dllindsey

Sub Rogue PvE Dps

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I see that icy calls for sub rogues to gem haste>crit. but my question is why not reforge mastery>crit. yes we want haste but with mastery it increases the effectiveness of slice and dice therefore giving me more haste and since i have honor among thieves then my uptime of slice and dice is 100% active. anyone have any takes on this?

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Sub rogues are in a delicate situation with the secondary stats right now because they are all so close in EP weight. There are two nearly identical paths for reforging; you can go full crit or you can balance haste/mastery.

Load your character into shadowcraft.mmo-mumble.com for the best results. It recalculates stat weights as you reforge them.

While what you say about mastery makes sense logically, it's best to just follow the math.

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Not the OP's question but in order to save forum clutter (the title of this thread is very generic) I'm going to post it here.

 

I used shadowcraft and noticed it was showing it as a dps loss to NOT use shadow blades + shadow dance.

My gear is as follows http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/crushridge/kaelindra/advanced

 

Is this a glitch with shadowcraft or is it being serious, presuming that with shadow blades up I guess the extra CP is worth it during the SD evis/ambush spam?  I'm a little confused since conventional logic has it that stacking 100% armor pen abilities is a waste.

 

thanks.

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This is an interesting one, because while the conventional wisdom is correct, the opening Sub rotation presents a problem with this wisdom.

 

Shadow Blades causes your auto attacks to ignore armor and increases your combo point production.

Find Weakness causes all attacks to ignore armor.

 

So, the effectiveness of Shadow Blades is decreased due to the overlapping benefits of your auto attacks ignoring armor, but you still get the extra combo points. Ideally you want to avoid overlap, but you also want to use Shadow Blades as often and effectively as you can in a fight.

 

The problem arises when you consider the kind of uptime you can get on Find Weakness at the start of an encounter.

 

Open with Ambush+Subterfuge, 13 seconds of FW.

Shadow Dance, 18 seconds of FW.

Vanish+Glyph+Subterfuge, 15 seconds of FW.

Preparation+Vanish+Glyph+Subterfuge, 15 seconds of FW.

Got Assurance of Consequence? Shadow Dance is ready again.

Shadow Dance, 18 seconds of FW.

 

Now you finally have a gap in which to use Shadow Blades... almost 80 seconds into the fight.

 

I think it would be more effective to stack your Shadow Blades with your first Shadow Dance, then try to avoid stacking it with Find Weakness for the rest of the encounter. There are a lot more holes in your Find Weakness buff beyond the first 80 seconds in which to slip in Shadow Blades.

 

 

I can't speak to the functionality of Shadowcraft in this instance, but my explanation may be what they were working with. This effect gets especially pronounced once you have a double upgrade heroic Assurance of Consequence and you're Shadow Dancing like a maniac.

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Fair enough.  Yeah I have massive FW uptime at the beginning.  I suppose it would be a boost to just throw it in there while trinkets are up to get the most out of the evis spam and as you said, then stagger its use against SD.  I didn't think of it like that, thank you.

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You also have to think of the value of a couple of extra things.  Especially extra combo points leading to more Evis during FW.  If you go into a mid-fight Shadow Dance w/ 6-7 combo points and Shadow Blades, you can basically spam Ambush --> Evis the entire time.  You also have to factor in the fact that you want extra CDs (Synapse Springs, Agi Pots, Heroism/Bloodlust) with SD already, giving the extra CPs from SB even more value.

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