Stat weights for heroic resto

[MrMike 1]

Hello,

 

 

I was wondering what sim program do heroic resto shamans use to get their AMR stat weights?  I just got back into being a resto shaman, and part of being competitive is making sure I am maximizing my stats so that I can exceed the gear level I am at.

 

Originally, the lovely Stoove game me a set of stat weights months ago, but I was wondering if those changed to do the increase in ilvls and the potentiallity that mastery becomes more of a throughput stat than crit once you hit a certian stat point?

 

 

Any help on this would be appreciated.  My guild I am triling with is currently 12/14 heroic, and I'd like to be competitive with the other shaman I am trialing with, even though I am roughly 7 points of gear behind.

[Stoove 347]

MrMike actually asked a similar thing on Twitter, so I did my best to respond here and here. In short: no, Mastery and Crit don't really vary with stat level. The real influence on Crit vs. Mastery is mean health %, but that's not something we're able to analyse effectively right now. Most of the time these days, Crit>Mastery.

 

Haste, however, does get more interesting as you change ilvls.

 

There currently aren't any "proper" sims (i.e. Simcraft) for healers that I know of. You can write your own sim for narrow theorycraft purposes, or use a little Java app like HealCalc to do your own small analysis without messing around with formulae.

 

Stat weights are generated by deciding what you want to gear towards, and then setting the AMR weights so that AMR does that. Personally, I think that's far more interesting.

[Pandacho 286]

1. You get much more mastery together with a new gear, so still no need to reforge into it.

2. The only difference I noticed while moving to HMs and better gear - after the certain point haste is not so valuable as it was for me in Normals and I can use less Spirit.

3. My weights for HMs:

 

Intellect - 1

Spell Power - 0.75

Spirit (to 10500) - 0.65

Haste (to 8882) - 0.6

Crit - 0.55

Mastery - 0.4

 

You can use more or less Spirit, depends on amount you are comfortable with. In my opinion it have to be between 10-11K. Could be less, if you very good in managing your mana, but if you always OOM with 11K on non-progress fights, better to think what is not optimized rather then to add more Spirit.

I don't use low numbers (second stat weight) for Haste after my softcap - don't see it useful.

Edited June 4, 2014 by Pandacho

[Hybrys 199]

I'll usually set up rather similar to Pandacho, those are great weights for Heroics and SOO.

 

If you don't have a Disc Priest or Holy Pally, you might see some more significant value in Mastery, but it's power is currently overshadowed by blanket absorbs and cooldown stacking.  Expect that to get a LOT more interesting in WoD.

 

I also run around 9k Spirit instead of 10.5k, and with my crit build, I rarely have mana issues.  It will all depend on your comfort and trinkets. (More specifically, if you run Dysmorphic Samophlange of Discontinuity)

[Pandacho 286]

I agree about 9K Spirit for myself, but not sure whether we should advice for this number :)

[Stoove 347]

I must be weird, because I run 11k Spirit with the Samophlange. For progress, it seems to border on too much but (obviously) varies fight to fight. It was bare minimum on Malkorok Heroic.

[lynx 19]

I have to admit that Malk HC is tight on mana, but I found it ok with 10k (I use samophlange as well there). MTT on cd helps a lot, and using almost every magma recall is also needed to keep you throwing them GHWs almost non stop.

On malk I also spec into UF, because putting that ele down means one minute of no recalls (ends up in mana drained too fast). And besides, UF is quite good on this fight overall (arguably better than PE)

Edited June 4, 2014 by lynx

[MrMike 1]

MrMike actually asked a similar thing on Twitter

That is me.  I was asking more for others opinions and thoughts, which both matched and contrasted well with your data, giving me a clearer picture on stat weights.

[Hybrys 199]

I must be weird, because I run 11k Spirit with the Samophlange. For progress, it seems to border on too much but (obviously) varies fight to fight. It was bare minimum on Malkorok Heroic.

I used to flex based on encounter for progress/early kills.  Thok, I ran 7k (CH 3//3 crits are delicious), and on Malk I ran 10k.

 

Now that I'm in farm mode, I just run whatever, really.  Don't have my resto gear?  4k spirit and 180% mastery hooooooo!

[MrMike 1]

It's strange with AMR, cause when I put in the stat weights, I expect a spirit downgrade with a complete upgrade to crit...and yet, the whole reforge was to eek out another 7.5% mastery. :/

[dean771 3]

Did you set your spirit cap to a relitave or absolute value?

 

Now that I'm in farm mode, I just run whatever, really.  Don't have my resto gear?  4k spirit and 180% mastery hooooooo!

Its pretty fun, just grab a resto trinket and helm

[MrMike 1]

Did you set your spirit cap to a relitave or absolute value?

 

Its pretty fun, just grab a resto trinket and helm

I have it set to soft spirit cap.  Should it be absolute?

[Pandacho 286]

Spirit has to be in "Static Spirit" (thanks, Stoove) number.

Actually, I enter the Haste soft cap manually too. 

 

@Stoove and Hybrys: I run Malkorok HM with 10500 Spirit without Samophlange (don't have it). Use both MTT (twice) and mana pot (ah, so nice when it crits and gives me 200K of mana ). No totemic recalls (I'm not into it), switching between PE and EB. UF delays my "reaction" too much and makes me feel very uncomfortable. 

Edited June 5, 2014 by Pandacho

[MrMike 1]

Spirit has to be in absolute number.

Actually, I enter the Haste soft cap manually too. 

 

@Stoove and Hybrys: I run Malkorok HM with 10500 Spirit without Samophlange (don't have it). Use both MTT (twice) and mana pot (ah, so nice when it crits and gives me 200K of mana ). No totemic recalls (I'm not into it), switching between PE and EB. UF delays my "reaction" to much and makes me feel very uncomfortable. 

So I want to switch it to total effective spirit?

[Stoove 347]

So I want to switch it to total effective spirit?

 

I think the terms are getting a little confused here so let's use the terms which AMR uses;

• Static Spirit - The total amount of Spirit you have in-raid while buffed but excluding procs from trinkets or enchants.
• Total Effective Spirit - The average Spirit you will have in-raid including procs.

Normally when we talk about "11k Spirit" we mean "11k Static Spirit", so that's the box you want to check.

 

What I think Pandacho is talking about is the actual rating from stats on the stat weight page. Basically, the message is "don't let it pick a point for you".

[MrMike 1]

So like this, basically?

 

[Hybrys 199]

Yep!  That's exactly it.  I don't trust AMR to do trinket, LMG, and Recall gaming estimations, so I don't let it.

 

I would put 'Haste over 8882+' to 0.39 in your weighting, just so it doesn't do funky things trying to avoid it.

[MrMike 1]

Ok, great.  Next step in terms of stats for me is the best in slot list AMR gives me.  Which is funny, because if I look at it, it's a loss of crit, but a gain of mastery, which I was always under the belief that crit > mastery.

[Krazyito 521]

You should hit 'save' in Mr robot and show us what you're looking at.

For bis you should look at the total 'rating' of the stats and compare manually. The'loss/gain'values they provide are relative to your current gear.

Regardless, don't use their bis list, even with weights I find it not doing what I think is right. I can usually pick out one piece of gear and lock it in to get more stat that I want. Just use what you get, and plan for what you think is best.

(usually I found more passive haste leads to more overall of your other secondary, at least in druids)

[kitsu 55]

I like the helm from nazgrim and the elemental tier chest, but i get as much crit and mastery as i can and dont really have a lot of spirit.

[MrMike 1]

You should hit 'save' in Mr robot and show us what you're looking at.

For bis you should look at the total 'rating' of the stats and compare manually. The'loss/gain'values they provide are relative to your current gear.

Regardless, don't use their bis list, even with weights I find it not doing what I think is right. I can usually pick out one piece of gear and lock it in to get more stat that I want. Just use what you get, and plan for what you think is best.

(usually I found more passive haste leads to more overall of your other secondary, at least in druids)

That's what I've been seeing over the past 24 hours.  The BiS list that AMR list is nowhere near what top level shamans are going for.  In fact, most of them seem to be favoring a 50-60% mastery rating with a 38-43% crit rating.  They're just above the 8882 haste cap, but that tells me they just have some excess haste that they chose not to reforge out of.

[MrMike 1]

Oh, and this is the BiS list it gives me.  I have double checked multiple times and even done it on a second computer and it gives me the same result with the stat weights I put in, which are the stat weights from page one (which are very close to Stooves stat weights he sent me on twitter).

 

[Hybrys 199]

It seems like it's softcapping your Crit at 40%.

In the stat weight window, hit Advanced at the top, and set your Crit softcap to something like 60%.

You also need to open up the Settings window, and change 'BiS Upgrade Level' to +4.

[MrMike 1]

Oh, there we go.  Nothing I can do about more crit with my gear atm it seems.  Don't fully agree with some BiS stuff but it's making alot more sense now.