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PerfectDefect

Warlock DPS help

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Hey,

 

I think my DPS suck and that i should be doing way more then i do. I get lucky sometimes and some weeks are great, but overall i think i'm too low. 

Like this week, i scored a 434K on protectors but only got 306K on Malkorok.

 

Can you please give me some input to what i'm doing wrong? I have only been playing this game for 1,5 year and got into normal mode just 6 months ago or so but i know in theory what to do due to Zagams dps guide but i lack the skill to perform well enough. So please, can you look at my logs?

 

Logs: http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/YnXdpN6k8q9ZCvrc

 

Armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/defias-brotherhood/Perfectdefec/advanced

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For IJ, since you didn't link a malk kill.  

Graph of CB usage vs buffs.  Not bad, but could definitely be better.  You only got off one cb with your KTT proc in your opener, but you did use 3 when PBI finally decided to proc.  At around 1:30, you cast 3 cb, and only one of them was buffed, and that was by your 4pc.  During your second KTT proc you only cast 1 cb, and you cast 0 during you 3rd and 4th procs, which were back to back.  0 CB's during the second PBI proc, mostly due to you burning all your embers during DS right before.  Next; 81% uptime on immolate.  This should be much higher, but it looks like your group is sitting out the siege phase.  Expect to get yelled at by Zagam for this.  I suggest you get some WA's or TMW strings to track your procs and ICD's.  

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So I checked out Juggs logs since they are super easy to read.

 

Opener:

Starting at the opener, you really messed that one up.  Your PBI didn't proc until DS fell off and it's not entirely your fault but you didn't help it.  Your pull should not have a CB in the first 3 casts.  CoE, DS/On-use to buff Immolate and filler crit chance, double Conflag for quick embers and Backdraft, Incinerate spam to proc the four piece and then you spend those embers on two CB.  This is by far the best way to handle ST pulls because it gives you the best chance to get procs and unleash 2 CB's inside those procs.

 

Ability Usage:

Love Warcraft Logs, and you should as well.  The classic graph:

 

http://tinyurl.com/n4vmg37 (pretty sure it is showing up wrong but just click CB and SB and Incinerate to make the graph show up properly with just SB and CB if it's not)

 

CB usage is really not ideal and you are lining up DS poorly. We have already talked about the pull but you at least slightly recovered by using 3 CB in the PBI proc.  After that you actually unleashed 3 in a row for no reason that I can see.  No major buffs or boss phasing. I can't see your ember generation, but I can't imagine you had 3.5 going into that next KTT proc.  Because your opener was so weak, the ICD of PBI let up at the beginning of siege phase which is a rather large DPS loss since you had to pop a DS before siege phase unless you run back up. Then your last DS you popped right before the ICD of PBI, and unleashed 4 SB in a row so you were sitting on embers for a mad long time and prematurely popped DS as soon as you saw 20%. Remember, SB doesn't scale with crit so adding a crit mod does not mean you should dump all your embers.  Shit, nothing but death or procs ever means dump embers.

 

I think the main problems here are the opener which is easily fixable, using embers properly and never sitting on 4 of them (read up on Destro lock rotation priorities and how to use procs), and tracking the ICD of PBI which can even be done without addons if you use DS with it every time (which is generally true since it is a huge proc and they have a very similar CD).

 

Other smaller things:

You blew all your embers before the boss phased so that's a plus if your healers are good to go, but you didn't Immolate to maximize uptime on that. Speaking of Immolate, you snapshotted the 4pc a good amount of times but you should shoot for every time. You used Twilight Ward.  I don't know what it is lately and people freaking out from incoming damage, but Twilight Ward is for Shadow and Holy damage currently and it is on the GCD.  It's a DPS loss and I will never understand why people use it on fights without that damage.

 

Hope this helps you start to improve at least on this fight alone if nothing else.

Edited by Gnar

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Next; 81% uptime on immolate.  This should be much higher, but it looks like your group is sitting out the siege phase.

 

I checked my logs for back to when we sat around.  I was at 87% but our fight was shorter so that downtime hurt a lot more than if the fight was longer. Still, he definitely could have Immolated before he got shot back, 1.25min is way to long to go without casting it. Not terrible uptime on that fight but there is room for improvement.

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Thanks for your input, i will try and use DS with Expended mind in the future and find a way to easily track them both. Why i used 3 CB with no procs, i have no idea. I try and use CB only when i have some buffs or are maxed on embers.

 

Sad part in this story is that i have improved a lot the last 3 months or so when i got WeakAuras and configured it as i wanted it. Keeping track of CD:s and procs have helped a lot on my dps, but as you have seen, there is still lot of improvement to make.

 

So DS don't improve SB like it does with CB? That's a new one that i haven't heard of before. I will change my gameplay after that. 

 

On a second note, when i'm on Thok and kill the jailer with SB i don't get any embers back, why is that if i may ask?

 

Thanks again for your input!

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Unless you're moving a lot, I mean a lot, Kil'Jaeden's is a pretty big DPS loss.

 

Archimode's gives an extra 20 seconds of 30% crit. Using this you can coast Dark Soul CDs so that you usually have one in time for 4 full Embers to blast Chaos Bolts/Shadowburns at, or get Embers back up quickly. This is how I stayed competative on DPS charts with much lower gear than better geared players.

 

To make up for moving through phases, plan some smart Portal/Gate placements.

 

Granted this is under ideal cirumstances, I know sometimes you need to self heal or go out of rotation, switch targets, etc, but it still works pretty well I think.

 

Considering Kil'Jaeden's will be nerfed pretty hard in WoD I'm personally using Archimonde's in PvP to get used to not running and casting. We have the mana regeneration for Fel Flame spam anyways.

 

Edit: strategy

Edited by DeathwishArea52

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Unless you're moving a lot, I mean a lot, Kil'Jaeden's is a pretty big DPS loss.

 

 

Any heroic fight outside of Malk KJC is best. AD is only a small DPS gain even on Malk.

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Any heroic fight outside of Malk KJC is best. AD is only a small DPS gain even on Malk.

 

Really? I'm just wondering on what some rough numbers would be comparing the two. I never saw casting on the run that big of a deal compared to the crit CDs.

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Any heroic fight outside of Malk KJC is best. AD is only a small DPS gain even on Malk.

 

I don't agree with this.

 

Fallen protectors is entirely RNG and strategy based, either you can RoF on the move and personal port to the middle if you have Sun phasing or need to move from brew. 

 

Movement on Norushen is nullified by personal portals.

 

Movement on Gal is pretty irrelevant since you are rarely ever starving for embers and can heal yourself if healers can't without much lose and again RoF on the move.

 

Juggs is total RNG fest with what hits you but AD is still competitive in closer to ideal cases.

 

Shaman is VERY heavy in movement for the 6/4 strat and you should use KJC. For the backwards as fuck 2/8 strat I use, I have to move for tombs and that's it and I know when the next thing is coming so I can turret strategically.

 

Naz, wouldn't consider KJC with our kill speed. I'd rather shit on adds and him on the pull and then each berserker thereafter.

 

Malk is KJC for progression but after that AD wins.

Spoils has very little movement.  You move in between openings and for matter scramble.  It is also a fight that requires random periods of burst that you might not see coming (other side gives lots of sparks, you managed to get good/bad RNG and are moving faster/slower than usual so things don't line up perfectly).  And RoF is great there so cast it on the move.

 

Thok as a Warlock chilling by the gateway has almost no movement and you can personal port out of his way without a lose.

 

Siegecrafter is pretty heavy in movement but the amount depends on strat. I'm on belts so I need it, so I really can't say what is best but probably still KJC.

 

Edit: Formatting

Edited by Gnar

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RNG is why I take KJC, the removal of RNG as much as possible is always better then a small theoretical DPS gain. DS just isn't a super powerful CD for destro as it is for Aff or Demo. 

 

Also, you're looking at most of those fights as you would look at them as farm. Once you have fights on farm, the help we offer here is mostly irrelevant. You've either found what works or made it so what you do works. For progression at ilvls that were not over powering content, there is no fight that I took AD on outside of Malk. The chance to remove one more thing that I need to think about, making it so I don't have to worry about my gate randomly despawning, and being able to handle any mechanic without delay or though of DPS loss is far more powerful then my crummy crit buff.

 

On farm, with most fights lasting half or less what they took on progression, I could easily use AD on every fight if I wanted to and could likely push a little more DPS then if I took KJC. But the only reason for me to do that is to push ranks or go try hard on something, I rarely do that on farm.

 

Assume my answers are speaking of progression at low-mid ranged ilvl, not farming with almost BiS, and never trying for max ranks.

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I agree with the statement that KJC for progression and AD for farm, except a few fights like protectors where KJC is useless, and the last 3 bosses where movement is frequent enough to make KJC the default choice.

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Dark Soul isn't as potent as most think.  To contrast, the 4pc proc that you get once every 10-15 seconds is literally worth 50% of Dark Soul.  In fact, if you only worked with Dark Soul OR your 4pc proc, the 4pc proc would come ahead.  It's good - but an extra charge during longer fights isn't worth the amount of time you could spend moving while maintaing higher DPS.

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I agree entirely that KJC is the "test the waters" talent and best on some fights.  It is great for progression and won't hurt your group in any way.  But, that being said, using DS with full embers and procs is potent and worth taking to push ranks and crazy numbers which in effect helps kill speed.  Not necessary but not worth overlooking for those few that have fun with that aspect of WoW. We always talk about how on use is greater than passive on this forum in particular.  KJC is massively overpowered and the nerf in WoD was long overdue but I still believe AD is very strong and very potent if used properly.

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Dark Soul isn't as potent as most think.  To contrast, the 4pc proc that you get once every 10-15 seconds is literally worth 50% of Dark Soul.  In fact, if you only worked with Dark Soul OR your 4pc proc, the 4pc proc would come ahead.  It's good - but an extra charge during longer fights isn't worth the amount of time you could spend moving while maintaing higher DPS.

 

 

This right here.

 

DS for destro is NOT that strong. It's not a major CD, that's why we save DS to couple with PBI because DS itself is just not a super strong CD for destro like it is for aff and demo.

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Why would you sacrifice the ability to cast on the run in case shit happens just for a SINGLE 30%crit proc?

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Why would you sacrifice the ability to cast on the run in case shit happens just for a SINGLE 30%crit proc?

Because you don't need KJC on all fights.

Most bosses die in less than 4 minutes these days, and movement in these shortened fights is greatly reduced.

You also can be a scumbag and just plant your feet and live through mechanics, main one that comes to mind is stuff like Iron Juggernaut where you just don't move whatsoever except maybe for drills. P2 you can just pop a personal or two and again plant your feet and eat the cannon damage.

In these situations, lining up an extra Dark Soul with a trinket proc sub 20% can be the difference which gets you a top rank.

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It's clear there's a debate for KJC vs AD - what it comes down to is any players' ability to adapt to fight situations.  KJC is a clear winner for progression as you're getting used to position.  You can recover from mistakes and maintain DPS while moving around avoiding stuff.  This is the stuff we have to keep in mind is most beneficial.  There is still a very small percentage of players who have downed all 14 heroic bosses available - so we should all assume that any question asked is for progression, NOT for ranks/speed kills.  Once you have content on farm, you can play whatever the hell you want.  Sure, there may be a talent that is technically "better" but only marginally.  And does it REALLY matter once you have content on farm? 

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