Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

Multi-Target DPS with Priority Targets

9 posts in this topic

I've always been curious how this should be handled. As a healer I don't keep up with DPS theorycrafting too much other than to know rotations so spot when someone isn't doing what they should be.

However, my guild is currently stuck on Heroic Horridon and when comparing our logs other guilds, it seems like we're fairly low on the DPS numbers for a guild in Heroics. Our top DPS on Horridon is usually doing at max 150k and on average our DPS do about 130k. Comparing this to other guilds(even guilds on my server that we are ahead of in progression) that seems fairly low.

Now my reasoning behind this is that my guild focus fires down the big adds on every door before worrying about cleaning up the small adds. Basically that means next to no AoE minus AoE that is included in single target rotations and small amounts of actual AoE as we're cleaning up the smaller adds.

A good example of this in my opinion is that our Survival Hunter does about 140k on the fight fairly consistently compared to another hunter on server in about the same gear level doing over 200k.

So anyway, my question here is on a fight like Horridon where there are priority targets that need to die ASAP, should AoE rotations still be used? Or should the adds be burned down one by one?

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

im pretty sure aoe means "all objectives equal" so an aoe rotation for each class will do the most dps to as many targets as possible, but the dps to each single target will be slower. what you are talking about is a Cleave rotation, which sacrifices minimal single target dps to add splash damage to nearby monsters. most classes have an aoe, cleave, and single target rotation along with a "low max health" rotation for adds that will die fast.

any ranged class that has procs should be able to focus horridon and keep using him as a proc battery. they should also have a macro like this:


/target Direhorn Spirit

/cast <whatever>


the main thing is that the fight is non-stop, there is no downtime from the pull countdown to the end of the fight, there are always hostiles that need to die even if its just horridon himself.

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

The DPS for progressing guilds is around 150-170k during door phase. You can't compare kill logs to wipe logs. My dps is often around 180-190k (my guild already cleared that fight) during door phase and then it skyrockets to 250-260k at the end.

You need to understand the fight mechanics. With each doors smashed the boss gets 50% increased damage debuff. So the stronger your group (meaning you clear mobs faster and can have some time dpsing boss between doors) the higher your dps will be during whole encounter. Also the dps will go up at the end where there is only Horridon left with 200% debuff.

The basic idea is to kill priority target but also do some aoe dmg without sacrificing single target dps too much. Hunters should use single target rotation while using Multi shot instead of Arcane shot. This way you lose like 10% damage on focused target but get 25-40% more damage due to aoe. The focused targets need to die fast but in the end all the adds should.

2 people like this

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

There are many variable within the Horridon fight which can affect dps, let alone the dps themselves.

Raid composition is a major one at lower gear/skill levels (which is why many guild struggles with normal mode Horridon).

I haven't even attempted hrc Horridon so I can't give any advice but the advice Khalam gave above is pretty good. Especially the dps scaling on the fight.

The dmg horridon takes scales throughout, but if you have a competent group which just isn't getting the adds down with sufficient time to put some dps on Horridon before the next door, you wont notice any dps scaling until you get to the final phase.

Positioning can be a big factor in cleave/AoE dmg too, do you keep Horridon close enough to be cleaved with the adds? Do your tanks have the adds under control and gathered nicely for AoE or you have your melee chasing them all over the place? Is your raid clumped when possible for efficient AoE(and tanking) and Healing?

There is a lot more we could discuss but one thing I would be careful of is comparing players. "My hunter only does this but this hunter does that!" Not saying this was meant in any illmannered way but there are so many variables which need to be taken into consideration before any comparisons could be in any way viable.

If you want logs looking over, I know this forum has many players happy to take a look and critique shot percentages and uptimes, and most importantly, suggest viable and effective improvements.

Hope this is of some use. Xint.

1 person likes this

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just like with healing, AoE on stacked targets is very different from AoE on spread out targets, and most classes don't excel in the latter situation. We like to have everyone clump close to the right side of the door and slowly move towards the next one to avoid ground effects. If you have healers or hunters running around like chickens with their heads cut off, you're going to have adds everywhere and it hurts your DPS.

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Heroic Horridon is a blend of ST (assume cleave is actually ST) and AoE, but for the most part the more small adds that die before the Dinomancer drops the better. At all doors interupting the Dinomancer and knocking him down to 50% is a priority, ALONG with the following: Door 1 not a real concern as to AoE or ST dps. Door 2 has a different priority, while ST dps'ng the priests with someone who can interrupt you can still have some dps doing AoE as long as the first priest dies before 2 & 3 drop and they both die sometime shortly after the Dinomancer drops. Door 3, has door adds that can be ST dps'd by melee while ranged AoE the warlords and just as the Dinomancer drops they can all be gathered up and AoE'd or killed with some blend of AoE/ST. All this time getting the debuffs dropped/knocked off really helps your healers to not worry about people taking 120k damage ticks in addition to their regular damage. Not standing in stuff puts a smile on your healers too. By the time you get to the 4th door your group will have gotten the hang of it. Firecasters hurt. Again this goes to what was said before, you don't want to gather up all 3 bears and AoE them, you don't want all 3 shamans down at the same time. We tended to put the first bear on top of the first or second firecaster so they both went down together and the shaman should die about the time the Dinomancer drops, then switch to him, and then back to a single bear/shaman before the other. Watch for your group moving away from the door and ending up with 2 or 3 firecasters left standing together by the door. Your dps has to not concentrate on the meters and instead concentrate on the kill, at times they have to switch to ST and at others they can go back to AoE. All this time in between doors and cleaning up the adds you have to dps the boss, keep dots and diseases on him as much as possible. If the adds are close to the boss make sure your dps is spreading the love to make sure their dots and diseases are refreshed, one or two AoE strikes to do this will not make or break downing the adds but an extra few hundred thousand damage per dpser on the boss might. Unlike normal you can not ignore the boss until the end, and speaking of that when war-god drops be prepared for his third shout to sync up with a dire call and make sure everyone has cd's waiting for it. As mentioned above when you get to this last phase your raid dps will skyrocket 2-4 times what you had up to this point. When we had seen all the mechanics thru the 4th door we would wipe if anyone died before the forth door and did it again because for your first kill you are pretty much going to have to have all alive after the 4th door.

Edited by Amicitia

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

im pretty sure aoe means "all objectives equal"

Since when did they change it from Area of effect?

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

What he means is (i think), when you're truly AoEing, there isn't a priority amoung which are dying first, as they're all getting blasted down with your area of effect abilities/spells. When there is a priority to AoEing, it loses the AoE aspect and becomes more of a "hurt them all, but THIS ONE MUST DIE FIRST" which takes a few people out of AoE and makes them single target. Most melee due to the nature of their abilities.

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

What he means is (i think), when you're truly AoEing, there isn't a priority amoung which are dying first, as they're all getting blasted down with your area of effect abilities/spells. When there is a priority to AoEing, it loses the AoE aspect and becomes more of a "hurt them all, but THIS ONE MUST DIE FIRST" which takes a few people out of AoE and makes them single target. Most melee due to the nature of their abilities.

Melee will always do more DPS on one target in particular over others, because of their autoattacks. Some ranged also operate in a similar way, since they operate best by doing their single target rotation while weaving in AoE spells where they can fit them in. (Fire Mage for example)

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Greendexter
      <Should be Studying> is a 3-day raiding guild on Mal’Ganis US. We’ve been raiding as a group for years, starting in the Firelands. We’re currently looking for more raiders to bolster our roster as we head into Mythic EN.
      We are a guild that is concerned with making meaningful progression, but even more concerned with having fun and maintaining a low-pressure atmosphere. We don’t consider ourselves guildies or simply a raid group, we are all friends here. We respect each other while pushing everyone to get better individually as a player.
      We’re an adult guild, with most members being in their mid 20’s-30’s. Additionally, we are an international raid team. We have players from the US, Brazil, Turkey, and Australia. Don’t worry though, everyone speaks English! :)
      Current Progression: 7/7H EN
      Raid Times: Tue/Wed/Sun 7:30-10:30 CST (8:30 EST)
      We are looking for primarily ranged DPS at this time. All exceptional applicants are encouraged to contact us, but we are pretty full-up on melee, tanks, and healers!
      Specific class needs currently include:
      MM Hunter
      Shadow Priest
      Ele Shaman
      Mage (Lower Priority)
      If you’re interested in applying or just want to talk to us, please visit You’ll need to register for the site before you can view the forums.
      Alternatively, feel free to add Dexter#1725 or Vyndir#1769 if you have any questions.
      Thanks for reading!
    • By Adelynd
      Who We Are
      Lunae was created in early 2011 by a group of friends that have busy real lives with jobs and families.  We like to do things well but our families and friends come first.  We are looking for mature, fun, experienced, and skilled players who want to join a friendly raiding environment.  We offer a mature atmosphere that loves to raid more with the person than with a player and knows that in the end, real life is all that matters.  If you think this way then we may be the right guild for you.
      DPS and healer-prefer priest.
      Raid Schedule
      We raid Wednesday, Thursday and Sunday from 23:30-02:00
      EN-Normal 7/7 Heroic 2/7
      Our Expectations for Raiders
      Be at the raid entrance 15 minutes prior to start time when invites occur Attend at least 2/3 raids per week Have fully gemmed, enchanted, and repaired gear~have an in-depth knowledge of your class Regularly read the guild forums, read up/watch videos on boss tactics before the raid Have food, flasks and potions with you Have a headset and be able to not only listen but speak English. Applications
      When applying to Lunae remember that our only insight into who you are is based on what you write on the application form.  Please be thorough.  If accepted you will be considered a trial raider for a couple of weeks so the guild may evaluate your suitability for Lunae.  Apply at:
      If you would like to have more information about Lunae please leave a message or contact Adelynd#1667 in-game.
    • By Semifreddo
      Raiding guild looking for more raiders! We have a particular need of ranged DPS and a healer or two. Melee DPS are more than welcome if they have a tank off-specc. That helps with Mythic+ runs, if we have several tanks and groups going at the same time.

      Progression: 7/7N, 1/7H

      Raid Schedule: 20:00 Saturday and Sunday Server Time

      Communication: Discord Channel

      Interest: Message me on (Semifreddo#2224), or respond to this post with what class and specc you play.
    • By mischievous
      Cleared Heroic and Normal Emerald Nightmare in the first week of it's release.
      Classes Needed:
      Resto Shaman
      Resto Druid
      Balance Druid
      Shadow Priest
      Always looking for exceptional DPS of any class.

      About Us: 
      We are a guild, made up of former members of <Red Shift> and <Casually Addicted>, on Bleeding Hollow (PvP Server on a Chicago Datacenter) that have a common goal and will do what is necessary to achieve it. We are Shifty Casuals.
      We are a group of professional adults, who believe success in raiding doesn't correlate to number in days/hours you spend raiding. We are starting a fresh page within our guild history and sticking to a 3 day a week raid schedule.
      We don't tolerate elitism, bigotry, misogyny or any of the like. We enjoy our calm, adult environment and have no qualms with protecting it.
      We do loot council which is fair and distributes loot for the progression of the raid as a whole and not an individual player. No favoritism, no loot drama.
      We have our sights set on top 100 US for Legion and are looking for like-minded individuals to join our ranks.

      Raid Days and Times (All times in EST as that is our server time):
      · Tuesday 8:45pm-11:45pm
      · Wednesday 8:45pm-11:45pm
      · Thursday 8:45pm-11:45pm

      Who We Want:
      Since we are reforming and building for the expansion now is a great time to get in on the ground floor and clear content with us, while prepping for the new expansion. These are some key traits that we are looking for:
      · Someone who understands that 3 nights a week raiding means that you need to bring your A-game each and every night. Attendance is expected to be near 100%. By committing to raid, you are committing yourself to our raiding schedule.
      · The ability to perform under pressure. We only recruit impressive players, and spots are always competitive.
      · Extensive class knowledge of your class. (IE: Alpha/beta testing, keeping up with theorycrafting, properly gemmed/enchanted, always be up to date on the intricacies of your class (not solely your spec(s)) and on the utility of the entire raid group.)
      · A computer that can handle 20-30 man raiding and the ability to communicate via VOIP when needed. You must have a working headset and mic, and you must be prepared to use them. We will not read chat during boss fights. Inability to give a vocal response will not be tolerated as it directly hinders progression.
      · Tough skin. We're always looking to improve ourselves as should you. Constructive criticism is encouraged, but flaming and insulting is not tolerated whatsoever.

      If you have what it takes to be a part of this great team and community, feel free to apply at our website  If you have questions about the application process, contact any of the officers for additional information.

      Mischievous - Officer - giggles#1351
      Esurient - Co-GM - starvingsun#1436
      Amisti - Officer - amisti#1417
    • By zanpander
      so im 848 ilvl and in mythics i do around 150k-200k dps  but mostly on the low end  is this normal ? 
      rotation  the icy veins rotation 
      warcraft log ( im new to making logs so idk if i messed this up or not )