Jump to content
FORUMS
Damien

Outlaw Rogue 7.3

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Fofilolipop said:

One thing to note, is that Acrobatic Strikes increases the range of Blade Flurry and should not be completely ignored.

That's a good point, though I think the practical usages are still pretty slim. I'll make a notation for clarity though!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest outlaw
Quote

Saber Slash Icon Saber Slash is your main filler and Combo Point generator. It deals moderate damage and generates 1 Combo Point each time it strikes. It has a 45% chance to strike an additional time, which also procs Opportunity Icon Opportunity.

In-game it reads as this:

Quote

Saber Slash has a 35% chance to strike an additional time, making your next Pistol Shot free.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, Guest outlaw said:

In-game it reads as this:

 

Oops, I must have been using Swordmaster by accident when I wrote that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Friizz

Where does Between the Eyes find it's place in rotation?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Guest Friizz said:

Where does Between the Eyes find it's place in rotation?

Only used if you need to stun something.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, pday said:

Your guide for Outlaw Rogue does not resemble the one provided by Wowhead.

It looks like Wowhead's is talking about Legion, whereas we are talking about the 7.0 prepatch here

They also seem to do more of a breakdown and an explanation of what each ability does, rather than give a set rotation like we do

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Deeppurp
On 7/20/2016 at 9:22 AM, Furty said:

Only used if you need to stun something.

Even while crit buff is up?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Acrobatic Strikes imo is huge for Outlaw rogues aoe.  An extra 3 yards of cleave means you can cleave onto infernals on Manny without being in their aoe range and can hit almost every imp.  With most guilds not having the cohesion and team work as higher end guilds to make sure imps are all dropped with in an 8 yard radius means you lose out on a quarter of the imps unless you have a mass grip and even then thats every other pac.  The aoe potential, the main chunk of outlaw's job, lost by nerfing your aoe by 3 yards in all directions i don't think is outweighed by the mobility gained by the two other choices.  The 30 second leap while good in a clutch avoidance of death no matter how cool it is doesn't outweigh it.  Not to mention most fights other than maybe Hans and Franz won't have you dashing across screen more than every minute in which sprint can be used so the extra 15% doesn't seem to be worth it either.  Even single target it gives you that extra 3 yards of room to move out of something and not lose dps on the boss.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Muguin said:

Acrobatic Strikes imo is huge for Outlaw rogues aoe.  An extra 3 yards of cleave means you can cleave onto infernals on Manny without being in their aoe range and can hit almost every imp.  With most guilds not having the cohesion and team work as higher end guilds to make sure imps are all dropped with in an 8 yard radius means you lose out on a quarter of the imps unless you have a mass grip and even then thats every other pac.  The aoe potential, the main chunk of outlaw's job, lost by nerfing your aoe by 3 yards in all directions i don't think is outweighed by the mobility gained by the two other choices.  The 30 second leap while good in a clutch avoidance of death no matter how cool it is doesn't outweigh it.  Not to mention most fights other than maybe Hans and Franz won't have you dashing across screen more than every minute in which sprint can be used so the extra 15% doesn't seem to be worth it either.  Even single target it gives you that extra 3 yards of room to move out of something and not lose dps on the boss.  

Ultimately, on a tier of  talents like this, the choices are going to be very much based on personal preference.

While you are correct in saying that the extra cleave range is useful, Grappling Hook is at least as useful for instant travel to hit a priority add, avoid mechanics, or even just  to look cool as hell.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Muguin said:

Acrobatic Strikes imo is huge for Outlaw rogues aoe.  An extra 3 yards of cleave means you can cleave onto infernals on Manny without being in their aoe range and can hit almost every imp.  With most guilds not having the cohesion and team work as higher end guilds to make sure imps are all dropped with in an 8 yard radius means you lose out on a quarter of the imps unless you have a mass grip and even then thats every other pac.  The aoe potential, the main chunk of outlaw's job, lost by nerfing your aoe by 3 yards in all directions i don't think is outweighed by the mobility gained by the two other choices.  The 30 second leap while good in a clutch avoidance of death no matter how cool it is doesn't outweigh it.  Not to mention most fights other than maybe Hans and Franz won't have you dashing across screen more than every minute in which sprint can be used so the extra 15% doesn't seem to be worth it either.  Even single target it gives you that extra 3 yards of room to move out of something and not lose dps on the boss.  

If you feel your group isn't coordinated enough to ensure the targets are correctly stacked you can derive benefit from this talent. Ultimately though this tier is basically the old "Shadowstep vs. Burst of Speed" question, where most players felt that the playmaking, lifesaving, and general flexibility of step was much more useful. The same arguments apply to Grappling Hook, especially for progression. If your group isn't coordinated enough to properly stack adds on encounters, no one is forcing you to use Grappling Hook. That said, Acrobatic Strikes is most definitely an inferior talent and really only to be used if you absolutely need that extra range to compensate for a lack of stacking - certainly not something I'd recommend as a default choice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Phil

Wouldn't it be more appropriate to suggest using Adrenaline Rush with, say, two or more of the RtB buffs instead of specifically True Bearing?  I know the combination is good, but I just tried this on a dummy and rolled twelve times in a row before I got it and obviously that's not acceptable in a raid setting which people are coming here for advice on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Guest Phil said:

Wouldn't it be more appropriate to suggest using Adrenaline Rush with, say, two or more of the RtB buffs instead of specifically True Bearing?  I know the combination is good, but I just tried this on a dummy and rolled twelve times in a row before I got it and obviously that's not acceptable in a raid setting which people are coming here for advice on.

The cumulative probability of you not rolling True Bearing after 12 attempts is ~3.2%. You also have plenty of time in advance of Adrenaline Rush to prepare a True Bearing proc, and you only need to cover a 15-second window. Overall you're presenting a fairly unrealistic scenario, but were you to find yourself with 2-3 buffs and Adrenaline Rush off cooldown you should indeed immediately use your cooldown and try and maximize your damage inside of Adrenaline Rush. That said, it should also be known that for said situation to occur you would have made an error leading up to your Adrenaline Rush coming off cooldown which could have been avoided.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Phil

So my "error" was not rerolling it six times beforehand so I could... only need to reroll another six times afterwards?  :P 

Don't talk to be about cumulative probability in this game where i have spent 1000+ attempts trying to get the Raven Lord, a "five percent" drop from Anzu.  A cumulative probability that has 23 zeroes after the decimal place before you get to a number.  Eventually I just bought it from the BMAH.  You WILL get a bad run of rolls on progression, repeatedly, I guarantee it.

Also, while it's true that you only need a 1 CP RtB to "cover" the duration of AR, isn't the whole point of this fishing strategy to get maximum reduction on AR cooldown, which would require the full 55 seconds of Pandemic Deeper Strategy True Bearing?  If I had to pick 1CP buffs from Roll the Bones to maximize the effectiveness of AR during its actual uptime it would be probably a combination of Broadsides and Jolly Roger, and sharks would just be cake.  Then I'd hope to get a full duration True Bearing while it was on cooldown.

I also feel like overwriting a Buried Treasure in the now to get more AR in the future is a mistake, and would probably only do that if I could benefit from double trinket buffs under AR by doing so, so that's another edge case to work out.  Actually I think the whole concept is backwards.  you should make sure AR is on cooldown when you have True Bearing, not the other way around.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Guest Phil said:

So my "error" was not rerolling it six times beforehand so I could... only need to reroll another six times afterwards?  :P 

Don't talk to be about cumulative probability in this game where i have spent 1000+ attempts trying to get the Raven Lord, a "five percent" drop from Anzu.  A cumulative probability that has 23 zeroes after the decimal place before you get to a number.  Eventually I just bought it from the BMAH.  You WILL get a bad run of rolls on progression, repeatedly, I guarantee it.

Also, while it's true that you only need a 1 CP RtB to "cover" the duration of AR, isn't the whole point of this fishing strategy to get maximum reduction on AR cooldown, which would require the full 55 seconds of Pandemic Deeper Strategy True Bearing?  If I had to pick 1CP buffs from Roll the Bones to maximize the effectiveness of AR during its actual uptime it would be probably a combination of Broadsides and Jolly Roger, and sharks would just be cake.  Then I'd hope to get a full duration True Bearing while it was on cooldown.

I also feel like overwriting a Buried Treasure in the now to get more AR in the future is a mistake, and would probably only do that if I could benefit from double trinket buffs under AR by doing so, so that's another edge case to work out.  Actually I think the whole concept is backwards.  you should make sure AR is on cooldown when you have True Bearing, not the other way around.

Adrenaline Rush goes on cooldown the moment you use it, and as you get so many finishers off during that period it is the highest return on the True Bearing buff. As someone that has more progression experience than possibly anyone barring a literal handful, I can definitely agree that occasionally bad RNG can get you down. That doesn't mean you just completely forgo a high percentage chance at the most optimal style of play. If you go into an Adrenaline Rush with a 55-second True Bearing you actually stand a pretty good chance of having an Adrenaline Rush again by the time that buff expires.

In any case, your input is appreciated, and if you want to generate some discussion or compare numbers I recommend heading over to the forums!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was wondering whether or not it's worth it to cast Saber Slash when im at 5 combo points (using Deeper Strategem) because I have a fear that I might waste the extra combo point that Saber Slash will generate if it procs. And if i'm in the same situation with broadsides, what should I do?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, leapingshadow said:

I was wondering whether or not it's worth it to cast Saber Slash when im at 5 combo points (using Deeper Strategem) because I have a fear that I might waste the extra combo point that Saber Slash will generate if it procs. And if i'm in the same situation with broadsides, what should I do?

There is current some debate for all Rogue specs whether "always 6" or "5-6" is the ideal method of using finishers. What is known for certain is that the margin between these arguments is so extraordinarily small that it doesn't really matter what you do. Personally I usually do "5-6" when I have a True Bearing buff active because the CDR per Combo Point value is high enough that I feel bad wasting any CP. That said, as noted earlier, the difference in a sim is essentially negligible regardless of current buffs.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Between the Eyes

Actually..from what I've found out, if you Roll the Bones and get Shark Infested Waters(The 40% crit buff), Between the Eyes can be a quick burst damage attack. It's crits can hit harder than your Run Through when it crits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Guest Between the Eyes said:

Actually..from what I've found out, if you Roll the Bones and get Shark Infested Waters(The 40% crit buff), Between the Eyes can be a quick burst damage attack. It's crits can hit harder than your Run Through when it crits.

Firstly, if you *don't* crit your finisher will do 4x less damage, which is a big risk for damage consistency. Generally this trade off isn't worth it, especially when Critical Strike is your least valued stat (so even with SIW your criticals aren't even near guaranteed).

Secondly, for raiding rogues in HFC you have to account for BHTV, which increased your Run Through damage by enough that it absolutely decimates BTE, whether you crit or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great guide, very enlightening, exactly what I needed.

 

A nitpick: in "Spell Summary", there's an outdated line:

You will start every fight from Stealth Icon Stealth as your Tier 2 talent provides a damage benefit to using your abilities while Stealth Icon Stealth is active.

 

Should also probably mention that in the guide:

7 hours ago, Furty said:

There is current some debate for all Rogue specs whether "always 6" or "5-6" is the ideal method of using finishers. What is known for certain is that the margin between these arguments is so extraordinarily small that it doesn't really matter what you do. Personally I usually do "5-6" when I have a True Bearing buff active because the CDR per Combo Point value is high enough that I feel bad wasting any CP. That said, as noted earlier, the difference in a sim is essentially negligible regardless of current buffs.

 because I came looking in the comment section for that specific answer :P

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Iridar said:

 because I came looking in the comment section for that specific answer :P

Yeah, that's actually already been updated, just waiting for the changes to go live on the site :) Going to stipulate that in all three specialization guides!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Cylos
Quote
  • /target "Tank's Name"
  • /cast Tricks of the Trade
  • /targetlasttarget

/cast [target="Tanksname"] Tricks of the Trade

Is a more elegant solution

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If i'm using Vigor as my tier 3 talent choice, should I choose to go "always 5" or go "4-5"?

During my rotation, how many combo points should I spend on Roll the Bones and when should I refresh it?

Thanks again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Staff
      Check out the full Trading Post rotation for April! 
      Season 4 is now available for testing on the PTR and the servers are already updated with the April Trading Post rotation!

      Special Reward
      The special reward you'll get upon filling the Traveller's Log to 100% this month is a battle pet named Aura.

      Items Available in the Trading Post During April 2024

      Full Rotation


    • By Stan
      War Within Alpha should be just around the corner! When do we expect the latest expansion testing to start?
      If you've been keeping an eye on the World of Warcraft 2024 roadmap, you're likely excited about what's coming up! According to the roadmap, the War Within Alpha is expected to kick off sometime after Patch 10.2.6, which was released two weeks ago, and before the beginning of Season 4.

      Typically, a season lasts 22 weeks. Right now, we're in the 20th week of Season 3, with just about two weeks left. Let's break down the hypothetical timeline:
      Season 3 Week 20: Week of March 26 Season 3 Week 21: Week of April 2 Season 3 Week 22: Week of April 9 Season 4 Week 1: Week of April 15 This schedule suggests that the War Within Alpha could potentially launch as early as next week or during the week of April 9.
      The most recent news from the War Within camp came on March 27, when Blizzard rolled out a fresh encrypted internal build on the WoW Dev CDN. The internal builds are becoming more and more frequent which indicates Blizzard's ramping up to start testing in the very near future.
      Placeholder for tweet 1772901807448052151 In the meantime, we encourage you to check out everything coming in the War Within pre-patch that will release 1 month before the actual expansion.
    • By Staff
      Save up to 65% on pets and mounts during the spring sale that lasts through April 8. There's a Spring Supreme Pet Pack with 17 pets, and more!
      (Source)
      Spring showers bring April flowers, and new deals are blooming! Freshen up your collection and savor sweet savings during the World of Warcraft® Spring Sale through April 8.1
      The Spring Supreme Pet Pack2 is raining cats, dogs, and more! Throw an adorable pet party by inviting all 17 World of Warcraft pets in the Battle.net® shop to your collection for up to 65% off!
      Alterac Brew-Pup Anima Wyrmling Argi Blinky Blossoming Ancient Brightpaw Cinder Kitten Daisy Dread Hatchling Lil'Ragnaros Lil' Ursoc Lucky Quilen Cub Shadow Soul of the Aspects Twilight Whomper Murkastrasza If you already have one or more pets from The Spring Supreme Pet Pack, the pack's price will automatically adjust to reflect only the missing pets.
      Get Your Pets
      You can also swim through the skies atop the Wondrous Wavewhisker flying mount and command a pair of brutal beasts with The Mighty Kodo Pack—featuring the Armor Siege Kodo ground mount and Crushhoof pet—both are 50% off during the sale.
      1Offers end on April 8, 2024. Mounts, pets, and packs listed are not available in WoW Classic progression games.
      2Pet Bundle is only available on the webshop, not the in-game store.
    • By Staff
      Executive Producer Holly Longdale teased some upcoming experimental PvE-focused content that Blizzard will soon reveal to the community.
      It appears that Plunderstorm isn't the only new mode Blizzard plans to add to WoW this year.
      Holly Longdale today teased an upcoming PvE-oriented event that will soon be revealed to us. Holly might be talking about the "Timerunning Pandamonium," expected in Patch 10.2.7.
      (Source)
      Greetings Citizens of Azeroth,
      It’s been great seeing so many players taking the plunge into Plunderstorm and we’ve loved seeing all of the stories and feedback as this experimental event evolves. It will be exciting to see some of the community content creators going head-to-head as duos during the Plunderstorm Creator Royale on March 30!  This isn’t the end of the things we want to try in World of Warcraft, however, and we have more in store we can’t wait to show you.
      Dragonflight Season 4 is in route as testing begins on the PTR and we’ll have more news to share soon™ on the next experiment we have up our sleeves. We hope those of you who are looking for PvE focused content will enjoy what we’re planning, all while we continue to press forward on development of our next expansion for World of Warcraft— The War Within.
      We can’t wait to share with you all the many things the team has been hard at work on.
      With gratitude and excitement for what we’ll do together next,
      Holly Longdale
    • By Stan
      Blizzard just pushed an encrypted Patch 10.2.7 build to the WoW Dev 3 CDN branch.
      WoW Dev 3 has been updated from 10.2.6.53840 to 10.2.7.53954. The build is encrypted and we can't datamine it.
      Placeholder for tweet 1773384989314298365 13 days ago, we saw the very first encrypted Patch 10.2.7 build on a different branch (WoW Vendor 2).
      Placeholder for tweet 1768106695425700174 According to the 2024 roadmap, Patch 10.2.7, dubbed Dark Heart, is set to introduce new features such as Timerunning Pandamonium, Harbinger Quests, Troll & Draenei Heritage Armor, and a new holiday event.

×
×
  • Create New...