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Riverstyx

Assass raid DPS - What am I doing wrong?

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Posted (edited)

Hi guys.  I recently switched to Assass from Outlaw for raiding after getting fed up with Outlaw's reliance on RNG.  I'm liking the playstyle a lot, but I've run into some problems.  My DPS at my ilvl (857) is around 220k, which on Warcraftlogs is showing significantly lower than most others logged around that ilvl by anywhere from 40k to 100k, with some encounters like Cenarius showing far, far lower.  I'm posting parses from one of our recent EN runs to see if anyone can point out what I'm doing wrong.   

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BYnX4Db1hATQGwM8#fight=4&type=damage-done&source=13

Though it should be noted that I've since switched to an exsang build, which does seem to boost my DPS on target dummies a bit, but nowhere near the numbers I apparently should be getting according to simulationcraft and warcraftlogs.

 

Any assistance would be appreciated!

Edited by Riverstyx

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4 hours ago, Riverstyx said:

Hi guys.  I recently switched to Assass from Outlaw for raiding after getting fed up with Outlaw's reliance on RNG.  I'm liking the playstyle a lot, but I've run into some problems.  My DPS at my ilvl (857) is around 220k, which on Warcraftlogs is showing significantly lower than most others logged around that ilvl by anywhere from 40k to 100k, with some encounters like Cenarius showing far, far lower.  I'm posting parses from one of our recent EN runs to see if anyone can point out what I'm doing wrong.   

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BYnX4Db1hATQGwM8#fight=4&type=damage-done&source=13

Though it should be noted that I've since switched to an exsang build, which does seem to boost my DPS on target dummies a bit, but nowhere near the numbers I apparently should be getting according to simulationcraft and warcraftlogs.

 

Any assistance would be appreciated!

Big thing I'm noticing is that you didn't have cooldowns up for Lust. That's kind of a huge deal, and will drastically impact your parses.

I'm also noticing quite a bit of Energy capping - while you want to be sure that you're playing with relatively high energy, it isn't worth letting it cap. If you notice that you're running away for a mechanic and don't have much else to do, you should be throwing Poisoned Knives at the target - not only will it stop you from losing damage completely, but it will prevent you from dropping uptime on your poisons, which is pretty crucial especially since you're running Agonizing

Edit: while your uptimes weren't bad, if you aren't running Exsang your bleed uptimes should be pretty close to 100%. Rupture isn't too bad, but your Garrote is falling off

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Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, Carrn said:

Big thing I'm noticing is that you didn't have cooldowns up for Lust. That's kind of a huge deal, and will drastically impact your parses.

I'm also noticing quite a bit of Energy capping - while you want to be sure that you're playing with relatively high energy, it isn't worth letting it cap. If you notice that you're running away for a mechanic and don't have much else to do, you should be throwing Poisoned Knives at the target - not only will it stop you from losing damage completely, but it will prevent you from dropping uptime on your poisons, which is pretty crucial especially since you're running Agonizing

Edit: while your uptimes weren't bad, if you aren't running Exsang your bleed uptimes should be pretty close to 100%. Rupture isn't too bad, but your Garrote is falling off

Thanks.  My energy was capping during mechanics where I have to run away (in this case, the charge and the crap Ursoc leaves on the ground on heroic).  I'll be sure to use poison knife when closing in on a new target from now on.

That does remind me of another thing I wanted to ask though.  When should I be pooling energy?  How often, for what abilities, and to what amount?  Right now when I'm attacking, I'm just using the ability I need to when I have energy available for it.  I feel that could be hurting the potential DPS I get from Elaborate Planning since I usually end up energy starved for the follow up.

Thanks again

Edited by Riverstyx

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15 minutes ago, Riverstyx said:

Thanks.  My energy was capping during mechanics where I have to run away (in this case, the charge and the crap Ursoc leaves on the ground on heroic).  I'll be sure to use poison knife when closing in on a new target from now on.

That does remind me of another thing I wanted to ask though.  When should I be pooling energy?  How often, for what abilities, and to what amount?  Right now when I'm attacking, I'm just using the ability I need to when I have energy available for it.  I feel that could be hurting the potential DPS I get from Elaborate Planning since I usually end up energy starved for the follow up.

Thanks again

Yeah you can try and dump Energy before these mechanics come out as well. I realize that's a little harder, but any Energy you don't use is a loss of dps.

It's kind of a complicated question, but the general idea is "don't use a resource unless you have to". What that means is try to avoid using Energy unless you're going to cap, and try to avoid spending CPs unless you're capped. More specifically, you should be saving resources (CPs and Energy) to use them during the most appropriate times

For example:

  • You have 6CP, but Rupture doesn't need to be refreshed
  • You have 50 Energy.

You can cast Envenom right now if you like, but you won't have much to follow that up with. Instead, wait until you almost get to your cap, then use Envenom. What this allows you to do is to refill your CPs very quickly, and take advantage of your EP buff. If you're lucky and you STILL don't need to refresh Rupture, you might be able to get away with a second Envenom and keep your EP rolling for longer.

It's kind of a complicated system - I generally try and play around 60-70 Energy unless I need to drop it all before Vendetta or pool for something

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16 minutes ago, Carrn said:

Yeah you can try and dump Energy before these mechanics come out as well. I realize that's a little harder, but any Energy you don't use is a loss of dps.

It's kind of a complicated question, but the general idea is "don't use a resource unless you have to". What that means is try to avoid using Energy unless you're going to cap, and try to avoid spending CPs unless you're capped. More specifically, you should be saving resources (CPs and Energy) to use them during the most appropriate times

For example:

  • You have 6CP, but Rupture doesn't need to be refreshed
  • You have 50 Energy.

You can cast Envenom right now if you like, but you won't have much to follow that up with. Instead, wait until you almost get to your cap, then use Envenom. What this allows you to do is to refill your CPs very quickly, and take advantage of your EP buff. If you're lucky and you STILL don't need to refresh Rupture, you might be able to get away with a second Envenom and keep your EP rolling for longer.

It's kind of a complicated system - I generally try and play around 60-70 Energy unless I need to drop it all before Vendetta or pool for something

Okay, so just so I'm clear, once I get to 5-6CP I should wait until I'm almost at my energy cap before using any finishing moves at all unless Rupture is about to fall off, correct?

 

I'll do some target dummy practice tonight, but I think you've just helped me out a lot, thanks.

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2 minutes ago, Riverstyx said:

Okay, so just so I'm clear, once I get to 5-6CP I should wait until I'm almost at my energy cap before using any finishing moves at all unless Rupture is about to fall off, correct?

 

I'll do some target dummy practice tonight, but I think you've just helped me out a lot, thanks.

Basically, yeah. If you don't need to spend a resource, don't. Try and get all your damage out in sections where you have EP up. try not to override the time of the buff too much either, extend it for as long as your can

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On fights like ursoc, unless you have some really nazi officers/raid leader, you should be able to constant DPS, also while moving, so far there is no fights where its impossible to DPS at any point. So energy should never reach max!

I currently run with the AP build, even though I only sit at around 90% mastery, what I "learned" is the rotation seems to change with EP. My crit is around 44% and that makes it almost possible to maintain EP fulltime, instead of pulling energy, try to aim after using envenom as EP buff is gone, despite what energy you are at. That increased my DPS. And try to aim at Crit/Mast in everything, and go with the AP build, its the way forward. 

I also gamble a bit sometimes, when I know buffs are incoming, I try to refresh rupture trying to hit a 100% buff, I wouldnt recommend it though, unless you dont mind gambling your DPS a bit, but with a bit of luck it will be a amazing gain.

How far are you with Gold traits as well? They do make a pretty big deal, Bag of Tricks after buff is insane with AP.

 

 

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17 hours ago, Zipain said:

On fights like ursoc, unless you have some really nazi officers/raid leader, you should be able to constant DPS, also while moving, so far there is no fights where its impossible to DPS at any point. So energy should never reach max!

I currently run with the AP build, even though I only sit at around 90% mastery, what I "learned" is the rotation seems to change with EP. My crit is around 44% and that makes it almost possible to maintain EP fulltime, instead of pulling energy, try to aim after using envenom as EP buff is gone, despite what energy you are at. That increased my DPS. And try to aim at Crit/Mast in everything, and go with the AP build, its the way forward. 

I also gamble a bit sometimes, when I know buffs are incoming, I try to refresh rupture trying to hit a 100% buff, I wouldnt recommend it though, unless you dont mind gambling your DPS a bit, but with a bit of luck it will be a amazing gain.

How far are you with Gold traits as well? They do make a pretty big deal, Bag of Tricks after buff is insane with AP.

 

 

I'm currently at 2/3 gold traits, only missing the Vendetta DOT.

I've done further practicing and the pooling tip in particular has helped the most so far.  It turns out I was losing a crazy amount of DPS from not being able to properly follow up on EP procs.  Unfortunately I won't get much raid practice this week since RL obligations mean I have to miss my guild's EN run this week.

Edited by Riverstyx

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On 2016-10-11 at 3:11 AM, Riverstyx said:

I'm currently at 2/3 gold traits, only missing the Vendetta DOT.

I've done further practicing and the pooling tip in particular has helped the most so far.  It turns out I was losing a crazy amount of DPS from not being able to properly follow up on EP procs.  Unfortunately I won't get much raid practice this week since RL obligations mean I have to miss my guild's EN run this week.

Going to raid tomorrow on my assas rogue, I can post my logs here, last raid I had 290k dps was around 300k dps but dropped to 290k at the end. I was 854 - 856 ilvl.

 

EDIT: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/3bfkhaXzxARy6Ljc/#fight=19&type=damage-done&source=10

My logs form ursoc, Had 857 ilvl assas rogue. 

Edited by dannebre

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