Iridar

Real state of Disc? (now and WoD)

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So, my raid leader is pressuring me to switch to Holy, saying that discipline has been nerfed to the ground, while Holy does lots of healing. 

 

But I've never been comfortable with that spec. I am willing to learn to love it, but only if it's worth it. 

 

My question is: what is the real state of the disc priests? I don't care how many abilities blizzard took for them, as long as they still provide adequate kit for both raid and direct healing, and can do lots of healing (HPS / total healing). 

 

I'm not looking for the answer "play what you're most comfortable with", because I know for a fact: spec matters, it puts a limit on your potential. 

 

I main Hunter, and this was almost always the case for us: one spec performs better than others, and is a preferred choice in most / certain encounters. It seems it will be that way for Hunters in WoD as well: in single target DPS MM >> SV >> BM. 

 

So those choosing to play in BM will be inherently at disadvantage. 

Will I be at a similar disadvantage if I choose to raid as Disc in WoD?

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Disc number-wise is competitive, the healing style is quite difference from what you're used to however so you would likely need to relearn your play style either way.

 

Holy and disc are going to perform roughly the same, they just fill different niches. Holy is mostly a raid healer, whereas discipline is a tank/stacked group healer. What role you need to fill matters more than overall healing output.

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Disc number-wise is competitive

Thanks, that assurance was what I needed. 

 

the healing style is quite difference from what you're used to however so you would likely need to relearn your play style either way.

I'm used to triage-style single target healing, using atonement only to proc Archangel, or when there's completely nothing else to do in overgeared dungeons. I know atonement was a big time thing during MoP, but I never much cared for it. 

 

 

discipline is a tank/stacked group healer. What role you need to fill matters more than overall healing output.

Is it really the case anymore? We lost Grace, so we're not penalized for switching targets. I feel like now is the time for disc to truly unfold his wings, and shine in the darkness, as now we're truly fit for triage, with our on-demand shields and heals not being held back by lack of Grace on whole raid. 

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The only targets that have a consistent need for single-target absorbs will be tanks.. Some fights do have other targets of interests(like hunters on koragh), but the nature of CoW and PWS greatly leans discipline towards tank healing.

 

For most of the time you want to use multi-target heals to heal everyone else up. Discipline doesn't have good means of spread AE healing, we only have HN. That's why discipline is best for stacked group healing rather than spread.

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So, my raid leader is pressuring me to switch to Holy, saying that discipline has been nerfed to the ground, while Holy does lots of healing. 

 

But I've never been comfortable with that spec. I am willing to learn to love it, but only if it's worth it. 

 

My question is: what is the real state of the disc priests? I don't care how many abilities blizzard took for them, as long as they still provide adequate kit for both raid and direct healing, and can do lots of healing (HPS / total healing). 

 

I'm not looking for the answer "play what you're most comfortable with", because I know for a fact: spec matters, it puts a limit on your potential. 

 

I main Hunter, and this was almost always the case for us: one spec performs better than others, and is a preferred choice in most / certain encounters. It seems it will be that way for Hunters in WoD as well: in single target DPS MM >> SV >> BM. 

 

So those choosing to play in BM will be inherently at disadvantage. 

Will I be at a similar disadvantage if I choose to raid as Disc in WoD?

On my disc priest, I seem to always outheal Holy priests, and I usually only get beaten on the healing meter now, by a resto druid. Disc priests have been improved, regardless of the nerfs made to it, due to the 2pc AA proc+Power infusion, makes them a very efficient healer in high damage phases. I only tried holy once, and switched to disc, and never looked back. If you're willing to learn the Disc healing style, it'd be worth it.

 

http://www.wow-heroes.com/character/us/Ysera/Glorynymph/

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Thanks for your answers, though it seems you guys got me wrong - I don't want to switch to Disc, I asked if Disc is so bad that I should switch to Holy. 

Seems disc is quite alright, so I'll keep using it then. 

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Thanks for your answers, though it seems you guys got me wrong - I don't want to switch to Disc, I asked if Disc is so bad that I should switch to Holy. 

Seems disc is quite alright, so I'll keep using it then. 

Have to love it when 53% of your total healing is from Divine Aegis.

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The only targets that have a consistent need for single-target absorbs will be tanks.. Some fights do have other targets of interests(like hunters on koragh), but the nature of CoW and PWS greatly leans discipline towards tank healing.

 

For most of the time you want to use multi-target heals to heal everyone else up. Discipline doesn't have good means of spread AE healing, we only have HN. That's why discipline is best for stacked group healing rather than spread.

 

This really is the answer your looking for.  And yes to give you another tally to add to your answers...  Holy and Disc are and will be competitive with each other as well as with other healers going into WoD.  The raid leader telling you that Disc sucks has not stayed on the topic as it has changed the last 2-3 months.

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The only targets that have a consistent need for single-target absorbs will be tanks.. Some fights do have other targets of interests(like hunters on koragh), but the nature of CoW and PWS greatly leans discipline towards tank healing.

 

For most of the time you want to use multi-target heals to heal everyone else up. Discipline doesn't have good means of spread AE healing, we only have HN. That's why discipline is best for stacked group healing rather than spread.

What I would do, is use PW: Shield for the borrowed time haste buff, and get off a few PoH+Holy novas with the haste buff, and repeat. I use that tactic to shield entire raids during encounters; but, in terms of general AoE healing, Discipline priests are lacking a little bit.

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What I would do, is use PW: Shield for the borrowed time haste buff, and get off a few PoH+Holy novas with the haste buff, and repeat. I use that tactic to shield entire raids during encounters; but, in terms of general AoE healing, Discipline priests are lacking a little bit.

You can't use PoH liberally if much at all. It costs 7.1% of your mana every cast. HN on the other hand costs 1.6% of your mana, while healing for a little more than half of PoH.

 

Casting PoH needs to have little to no overhealing on all targets to even consider casting, not to mention a desperate need to heal people up. If there isn't huge pending raid damage you might as well use efficient heals to heal it.

Edited by Espiee
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You can't use PoH liberally if much at all. It costs 7.1% of your mana every cast. HN on the other hand costs 1.6% of your mana, while healing for a little more than half of PoH.

 

Casting PoH needs to have little to no overhealing on all targets to even consider casting, not to mention a desperate need to heal people up. If there isn't huge pending raid damage you might as well use efficient heals to heal it.

I'm not saying I use PoH the whole time, but I use it more when I combine Power infusion with an AA Proc for my 10% increased crit. Otherwise, I heal through using Holy Nova.

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Are we even sure it's worth casting PWS for the haste buff in Warlords?

 

Healing from PWS is not much higher than HN as is. Spamming it once every 6 seconds for BT would mean you'd have to cast at least every third PWS on non-tanks, who might not even use the shield fully. The benefit from using it would then have to be the haste buff, but how large would that be?

 

Haste is going to be the least favorable stat for discipline. Any haste you get is due to having no better option avaiable. A 40% temporary buff to a very undesired stat is not that attractive. Add to that how at the start of the new expansion we're going to have very little secondary stats at all, which means even less haste than you would currently have. Accounting for the healing you could do using another HN, or even CoW, instead of that PWS probably makes it a negligible gain at best provided no overhealing.

Edited by Espiee
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Are we even sure it's worth casting PWS for the haste buff?

 

Healing from PWS is not much higher than HN as is. If spamming it once every 6 seconds for BT would mean you'd have to cast at least every third PWS on non-tanks, who might not even use the shield fully. The benefit from using it would then have to be the haste buff, but how large would that be?

 

Haste is going to be the least favorable stat for discipline. Any haste you get is due to having no better option avaiable. A 40% temporary buff to a very undesired stat is not that attractive. Add to that how at the start of the new expansion we're going to have very little secondary stats at all, which means even less haste than you would currently have. Accounting for the healing you could do using another HN, or even CoW, instead of that PWS probably makes it a negligible gain at best provided no overhealing.

That is true, but hopefully it will be resolved by level 100.

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If you will forgive a "side" question...

 

I have been offline for 18 months and am just dipping my toe back in the water.  My main is also a Hunter, but I have also enjoyed my Disc Priest.  Before I was forced to abandon WoW my raiding was as either DPS on my Hunter or occasionally as a DK Tank.

 

What I found really enjoyable about my DP is that while leveling her up to 90 I was able to heal all the dungeons I ran just by using PWS and then dps'ing.  My dps abilities also did group healing that was suffecient to keep the entire group topped up.  I realize this is not the optimal technique for all raids, but it did work on several of the Pandoria Raids and those just prior to Pandoria.

 

My question is... with all the changes that have taken place while I was gone, can a DP still do an adequate job of keeping a group healed by using "mostly" PWS and dps'ing?  (things have changed so I cannot tell you the spell rotation I used to use, but it seemed to work quite well .. back in the day :-).....

 

My level 90 DP is on the Horde side and I have rolled an Alliance DP just to get used to playing again..., but I did not want to list my self to heal dungeons if I was not going to be able to do the job... I realize I am going to have to re-learn the DP.

 

Thank you

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My question is... with all the changes that have taken place while I was gone, can a DP still do an adequate job of keeping a group healed by using "mostly" PWS and dps'ing?

Short answer, No.

 

The healing from atonement(dpsing) is far too low for the gear levels that we have at lvl 100.

 

Maybe a few tiers from now but not soon.

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My question is... with all the changes that have taken place while I was gone, can a DP still do an adequate job of keeping a group healed by using "mostly" PWS and dps'ing?  (things have changed so I cannot tell you the spell rotation I used to use, but it seemed to work quite well .. back in the day :-).....

 

Atonement is dead for healing. And it'll stay dead until it heals for nearly as much or more than our other options.

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Ok... that is what I feared...

 

Thank you very much for the quick and helpful answers.

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