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vaeevictiss

what the hell am i doing wrong

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so normally ive been the one thats always figured out how to get the best dps possible with my lock, ive been playing him since vanilla. Im at a loss now, and im hoping you guys will tell me its just my gear. Ive been following the rotation listed here to a "T" and ive got everything chanted and forged properly. I know im still using some junk pieces.

Ive done a few heroics now, and pretty much every one my dps has sucked...like under the tank sucked

here is my armory

http://us.battle.net...ictiss/advanced

ive been trying to follow the hit>mastery>haste order, and ive been maintaining dots and especially not letting CoA fall off. The only time i can pull above a tank is on single target. Now, ive never had the time to examine the other PUGs gear, so thats why im hoping its a gear issue and not me screwing something up.

EDIT: Forgot to say im pulling roughly 33-38k on single target fights. Im getting stomped by rogues, hunters, dks, pulling over 80.

thanks for any help.

Edited by vaeevictiss

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so normally ive been the one thats always figured out how to get the best dps possible with my lock, ive been playing him since vanilla. Im at a loss now, and im hoping you guys will tell me its just my gear. Ive been following the rotation listed here to a "T" and ive got everything chanted and forged properly. I know im still using some junk pieces.

Ive done a few heroics now, and pretty much every one my dps has sucked...like under the tank sucked

here is my armory

http://us.battle.net...ictiss/advanced

ive been trying to follow the hit>mastery>haste order, and ive been maintaining dots and especially not letting CoA fall off. The only time i can pull above a tank is on single target. Now, ive never had the time to examine the other PUGs gear, so thats why im hoping its a gear issue and not me screwing something up.

EDIT: Forgot to say im pulling roughly 33-38k on single target fights. Im getting stomped by rogues, hunters, dks, pulling over 80.

thanks for any help.

If you haven't noticed yet, tank DPS is pretty impressive. The top damage records on the first raid boss are Blood DKs and Protection Paladins. Their new vengeance reworking gives them absurdly high numbers when tanking, especially if they know how to work the mechanic in their favor (my guild's Blood DK does 80k on trash and 25-30k HPS). Never compare your DPS to anyone else...you only compare it to yourself and monitor improvements.

That said, your ilvl is 441. Continue gearing up...it will make a HUGE difference. The stat loss you took from leveling from 89-90 is quite significant. As you leveled, you actually grew weaker because the amount of secondary stats required to obtain 1% hit, crit, haste, or mastery was greatly increased leaving you weaker by the level. When you finally hit 90, you were actually weaker than you were at 85. My DPS was around 55k at lvl 85 and dropped to about 39-45k at lvl 90. Now it's up to 65-70k at 464 ilvl.

It appears you are using the Harvest Life talent. Don't. As Affliction, you'll never be using this spell. I prefer Dark Regeneration or Soul Leech. Both will increase your survival capabilities while not wasting your DPS on an AoE spell that's weaker than your other alternatives.

It appears you are using the Shadowfury talent. Don't weave this into your rotation unless stuns on adds are called for. I find Mortal Coil very useful for two reasons: it's an excellent heal AND it interrupts casters' spells. Shadowfury is fine to keep, but try not to weave it into your rotation unless your tank is undergeared or adds are loose.

It looks like you're using the Dark Bargain talent. I haven't found too many useful uses for this talent yet. Yes, it protects you from everything for 8 seconds....but the problem is you take 50% of the total damage you absorbed and suffer a DoT for that amount over 8 seconds. Unless your healers are alerted to this, if you are taking this damage on top of other types of damage, you'll be getting wrecked. Instead, opt for Soul Link...it provides a 20% boost to your HP and you can sacrifice your Voidwalker instead of your Felhunter to give you a defensive cooldown that increases your life by 30% for 20 seconds. What I do instead of using Dark Bargain is I sacrifice my Voidwalker, pop that Last Stand ability, pop Dark Regeneration, and eat a Healthstone. When I use the Last Stand, I go up to 650k HP and the Healthstone heals me for 130k, 260k if it crits. One of your healers will think that a different healer blasted you with a huge healing crit but you'll have saved their mana. I know my healers aren't used to this, so I often tell them over Mumble to not heal me. They listen, send their heals elsewhere, and improve the group. I know you asked about your DPS and not survival, but I'm giving you an entire review based on my experiences. Heed them or heed your own feel, it's up to you friend.

Your glyphs look fine.

It looks like you're holding onto your Legendary. Let it go, man...let it go. I know its pretty, and I know it served you well. And yes, I know Tarecgosa talks to you all the time saying "You're Azeroth's greatest treasure!" Put her in your bank and get yourself a real weapon. At level 90, you can get into the scenario "Arena of Annihilation" and complete the quest in there for a 450 staff. The upgrade in spell power, intellgect, and stamina will serve you well.

Your hit is at 10.04%. That needs to be 15.00%. The reason your DPS is crummy is because you're sitting at 11534 spell power (12687 with Dark Intent). By comparison, my spell power is sitting at 17231 (18954 with Dark Intent) and have seen my SP as high as 22k with procs. Get more gear and watch your DPS go up. The understanding of your class seems to be high, so your DPS will go up significantly as your gear grows. Happy grinding!

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What are people finding to be the optimal way to AoE? I am maintaining dots on 3-4 mob groups, and rain of fire on larger groups. I'm still getting blown away by other classes AoE. I know I shouldn't compare to other classes, but the problem is that everybody else is. I would be fine with being weaker on multiple add fights as long as I am stronger in single target. But I find that I am significantly weaker in AoE and only somewhat stronger on single target fights.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

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What are people finding to be the optimal way to AoE? I am maintaining dots on 3-4 mob groups, and rain of fire on larger groups. I'm still getting blown away by other classes AoE. I know I shouldn't compare to other classes, but the problem is that everybody else is. I would be fine with being weaker on multiple add fights as long as I am stronger in single target. But I find that I am significantly weaker in AoE and only somewhat stronger on single target fights.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

Again, as stated above, don't compare yourself to others. If others are comparing you to them, let them look as stupid and ignorant as they like. If you want to push trash numbers in AoE, go Demonology. Otherwise, enjoy being one of the best, if not THE best, single target specs. For trash, all I do is Soulburn: Soul Swap to 4 mobs and use Malefic Grasp on one of them until they are sub 20% then I Drain Soul to get my Soul Shards back. When I get them back, I SB:SS to the remaining and either MG or DS depending on health.

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Hi Zagam,

I just wanted to pop in here and thank you thank you thank you for all you've done for me since you started posting advice on affliction. Unlike Vaevictuss I am new to warlock in PvE and had raid finder gear at best on my warlock when I started reading here.

Also, I want to confirm your suggestion that gear makes a huge difference at 90. Yesterday (following your gear guide of course!) I picked up an Inscribed Jade Fan and a few other items from the gearing up list and my DPS is so much better.

As to the tank damage, our raid leader/guild leader is a fabulous tank and his DPS is godly, so I can again confirm your point on that.

Last, again following your lead, I suggest that everyone read and reread your discussion of aoe in tips and tricks because of course there is trash and then theres trash. When we get a mad influx of weak mobs I rain of fire just so I don't look lazy. Up to 4 I am teaching myself (a painful process since I am an eternal putz) to use the multiple mob dotting process that you discuss and when I get it right my dps there can be excellent.

Again, Thank You sir!

Cinderkitten (Boulderfist-US)

Edited by spin
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If you haven't noticed yet, tank DPS is pretty impressive. The top damage records on the first raid boss are Blood DKs and Protection Paladins. Their new vengeance reworking gives them absurdly high numbers when tanking, especially if they know how to work the mechanic in their favor (my guild's Blood DK does 80k on trash and 25-30k HPS). Never compare your DPS to anyone else...you only compare it to yourself and monitor improvements.

That said, your ilvl is 441. Continue gearing up...it will make a HUGE difference. The stat loss you took from leveling from 89-90 is quite significant. As you leveled, you actually grew weaker because the amount of secondary stats required to obtain 1% hit, crit, haste, or mastery was greatly increased leaving you weaker by the level. When you finally hit 90, you were actually weaker than you were at 85. My DPS was around 55k at lvl 85 and dropped to about 39-45k at lvl 90. Now it's up to 65-70k at 464 ilvl.

It appears you are using the Harvest Life talent. Don't. As Affliction, you'll never be using this spell. I prefer Dark Regeneration or Soul Leech. Both will increase your survival capabilities while not wasting your DPS on an AoE spell that's weaker than your other alternatives.

It appears you are using the Shadowfury talent. Don't weave this into your rotation unless stuns on adds are called for. I find Mortal Coil very useful for two reasons: it's an excellent heal AND it interrupts casters' spells. Shadowfury is fine to keep, but try not to weave it into your rotation unless your tank is undergeared or adds are loose.

It looks like you're using the Dark Bargain talent. I haven't found too many useful uses for this talent yet. Yes, it protects you from everything for 8 seconds....but the problem is you take 50% of the total damage you absorbed and suffer a DoT for that amount over 8 seconds. Unless your healers are alerted to this, if you are taking this damage on top of other types of damage, you'll be getting wrecked. Instead, opt for Soul Link...it provides a 20% boost to your HP and you can sacrifice your Voidwalker instead of your Felhunter to give you a defensive cooldown that increases your life by 30% for 20 seconds. What I do instead of using Dark Bargain is I sacrifice my Voidwalker, pop that Last Stand ability, pop Dark Regeneration, and eat a Healthstone. When I use the Last Stand, I go up to 650k HP and the Healthstone heals me for 130k, 260k if it crits. One of your healers will think that a different healer blasted you with a huge healing crit but you'll have saved their mana. I know my healers aren't used to this, so I often tell them over Mumble to not heal me. They listen, send their heals elsewhere, and improve the group. I know you asked about your DPS and not survival, but I'm giving you an entire review based on my experiences. Heed them or heed your own feel, it's up to you friend.

Your glyphs look fine.

It looks like you're holding onto your Legendary. Let it go, man...let it go. I know its pretty, and I know it served you well. And yes, I know Tarecgosa talks to you all the time saying "You're Azeroth's greatest treasure!" Put her in your bank and get yourself a real weapon. At level 90, you can get into the scenario "Arena of Annihilation" and complete the quest in there for a 450 staff. The upgrade in spell power, intellgect, and stamina will serve you well.

Your hit is at 10.04%. That needs to be 15.00%. The reason your DPS is crummy is because you're sitting at 11534 spell power (12687 with Dark Intent). By comparison, my spell power is sitting at 17231 (18954 with Dark Intent) and have seen my SP as high as 22k with procs. Get more gear and watch your DPS go up. The understanding of your class seems to be high, so your DPS will go up significantly as your gear grows. Happy grinding!

thanks for the tips, and yea i know the staff has to go haha. I just havnt had any luck on caster drops in 5 mans let alone a weapon. I will try that scenario though. I figured that was holding me back as the 450 staffs have over 5k sp on them. Also, i should still be using power torrent until windsong is fixed or until jade serpent is available?

and are you saying soul link does something even when you sac a pet? i feel dumb for not knowing that haha. Or are you saying you dont sac your pet 100% of the time.

Edited by vaeevictiss

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thanks for the tips, and yea i know the staff has to go haha. I just havnt had any luck on caster drops in 5 mans let alone a weapon. I will try that scenario though. I figured that was holding me back as the 450 staffs have over 5k sp on them. Also, i should still be using power torrent until windsong is fixed or until jade serpent is available?

and are you saying soul link does something even when you sac a pet? i feel dumb for not knowing that haha. Or are you saying you dont sac your pet 100% of the time.

The scenario is a guaranteed drop. I do suggest hammering out for a 463 weapon (Stormstout Brewery has the weapon I'm using = Spell Power, Mastery, & Hit) and the spell power/Intellect increase will be amazing.

Also, Windsong SHOULD be amazing for us, but is broken atm. I'm going to be putting Power Torrent back on my weapon tonight and then finding the quickest route to Jadesong. I am interested in seeing how Windsong chooses what proc it gives you...and the overall benefit.

Having the Soul Link talent impowers the Grimoire of Sacrifice to increase your max HP by 20%. Given the synergy in that Grim of Sac restores 2% of your max HP every 5 seconds, this is just even more amazing healing. Couple that with Mortal Coil (15% of max HP) and you've got some sick survival abilities.

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The scenario is a guaranteed drop. I do suggest hammering out for a 463 weapon (Stormstout Brewery has the weapon I'm using = Spell Power, Mastery, & Hit) and the spell power/Intellect increase will be amazing.

Also, Windsong SHOULD be amazing for us, but is broken atm. I'm going to be putting Power Torrent back on my weapon tonight and then finding the quickest route to Jadesong. I am interested in seeing how Windsong chooses what proc it gives you...and the overall benefit.

Having the Soul Link talent impowers the Grimoire of Sacrifice to increase your max HP by 20%. Given the synergy in that Grim of Sac restores 2% of your max HP every 5 seconds, this is just even more amazing healing. Couple that with Mortal Coil (15% of max HP) and you've got some sick survival abilities.

as a warlock should Posted Image (the survival). I just got the staff too. Its nice but lost a little hit, not much at all tho. a noticeable increase. I was actually hoping for that staff to drop in SB yesterday but it did not lol. It is much better tho with the hit and mastery.

Edited by vaeevictiss

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I would like to chime in here. However, I wanted to thank the host first, and Zagam for all the information I have read here. I was about to hang up my hat and retire the loc until I found this site.

I too seem to be a little dismayed in reference to the numbers I post in comparison to others. I know I’m still running around with greens but at 12,000 spell power I would think 30k would be easy to hit with affliction. (other classes do more in the same gear it seams) The only time I can manage 30k is popping everything in demonology spec on a 8 mob pull. When in affliction, i can’t manage more than 25k. With Zagams advice I will just continue to pick up the 463 gear in hopes of achieving some sort of balance eventually.

My questions are in reference to both specs and specifically for dungeon running.

1) in affliction, if it’s a 3-4 mob pull, i find shard management very complex and nigh impossible to manage. I feel like I am constantly refreshing dots and not using my fillers, and when I do get a shard to pop I’ll drop a haunt, but most of my time is spent just cycling targets and refreshing dots. 6 seconds for UA 8 for the rest. just seems like an eternity, and by the time that 14 seconds has run its course, time to start all over again with UA. No time for our fillers except after the initial pull. Is this the norm? If so, 4 mobs and all I will pull is 25k. This is cursing, using the soulswap macro on all 4.

2) Demonology seems more viable for dungeons in Pandaria. I really feel like we are running Valor back in Wrath. It’s all AOE again. My question to you pros is this: if we are looking at 4-8 mobs are you really cycling and refreshing doom and corruption on each? 16 seconds will go by before I can start opening up. I’m reaching 30k with "service" and inferno but that feels inadequate when the rest of the group is pushing 50k and everything is dead before I can get everything dotted and start the nuke.

3) last question. and thanks in advance. Should I truly spec for hit when I’m just trying to gear for the dungeons or should I go for Mastery -> Haste? I don’t think I have missed a tick or a spell yet on any of the heroic bosses.

You guys are the greatest!!!! Any assistance you can provide will be most appreciated. 8)

Eurekaseven on Arthas

http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/gear/usa/arthas/eurekaseven

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If you don't "think" you missed I'm willing to bet you most definitely have. You would be very surprised if you saw a combat log. That being said, I dunno why I haven't capped myself yet.

Usually at the start of an expansion I force a hit cap at the expense of anything. It has always been a dps increase no matter how much of another stat I lost. I guess ive just been so into getting as high as I can with mastery I forgot what was most important lol. When I log in again I'm going to move stuff around and cap myself.

I have always tried to tell people, all the haste/crit/mastery in the world doesn't mean a damn thing if the spell doesn't land. Sure you can recast, but now you are wasting mana and time. When you waste time you aren't dps’ing. When you waste mana, you life tap more, and when you are life taping you aren't dps’ing. You see how it just turns into a downhill slide lol.

If you want to know if you life tap to much, all it takes is one question. How much mana do you have when the raid boss dies? If its more than 0 you life tapped to much lol. Granted that's extreme, and there's other mechanics at play, but you should never end a fight with more than half at most.

I challenge you to give up other stats to cap your hit and come back here and tell us your dps went down. If it does then well I'm wrong lol.

Edited by vaeevictiss

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I would like to chime in here. However, I wanted to thank the host first, and Zagam for all the information I have read here. I was about to hang up my hat and retire the loc until I found this site.

I too seem to be a little dismayed in reference to the numbers I post in comparison to others. I know I’m still running around with greens but at 12,000 spell power I would think 30k would be easy to hit with affliction. (other classes do more in the same gear it seams) The only time I can manage 30k is popping everything in demonology spec on a 8 mob pull. When in affliction, i can’t manage more than 25k. With Zagams advice I will just continue to pick up the 463 gear in hopes of achieving some sort of balance eventually.

My questions are in reference to both specs and specifically for dungeon running.

1) in affliction, if it’s a 3-4 mob pull, i find shard management very complex and nigh impossible to manage. I feel like I am constantly refreshing dots and not using my fillers, and when I do get a shard to pop I’ll drop a haunt, but most of my time is spent just cycling targets and refreshing dots. 6 seconds for UA 8 for the rest. just seems like an eternity, and by the time that 14 seconds has run its course, time to start all over again with UA. No time for our fillers except after the initial pull. Is this the norm? If so, 4 mobs and all I will pull is 25k. This is cursing, using the soulswap macro on all 4.

2) Demonology seems more viable for dungeons in Pandaria. I really feel like we are running Valor back in Wrath. It’s all AOE again. My question to you pros is this: if we are looking at 4-8 mobs are you really cycling and refreshing doom and corruption on each? 16 seconds will go by before I can start opening up. I’m reaching 30k with "service" and inferno but that feels inadequate when the rest of the group is pushing 50k and everything is dead before I can get everything dotted and start the nuke.

3) last question. and thanks in advance. Should I truly spec for hit when I’m just trying to gear for the dungeons or should I go for Mastery -> Haste? I don’t think I have missed a tick or a spell yet on any of the heroic bosses.

You guys are the greatest!!!! Any assistance you can provide will be most appreciated. 8)

Eurekaseven on Arthas

http://www.askmrrobo...has/eurekaseven

1. I do 4 mob AoE by hitting my Soul Swap macro, Tab, SS Macro, Tab, SS Macro, Tab, SS Macro, Malefic Grasp. If Nightfall proc's another Soul Shard, I will hit what I'm hitting with Haunt. Usually by now, it's below 25%, so I'll start Drain Soul. When Drain Soul finishes the mob, I have 4 shards again, so I refresh DoTs on the other 3 surviving mobs with my SS macro. On more than 4, I Soulburn: Seed of Corruption then channel Rain of Fire. It sucks because it's SO mana intensive, but just tap back up after. Other than that, forget doing good numbers as Affliction. Let your dungeon companions take care of that while you embarrass them on the boss.

2. For dungeon AoE as Demonology, you should put Corruption up on at least 3 targets (keeps your Demonic Fury charged), Meta, Immolation Aura, Felstorm, and Service: Felguard. I would think even in crap gear this would push you over 40k with relative ease. I can push 150k+ on 4 targets this way, so you should see similar results with gear.

3. Personally, I'm a big believer in the hit cap. Can't crit without a hit. Also, wasting mana and time is a HUGE DPS loss. I sit around 14.9% hit and I'm still uncomfortable because I know there will be a day where my tank dies and I'm the only one left...and all that it would take to end a boss's life would be one spell. So I buckle down, quit running, and charge my spell...only to see it miss, with that 0.1% chance and we wipe. I know it will happen some day. I'm STILL running Nizuao for that hit trinket. Blast me and my RNG.

PS Thanks for the compliments. It prides me to know that I'm helping people. Others on this site are also learning to contribute what they find in a thoughtful, well-designed manner without egotism and putting people down. It is truly marvelous, and I'm nothing less than happy to be a big part of that!

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Yup, it was the hit. I picked up the hit trinket last night in nuiazo temple and my dps went up substantially. With no other new gear I pulled over 60k on Corin direbrew. Granted that was popping an old volcanic pot, dark soul , and the hit trinkets int proc.

So hit cap matters a lot

Edited by vaeevictiss

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Yup, it was the hit. I picked up the hit trinket last night in nuiazo temple and my dps went up substantially. With no other new gear I pulled over 60k on Corin direbrew. Granted that was popping an old volcanic pot, dark soul , and the hit trinkets int proc.

So hit cap matters a lot

I hate you. I have 32 kills of that boss, and he will NOT drop that trinket. /rage

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I hate you. I have 32 kills of that boss, and he will NOT drop that trinket. /rage

Well what would make you more upset is the fact I went in there thinking "I do not want to do this whole instance". After that kill the tank dropped and then everyone else did so it worked out.

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I personally wouldn't mind some advice myself, I've done a lot of reading but I recently changed from Demonology to Affliction because it is supposed to be so much better. As a Demon I was pulling about 30K and as a Afflic I started to pull about 38 to 40K. I realize I'm not going to get results right away and I'm not looking for miracles here but I know I should be pulling higher DPS even just by what I've read here.

Here's my Profile: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/kaelthas/Opalessence/simple

Any advice would be greatly appreciated... I've been keeping my DOT's up, sometimes run them early which I've heard both sides of that's good and bad, I'm running the Haunt when I can and otherwise Malefic Grasp. I've got the rotations printed and have looked at other sites as well. I don't know what I'm doing wrong.

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