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BaineYsondre

Elemental Shammy help

11 posts in this topic

Couple things:

 

1. You didn't use an int potion. You should pre pot before the pull and then use one later in the fight.

2. It seems like you're not clearing your LS stacks quickly enough because your number of earth shocks is a bit low.

3. Can you clearly see with your UI when you get lava surge procs and what your LS stack is at? I feel like you might be missing out on lava bursts. 

4. Spiritwalker's grace was active once, as was aspect of the fox. I think this leaves one movement part where you were unable to cast anything.

 

You should be doing much more dps than you are, and I think it's mainly because you're not casting the right thing at the right time. Hopefully this helps. I'm no ele expert and am new to the class, but from your logs it seemed like these were the mistakes you were making.

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well i will try out and see your suggestions the next run and i think ur right about the stacks of LS im sitting on them a little too much

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Yeah, don't think of stacks in terms of "I need to clear them at X number". I'd recommend Elementarist because it gives you a pretty good visual that helps you plan out the next steps in your rotation.

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17 is default choice, When u mastery better w/ rotation u can hold it until 18~20. Also i noticed that using storm elemental u lose around 2,5k dp.s Well, talking about my own logs,

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I've never seen/used AMR's logs so I'm not sure if I'm reading them right but I'll give it a go.

 

Here's a list numerated based on importance/impact on your DPS:

 

1) You should use 2 potions on every pull, period.  One just before the pull, another during the fight when Ascendance and/or Heroism/Bloodlust are active.  

 

2) Those logs don't list a Bloodlust/Heroism buff ever recorded on your character.  This should be cast either on pull or on Butcher's enrage.

 

3) You should be using Spiritwalker's Grace as often as possible.  I recommend the glyph which halves its cooldown/buff for most of HM.  It synchronizes perfectly with the Butcher's ranged cleave (until his enrage) and should be used every time until that time.  The more time you spend moving, the less you cast.  Spiritwalker's helps tremendously in WoD.  

 

4) Your talents, as they are currently shown, are optimized for AOE DPS and not single target.  Butcher is a single target fight.  I would take Elemental Fusion instead of Storm Elemental, and Unleash instead of Primal Elementalist. 

 

5) Your rotation is a bit off, from what I can see.  Unless you take the Unleash talent, you shouldn't be casting Unleash as part of your rotation.  Only for movement.  It's a DPS loss otherwise.  Similarly, the Earth Elemental is a waste of GCD as it nets a minuscule amount of DPS.  

 

6) There is no magic number for fulmination unload.  Not until the tier set is collected, at least.  Focus on unloading your stacks at 15+.  It's far more important that you don't waste charges than to unload from 18 to 20.  

 

7) You used healing stream totem a few times.  This is an obvious DPS loss.  I understand the desire to help out the healers, but you should rarely, if ever, use healing skills that are on GCD as an elemental shaman.  And when you do, they should be fast-cast large payload heals that are intended to save lives.  Healing Stream trickles, so it doesn't fit that bill.  Basically, if your heal isn't the only thing in that moment that saves a life, it is not optimal to cast it. For the most part, the damage you lose from not using that GCD for a damage skill will extend the fight by a fraction of a second up to a second, during which the boss will likely do far more damage than your measly healing stream would mitigate.  I hope that makes sense.. best I could explain it.  

 

Let me know if you have any questions.  Cheers.  

Edited by Fendal

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2) Those logs don't list a Bloodlust/Heroism buff ever recorded on your character.  This should be cast either on pull or on Butcher's enrage.

Its there

 

 

4) Your talents, as they are currently shown, are optimized for AOE DPS and not single target.  Butcher is a single target fight.  I would take Elemental Fusion instead of Storm Elemental, and Unleash instead of Primal Elementalist.

He has unleash, didnt realise the healing from the elemental was so terrible, is the tooltip wrong?, its list 100% damage as healing on the tooltip but did 200k damage and only 50k healing

 

 

7) You used healing stream totem a few times.  This is an obvious DPS loss.  I understand the desire to help out the healers, but you should rarely, if ever, use healing skills that are on GCD as an elemental shaman.  And when you do, they should be fast-cast large payload heals that are intended to save lives.  Healing Stream trickles, so it doesn't fit that bill.

I'm pretty suprised how much healing it did, 400k over a short fight, without the talent, might consider useing the talent/glyph on fights where the healing/buff is usefull

 

Out of interest what glyphs? you are using healing stream glyph on a fight with no element damage, glyph of lightning shield should be a default choice and usualy spirts focus, chain lightning on fights with 4 targets.

 

Overall considering you only have a 630 weapon and you "wasted" a ton of gcd's on healing totem and didnt pot your dps is decent

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I see.  AMR shows timewarp, just not under buffs... apparently you have to click on raid buffs.  And once you do, you also see that it lists he used a potion.  Why not just list all the buffs under 1 tab... But I digress, with this in mind I retract comments 1 and 2.

 

AMR also lists your elementals as pets which is incorrect unless you use primal elemental, which is what I assumed.  

 

Anyway,  Baine, the rest of the DPS loss has to come down to mostly managing spiritwalker's grace and rotation.  It's hard to gauge rotation fully form what you posted.  Considering that you had the unleash talent, it seems mostly right so I wouldn't worry too much about it.  

 

Dean771 - 390K from healing stream is indeed a good deal of healing, but you have to consider that it came from 9 GCDs(at least from what I can discern from AMR), so it took away around 12-13 seconds from his rotation. H Butcher melee hits for about 20-40K a pop and it does so several times a second.  I still think it's overall less valuable to cast than even lb, even if most of the healing output from it is effective healing.  

 

With regards to the storm elemental: that entire row is fairly well balanced.  That said, on single target fights EF pulls ahead by quite a bit.  That became more true as I got more gear, because it scales better.  I am unsure where you saw 50K Heals from it, but i'll take your word for it.  I looked a bit, but I find AMRs logs so counter intuitive to browse that I just gave up.  Why anyone would use them over warcraftlogs is beyond me...but to each their own.   I did notice it said about 50% of its output went to overhealing, and I'd believe it.  So that's probably at least part of the answer.  

 

Personally, I wouldn't use it.  It's really hard to line up correctly with periods of raidwide damage, and it's most likely not worth postponing for long periods.  This is going to be less true as we get more gear and as more damage goes out.     

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Dean771 - 390K from healing stream is indeed a good deal of healing, but you have to consider that it came from 9 GCDs(at least from what I can discern from AMR), so it took away around 12-13 seconds from his rotation. H Butcher melee hits for about 20-40K a pop and it does so several times a second.  I still think it's overall less valuable to cast than even lb, even if most of the healing output from it is effective healing.  
 
 

 

 

It's not something id recomend every fight and to be honest I've never run with it in raid, just so used to the OP AG from MoP that I've never looked into it, but trading 400k healing for 200k damage(Dodgy math!) definately has uses on some fights, talent rushing streams and now your looking at 900k. Go to a fight where the glyph is usefull and I think its worth it.

 

That said maybe not patchwork. sorry to derail the thread

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From a Healer's perspective in HC Butcher, we struggle for mana towards the end. Anything you can do in the first phase of the fight (above 30%) to make us do less healing, the longer we can keep everyone alive in the latter part of the fight. I think it's a successful strategy to use Healing Stream Totem on that fight.

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