notice you have the Glyph of Everlasting Affliction for your Affliction spec and I don't think that glyph is really recommended. If that's the case you may notice a dps increase if you drop that glyph for something else.

Just my observation, but perhaps it'll push Affliction past Destruction.


Fixed! 85293 DPS simmed as affliction now! Thank you so much! I was using the glyphs suggested in the Icy Veins affliction guide. It should probably be updated.


your links are reversed for their titles, fyi


Fixed, thanks.

Posted 06 January 2013 - 12:14 AM

#12
Gravyspasm
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Fixed! 85293 DPS simmed as affliction now! Thank you so much! I was using the glyphs suggested in the Icy Veins affliction guide. It should probably be updated.


Posted Image Glyph of Everlasting Affliction increases the duration of Posted Image Agony and Posted Image Corruption, 2 DoTs you will be extensively using, by 50% but reduces their damage by 20%. On most single-target fights, this will end up being a DPS loss. On multiple target fights, where you need to keep changing targets, this will most likely be a DPS gain.


emphasis mine.

So since you were running your sim as Patchwerk, that is why you saw lower numbers

Edited by Gravyspasm, 06 January 2013 - 12:17 AM.

“I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.” - Bill Hicks

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 04:53 PM

#13
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emphasis mine.

So since you were running your sim as Patchwerk, that is why you saw lower numbers


Sorry, I should have been more clear. I believe it was removing the Soul Swap glyph that was the major DPS gain.

Posted 12 January 2013 - 01:43 AM

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Affliction 77525 DPS
Destruction 79470 DPS

Your Destruction DPS is also low because you are running Glyph of Dark Soul. And while it makes no difference to DPS, you are running Minor Glyph of Health Funnel and Grim Sacrifice.

Edited by Incendax, 12 January 2013 - 01:44 AM.

Posted 12 January 2013 - 04:46 PM

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Your Destruction DPS is also low because you are running Glyph of Dark Soul. And while it makes no difference to DPS, you are running Minor Glyph of Health Funnel and Grim Sacrifice.


It was only 800DPS, but it was an increase. Thanks!

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