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Amanitou

What's the deal with DK tier gear?

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This is something of a philosophical question/rant, but I feel it needs to be asked. Looking over tier gear for DKs from Legion's first raid, I can't help but notice that there's more than piece that gives versatility - something of a garbage stat for the spec (correct me if I'm wrong here). Obviously none of us can read Blizz's mind on the subject, but I can't help but wonder why this is ? The stats are not randomised, after all, and it seems to serve no purpose other than to frustrate...

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3 hours ago, Amanitou said:

This is something of a philosophical question/rant, but I feel it needs to be asked. Looking over tier gear for DKs from Legion's first raid, I can't help but notice that there's more than piece that gives versatility - something of a garbage stat for the spec (correct me if I'm wrong here). Obviously none of us can read Blizz's mind on the subject, but I can't help but wonder why this is ? The stats are not randomised, after all, and it seems to serve no purpose other than to frustrate...

First tier is usually kind of meh, its a trend that has been going on. The other purpose is a desired change on blizz's part. They felt the HFC trinkets were too strong and tier gear was too powerful. Tier gear would completely change rotations and a single piece could cause 20k dps increases. They didn't like the sudden power spikes and that, so they reduced how strong tier will be. I think this is just another step in that direction. Even if you check the set bonuses, aside from a couple none are particularly powerful. They will be beneficial yes, but no longer will they grant you obscene increases.

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It's possible that this is also them trying to account for the fact that obtaining those BiS tier pieces (Socket, WF etc.) was a huge P.I.T.A in WoD. Perhaps they're trying to make a socket actually mean something on a non-tier piece of gear, rather than just being thrown aside when you have tier already.

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Quoted directly from WoWhead:
 

Set Bonuses

Wearing more pieces of this set will convey bonuses to your character.

 

 

(EDIT: speaking for Unholy here) In theory, the 4-piece set bonus sounds great; but in practice, how much is it going to mess up stacking wounds before casting Apocalypse? I know I like to squeeze off as many Death Coils in place of Scourge Strikes to keep my DPS up while stacking. Seems to me we'll either be purposely avoiding this set bonus or getting potentially stuck doing nothing but auto attacks and Festering Strikes for a few GCDs...

Edited by Amanitou

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Definitely has the potential to swap up the rotation, and perhaps not in a good way

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The four set does make me vomit my face out, especially if i consider augmented rotations. What it ultimately means is the value of crit and castigator just sky rockets and frankly I think Infected Claws will be the superior talent come the four set. Just simply because you are going to be bursting so many wounds you need help reapplying them. Even then the instructors fourth legendary adds another hiccup because you will be bursting EVEN MORE wounds. Even then, once order hall is fully upgraded you can equip another legendary, I think with the four set  inv_jewelry_ring_121.gif Uvanimor, the Unbeautiful will be the chosen one. Simply because festering strike is so expensive, you need the rune flow.

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2 hours ago, demonardvark said:

The four set does make me vomit my face out, especially if i consider augmented rotations. What it ultimately means is the value of crit and castigator just sky rockets and frankly I think Infected Claws will be the superior talent come the four set. Just simply because you are going to be bursting so many wounds you need help reapplying them. Even then the instructors fourth legendary adds another hiccup because you will be bursting EVEN MORE wounds. Even then, once order hall is fully upgraded you can equip another legendary, I think with the four set  inv_jewelry_ring_121.gif Uvanimor, the Unbeautiful will be the chosen one. Simply because festering strike is so expensive, you need the rune flow.

The way I see it, our rotation will probably move more and more towards Festering Strikes over Scourge Strike as the expansion progress. We will have to use more festering, because we burst wounds faster. DPS will go up, but it may mean more downtime where we have to let runes regen.

Edited by Zulgh

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Demon, what you say makes sense, but what about those of us who still don't have a single legendary, let alone two? As it is, I'm pretty sure I'll have the tier gear down long before an orange drops for me. What am I and others who haven't been blessed by RNGesus to do?

 

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I feel like this gear was meant as a bandaid for people who complained that they were feeling rune starved as unholy. It kind of sucks for those of us who have learned to space out our resources so this is no longer a problem. At least it will smooth out the rotation if you somehow get TERRIBLE runic corruption/festering strike rng (we've all been there). It also sort of pushes the dark arbiter playstyle more, which is a shame because I LIKE having to prepare for soul reaper.

 What I predict with these bonuses is a state where unholy will be drowning in resources while simultaneously being unable to efficiently spend them.

Edited by Tcsjazzer

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1 hour ago, Amanitou said:

Demon, what you say makes sense, but what about those of us who still don't have a single legendary, let alone two? As it is, I'm pretty sure I'll have the tier gear down long before an orange drops for me. What am I and others who haven't been blessed by RNGesus to do?

 

Emerald Nightmare is not tuned to expect anyone to have legendaries while nighthold assume ones. The order hall final advancement allows one to equip a 2nd legendary. Nighthold will likely launch around feb or march, so its more than likely to be expected that most players will have that part completed. As far as the tier set goes, I wasn't saying the legendaries help it but make the ideal rotation that much harder to figure out. So, lacking instructors fourth makes the puzzle that much simpler. Possessing it more or less streamlines what that ideal 2nd legendary would be. 

However, zulgh although I do see your perspective, even with the 4 set I don't think we'll see dramatic numbers of festering strikes increasing. As the expansion goes on so does the gear and our stats for that matter. So,we'll see higher and higher levels of crit all but ensuring castigator will always be applying extra wounds for us (more or less). However, if one does have instructors fourth and the full tier set, then in that situation there will be many more festering strikes. Then again, and now we are assuming just amazing blessings from RNGesus, as fights progress, burst becomes more valuable, and we would not favor instructors as much instead valuing  inv_shoulder_plate_deathknight_m_01.gif Tak'theritrix's Shoulderpads instead. 

So, the four piece tier will certainly have an interesting impact on the rotation. How dramatic will come down to what legendaries you end up with (nighthold assumes one by march, so will I ). However, at a base line, guessing at values of crit, and changing up talents, the differences can be streamlined. So, more specifically to you aman, I would say simply changing from shadow infusion to infected claws and making sure to have Pestilent Pustules, that extra wound bursting at a fairly high rate, can be accounted for.

So, although yes, it does look like it could be difficult to rebuild rotations for, that's because everyone is thinking the current rotation and talent builds. By merely re-ordering or changing talents, we can certainly accommodate the the 4 set bonus into our rotation fairly easily. The basic opener would go completely unchanged even. So, not quite a daunting, just many variables and each one will demand slightly different rotation. However, take a trip over to our frost mage guide, there's little boxes you can click to show which talents you have and the rotation changes, the unholy guide will have the same thing. The likely layouts would possibly be a box for 4 set, boxesfor specific legendaries, and a box or two for specific talents :)

So do not fret too much, when the time comes we'll have everything ready :D

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I feel like blighted rune weapon will become a better talent with the extra runes becoming redundant with runic corruption procing more. Thoughts?

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1 minute ago, Tcsjazzer said:

I feel like blighted rune weapon will become a better talent with the extra runes becoming redundant with runic corruption procing more. Thoughts?

For shorter fights there is very strong potential, for longer fights, its CD is a tad bit long.

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