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Deadalious

Limitations of healing with default frames and no mouseovers.

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Hello,

 

I've recently joined a guild which has just begun raiding 10 man heroics, we only raid once a week for three to four hours so our time spent inside raid time must be optimised to a maximum.

 

We run three healers currently, a Resto Shaman/Holy Paladin and Disc priest with shadow offspec.

 

I have recently found out that our holy paladin does not use any healing addons for raid frames or mouseovers, he is purely using WoW raid frames and clicking and using heals;I am not very well in the know with healing at later stages in the game, my two alt healers I don't think I would ever be able to heal without using VuhDo frames.

 

I am continously reassured by him that this is a totally viable way of doing things and he is comfortable but I feel we may run into errors later on down the road due to reaction speed and the delay; keep in mind we also play with Australian ping (190-300).

 

Thank you.

 

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Full disclosure; I mainspec dps, and while I know how to heal and am called upon to do so with regularity (I healed my group's Lei Shen progression and kill, for example) I am by no means a fulltime competitive healer.  Further, the only addon I use to heal is WA (for tracking Lucidity), and I do not use mouseover macros.

 

Mouseover macros are great for a lot of people, but once you realize that you can queue stuff (click person to heal next while the current heal is midcast) the mouseover macros aren't actually saving you any time.  This is especially true given the extreme power of smart heals in the current environment.

 

UIs are very personal things.  What works for one person may not work for you, and what works for you may not work for him.  There's nothing wrong with suggesting someone try something new if they're struggling, but unless I'm mistaken what you're considering is basically an "intervention" to force him to do things differently, or be replaced.

 

There is, quite simply, exactly one factor that you should even think about when deciding what to do here.  It's the same question as you ask about any dps.

 

 

 

Can he do his job, both performing his role and executing encounter mechanics, to satisfaction?  If the answer is yes, that is the end of the discussion.

 

 

 

If he's as good as the other healers, even if you're having a healing problem the answer clearly is not "he should be using VuhDo and mouseovers" because the other healers are and aren't doing any better.  If he falls behind (regularly and repeatedly), then and only then should you step in and examine, together, ways for him to improve.  If you have to do that, UI should be one of many angles you look at, along with talents, stat priority, etc.  "Because it's different" does not automatically make it the source of your problem.  It might be, but don't assume that; find out!

 

I hope that helps, and I apologize if I undeservedly vented my ire at a related bad practice (that of kicking or benching dps because "shadow priests suck this patch" or "your talents are wrong" regardless of actual raid contribution).

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As a healer myself, yes. Healing without addons and the default raidframes is completely viable.

 

It gets tedious to look at, though, and addons are nothing more than a luxury.

 

 

Blizzard designed their UI with raiding in mind. Everything has been tested and has been approved to be viable enough for Heroic raiding at end-game.

 

I know several people that hate addons, and would rather just use 1 or 2 for managing their bags, but runs default UI the rest of the way, without falling behind.

Edited by Obscuras

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Having two healing alts, a disc priest and a holy pala with 9/14 and 5/14 heroic experience, I would also say that, unless his throughput is hindering you, his healing behaviour should nothing to be worried about unless he is a clicker^^(i.e. clicks on member in raidframes and then on the healing ability)
The built-in raid frame provides you with sufficient information to heal, dispell and gtfo. Unless you want to need to know how high that absorb is you put on someone(Shamans Iron Prison ;))...

From having 2 different healer alts with different playstyles, I learned that while mouseover macros can really help you with your playstyle and your overall reaction time(e.g. disc healing and smiting without having to switch target away from mobs), some heal styles like holy don´t need it that much or can actually work equally or better through, as SparkSovereign put it so nicely, queueing your heals.

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Personally, I don't know if I could heal without Vuhdo and an MMO mouse. I use way too many heals, utility spells and CD's to not have this crutch.

 

But like everyone has pointed out, to each his own. If he is doing his job well, then it shouldn't matter if he was letting his cat play for him. I have known many great players that play "odd", yet they are great at mechanics, dps/hps and survivability. 

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I agree with the posts above, though I strongly recommend he tries add-ons out. I don't agree with the mentality "Don't change anything until it falls apart" because then you're waiting for the accident to happen rather than preemptively fixing it.

 

I think he should consider downloading the popular healing addons and testing them individually in LFR to see what he prefers. He can prefer none, thats an acceptable choice, but I really doubt it will come to that if he spends a few weeks with them. These addons give you the power to track ANY debuff in existence, ANY buff in existence. You can see who is receiving benefit from defensive CDs, you can see what dangerous debuffs are on who, you can track your mastery bubbles to see if you should refresh them on important people, or track eternal flame to see who has/doesnt have it very easily.

 

Mouseovers vs non-mouseovers is an arguable topic. I personally couldn't heal without them, the second I started using them I understood the usefulness of not having to click. The issue your paladin friend will come to find though, is that with mouseovers you cant have click CDs on your bars without clicking your target first, which could be a mistake he makes. Theres good and bad for both forms of healings, so whichever he comes to prefer is best for him. In my 11/14H guild we have both types in our healing core.

 

The standard UI raid frames provide much more information than I know though. I haven't used them for healing, so they could be able to provide most of the benefits I've given to healing addons. The biggest thing though, is that an addon is moveable, resizable and completely editable. Blizzard UI has very few options. You can set up grid to be EXACTLY like the Blizzard UI frames, and then add useful information to it as well. I don't see any reason not to get grid in this case.

 

Of course, its all preference, so he should stick to how he heals best. But I seriously believe he should at least test some things out and see what he likes. I think it's probable that he will have issues at a high progression level (like, well into heroics), but I also believe there's a good chance he won't even know it's him. Healing issues tend to be a grey area of who's assignment failed, was it DPS standing in something or was it lack of heals. Was it a missed CD or was it healing being wasted on someone who doesn't need it, etc.

 

Don't force change upon him, but suggest to him that he should give some add-ons a try, but not during a raid. If he seems absolutely unwilling to because he thinks addons are a crutch, or because he's anti addons, then I believe you will have issues with him just on a personality level. Those unable to try something different will eventually bottle themselves into a messy scenario and cause themselves harm, its just a matter of when it will happen. If he's already tried other addons and just didn't find them useful, or decides to take your advice and test them out only to dislike them, then everything will be fine because they simply don't match his preferences on healing.

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I agree with the posts above, though I strongly recommend he tries add-ons out. I don't agree with the mentality "Don't change anything until it falls apart" because then you're waiting for the accident to happen rather than preemptively fixing it.

 

I think he should consider downloading the popular healing addons and testing them individually in LFR to see what he prefers. He can prefer none, thats an acceptable choice, but I really doubt it will come to that if he spends a few weeks with them. These addons give you the power to track ANY debuff in existence, ANY buff in existence. You can see who is receiving benefit from defensive CDs, you can see what dangerous debuffs are on who, you can track your mastery bubbles to see if you should refresh them on important people, or track eternal flame to see who has/doesnt have it very easily.

 

Mouseovers vs non-mouseovers is an arguable topic. I personally couldn't heal without them, the second I started using them I understood the usefulness of not having to click. The issue your paladin friend will come to find though, is that with mouseovers you cant have click CDs on your bars without clicking your target first, which could be a mistake he makes. Theres good and bad for both forms of healings, so whichever he comes to prefer is best for him. In my 11/14H guild we have both types in our healing core.

 

The standard UI raid frames provide much more information than I know though. I haven't used them for healing, so they could be able to provide most of the benefits I've given to healing addons. The biggest thing though, is that an addon is moveable, resizable and completely editable. Blizzard UI has very few options. You can set up grid to be EXACTLY like the Blizzard UI frames, and then add useful information to it as well. I don't see any reason not to get grid in this case.

 

Of course, its all preference, so he should stick to how he heals best. But I seriously believe he should at least test some things out and see what he likes. I think it's probable that he will have issues at a high progression level (like, well into heroics), but I also believe there's a good chance he won't even know it's him. Healing issues tend to be a grey area of who's assignment failed, was it DPS standing in something or was it lack of heals. Was it a missed CD or was it healing being wasted on someone who doesn't need it, etc.

 

Don't force change upon him, but suggest to him that he should give some add-ons a try, but not during a raid. If he seems absolutely unwilling to because he thinks addons are a crutch, or because he's anti addons, then I believe you will have issues with him just on a personality level. Those unable to try something different will eventually bottle themselves into a messy scenario and cause themselves harm, its just a matter of when it will happen. If he's already tried other addons and just didn't find them useful, or decides to take your advice and test them out only to dislike them, then everything will be fine because they simply don't match his preferences on healing.

 

Point the first: the modern default UI actually does track important buffs and debuffs pretty well these days.  I've never had trouble doing dispels with the default UI, although honestly the trick to dispels is "know when they're about to go out and pay attention" more than any UI setup.  The mana bars work fine too for keeping track of the other healers.  It's a lot better than it used to be; the only addon I'd consider truly essential for healing is a boss mod so you know when damage or dispels are going out.

 

Point the second: you have raised a valid issue with my initial reply, re: try things before excrement impacts the rotary air circulator.  I went a little overboard making sure to be on-message about "don't force it, UIs are very personal, performance is what matters" and I think you're absolutely right that it can't hurt to try various addons out of raid.  (Trying UI or control changes in raid tends to go hilariously wrong.  Use \ instead of / in a macro you wrote during raid once, and you'll remember to double check it from now until the end of time.)  Who knows, maybe he'll really love it and go from a good healer to an amazing one!  If he doesn't take to them, though, do not force it.  Suggesting (even authoritatively) that he at least give them a shot is one thing, demanding he use them is another entirely.

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