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Nobleshield

New Warlock with some questions about Destruction

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I have recently been leveling a Warlock for a change of play (I have only been plate DPS/Tank) and I am loving it. I'm currently level 87 and using Destruction, with Affliction as my offspec.

There's a few things I'm still getting used to with Destruction, so I'm wondering if some more experienced master Warlocks can help out an acolyte in the dark arts:

1) On a pull should I open with 2x Conflagrates, or alternate Conflagrates with Incinerates (i.e. Conflag, Incin x3, Conflag, Incin x3) after I put up Immolate?

2) I understand that I don't want to use Chaos Bolt with 3+ stacks of Backdraft. Does this mean that 0-2 stacks are okay to use Chaos Bolt if:

a) I'm at > 3 Embers

B) I have some kind of proc and/or Dark Soul

and then go back to using Conflagrate + Incinerate while keeping Immolate up? Is it okay to use Chaos Bolt WITHOUT any procs or Dark Soul if I have more than 3 embers? Also on that note sometimes I find myself near or even at 4 embers after a fight (especially if I killed something with Shadowburn in a 5-man) when the next fight starts. In a case like this should I pop Dark Soul (if up), Immolate and then immediately fire off a Chaos Bolt (or two.. or three...) to avoid capping embers before going into Conflagrate + Incinerate?

3) When should I normally pop Dark Soul? Should I use it at the start of the pull before I put Immolate up (so it gets the bonus crit), or after 2x Conflags, or when (and on that note Immolate should be refreshed just before DS falls off so it keeps the higher chance?)? Should it be used on cooldown pretty much (and on that note should it be saved for Heroism/Lust/Warp if I know that's coming?)

4) Being a newbie I don't quite get the benefit (or lack thereof) of using Grimoire of Supremacy versus the others. I've been using Supremacy thus far, should I use Sacrifice instead? Is it dependent on the fight?

5) When should I use my Doomguard/Terrorguard? At the start of the fight or wait for a burn phase and unleash him then so he does more damage?

6) Does Demonic Gateway replace Demonic Circle+DC: Teleport, or are they two different things?

7) In regards to Shadowburn, when it's available does it get spammed (in between in between Incin/Conflag/Immo) or does it get treated like Chaos bolt (e.g. only when > 3 embers and/or with a proc or Dark Soul)

8) In the scenario of a boss with an add/adds, I would put Havoc on the boss when an add is low health so I can cleave Shadowburns into the boss, yes? Is Havoc not worth using with other abilities then? In a case of a boss and one or two adds should I just toss an Immolate on all of them and keep it up as much as possible while single-targeting the boss?

9) To avoid having two sets of gear (if that's even a bad idea?) should I focus on Mastery/Haste when I hit 90 and start gearing up since it seems like those two stats are equal to both Affliction and Destruction?

Thanks for any assistance, fellow dark followers :)

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1. U usually wanna open with Darksoul + trinks and potion. For this reason u wanna do as much burst as u can, cast immolate, chaos bolt, 2 conflagrate and burn of 6 incinerate and u should get another chaos bolt in after that as well.

2. Yes, its ok to use Chaos bolt with 0-2 charges of backdraft. You should avoid cappin on embers so use chaos bolt to avoid this, too mana will prob force you to do this to be able to cast without stopping. Its allways prefered to use chaos bolt with some procs, but its better to use a chaos bolt without than capping on ember and wasting incoming embers after that.

3.You should pop Dark soul at start, unless theres a hero or burst face coming very close to the start of a fight such as Jin'rokh. From here on you wanna keep it on CD, this can be delayed to match other CDs and burstfaces of an encounter.

4. The different Grimoire's are pretty close in numbers right now, but as sims calculates right now, Grimoire of Sup is better, but only slightly. This is becouse you pets benefit from haste, but the pets dosnt get any benefit from mastery unless you're demonology. For AoE Grimoire of Sac passes Sup and will be the defult choise.

5. You normaly wanna use Terrorguard/Doomguard when it can benefit from the most dmg increasing effects, Hero dosnt affect this as he will cast a spesific amount of bolts no matter how much haste u have.

6. They are separete spells and can be used at the same time and does not share CDs or anything.

7. You use it like a chaos bolt.

8. In a bossfight with serveral bosses you wanna use Havoc on CD and use it with a Chaos bolt or Shadowburn if its late in the fight or 1 mob is lower on health than the others. If there adds you deff wanna put Havoc on the boss and use 3 Shadowburns on the low heathed add. For the scenario with 1-3 adds you should only apply rain of fire above them and continue with normal rotation, with more frequent use of chaos bolt form the extra embers u get from Rain of fire.

9. If you wanna have a set of gear for both affi and destro you can go for mastery and haste, yes. It wont give you the maximized dps, but the difference isnt to huge unless you're in a really progression-focused guild.

Some of the info in this might not be 100% accurate, but this is how i play destro and i've been pulling quite some good numbers and i'm currently my guilds no 1 dps.

- Horcored

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1- I usually pull with DS+prepot, so the first thing I do is 2x Conflagrate, so I get all my procs up (Don't have a RPPM trinket yet), then I cast Immolate+RoF and last, I start CB spamming.

2-Yeah, you don't want to cast CB at 3+ stacks so you don't consume Backdraft, at 0-2 is OK to cast CB.

3-You should use it at the start, and then use it on CD unless you know a BL/Hero/TW is coming soon.

4-There are some fights where you'll want to swap grimoires with sac (Jin'Rokh, Ji'kun, Durumu if your tanks are slowpokes...)

5- When most of your procs are up, this said, it's usually at the beginning of the fight.

6- Demonic Gateway will be used by your fellow raid members, you'll have to stick with good ol' Demonic Circle.

7- If you won't get CDs/ Procs before the boss is dead, spam SB, if not, give it CB treatment, only to spam it when you're with DS up.

8- If you can score 2-3 shadowburns with a havoc, it's definitely worth it. If not, you can stick with havoc'ing CBs. Anyway, you should use a mouseover macro for havoc.

9- It's not a bad idea, maybe you won't get the most dps, but you'll be able to perform well in most situations. But, you know, Aff isn't that good until you get RPPM trinkets and the legendary meta, so I wouldn't bother.

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Just commenting on a few:

1. Opener changes widely between player. Even the top locks don't really have one 'set' opener. I know my friend shooby likes to pop DS asap on the pull after a precast immolate/prepot. I, on the other hand, like to prepot/precast immolate, 2 conflags/dump 6 incinerates, DS, CB spam. Any way you shake the dice there isn't one *absolute* way to run the opener, as long as delaying DS by ~10 seconds won't make you lose one later in the fight (popping it right before the boss dies, or something).

3. Its fight dependent, pick the period of time where it will do the most damage. On jikun, as an example, I do nests, which means I get a 100% damage buff at certain parts of the fight.

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3. Its fight dependent, pick the period of time where it will do the most damage. On jikun, as an example, I do nests, which means I get a 100% damage buff at certain parts of the fight.

You like those 1.3M Chaos Bolts, too?

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You like those 1.3M Chaos Bolts, too?

My record is actually 1.68mil, not to brag, but I'm bragging :3.

OOOOOH also wanted to mention grimoire of sacrifice, it isn't on aoe that it wins, its on cleave. In aoe it actually loses because FaB gets 0 benefit from it, making pets ~25k or w/e ahead at anything over 4 targets. But, there aren't many cases this tier (jikun nest, lightning balls on lei shen, heroic meg/durumu/twin consorts, heroic horridon...off the top of my head) where you actually ever get to use FaB that much.

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Yeah. You must have had all the right CDs line up. Unfortunately, getting of an Unerring Chaos Bolt during Primal Nutrient buff is a long shot for me since I'm on the alpha team nest. Worse is that my other trinket is still the valor trinket :(

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I don't like how some people say to never use CB with 3+ stacks of Backdraft. If all your CD's are about to wear off and the only way you can squeeze another CB in before they expire is to use 3 BD charges, I'll do it. Every opener is different:

How many bonus embers did I get?

Did all my trinkets proc simultaneously or are they scattered?

Why do dogs in Russia use the Subway?

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I don't like how some people say to never use CB with 3+ stacks of Backdraft. If all your CD's are about to wear off and the only way you can squeeze another CB in before they expire is to use 3 BD charges, I'll do it. Every opener is different:

How many bonus embers did I get?

Did all my trinkets proc simultaneously or are they scattered?

Why do dogs in Russia use the Subway?

The only case, in simc, where dumping w/ 3 stacks is unerring vision CB. Everything else can usually be done in a way that you prioritize not capping conflag, then doing a single incinerate, and whatever proc was up still lets you get the chaos bolt off. Usually, at most, you only lose 2 gcds, so if the buff will last longer than 2 + CB cast time, you're golden. Unerring is the extreme version of this, 100% damage, 4 second window, you've got to IMMEDIATELY react and cast the chaos bolt. If that means you lose stacks, then whogivesahoot. 1 Free chaos bolt worth of damage > more incinerates.

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I don't know, getting just enough embers towards the end of a Wush seems like a good use to me, especially if you have anything else going.

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a fully stacked Wush is almost as good as an Unerring proc, keep in mind it's not 100% more damage, it's around 70% because you have 30ish crit already and it doesn't increase crit by 100% but increases it TO 100%.

Edited by Vaelyn

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a fully stacked Wush is almost as good as an Unerring proc, keep in mind it's not 100% more damage, it's around 70% because you have 30ish crit already and it doesn't increase crit by 100% but increases it TO 100%.

No it adds 100%, its not restricted to the 103% 'cap.'

My stats raid buffed:

Crit - 22.09%

Mastery - 75.18%

SP - 36661

( 2163 + 225% SP ) * Mastery * Crit chance * 2 (crit factor) * 1.05 (raid debuff) * 1.03 (if you have 3% crit meta) = Chaos bolt damage

( 2163 + 2.25 * 36661 ) * 1.7518 * 1.2209 * 2 * 1.05 = 380200.0376499255 Base CB damage

( 2163 + 2.25 * 36661 ) * 1.7518 * 2.2209<=(122.09% crit) * 2 * 1.05 = 691609.6843449255 UVoLS CB damage

Yes, its not directly 100%, but its 82%, which blows every other proc we can get out of the freaking water, A PERFECT wushoolays being the closest acception:

15 Stack wushoolays heroic thunderforged - +15920 intellect

Crit - 29.02%

SP - 55968

( 2163 + 2.25 * 55968 ) * 1.7518 * 1.2902 * 2 * 1.05 = 607966.249305996

Breath/chayes heroic thunderforged - +8753 int

Crit - 25.9%

SP - 47276

( 2163 + 2.25 * 47276 ) * 1.7518 * 1.259 * 2 * 1.05 = 502684.34002668

Edited by gahddo
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