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Sub Rogue help needed

4 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Hey rogue community !


My Rogue was for long time my most played twink but since few weeks - i like to play him more efficient in Raid.


My problem is that i have spoken with a raid lead from a raiding group and he told me, that my logs are mostly total crap ( maybe cause i have only old Mythic logs in which i haven`t  Leg ring or decent gear).


2 day ago i joined a random pug group and the leader saved logs so please look at these and maybe you find my true weakness.

(Heroic Logs from HFA to Iskar are the Logs from Friday)







Thanks for helping guys and hopefully you all can help me ;)




Edited by Tasitus

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Hey Tas,

From what I can see, there are a few things you can work on to improve your damage.

One very important thing for you across all of your fights and both specs is to watch your uptimes. What I mean by that, is both Sub and Combat specs require you to maintain a couple buffs each: with Combat you have to watch Slice and Dice and Revealing Strike, and with Subtlety you have to watch Slice and Dice and Rupture. On all of the fights that I looked at, one (or both) of those skills for each spec had pretty low uptimes

The most important thing when playing Sub though, is how you do your opener; because of the guaranteed proc on Soul Capacitor combined with all of your cooldowns, enchant procs, and dps potion, your opener is a HUGE portion of your damage and will set the tone for the entire fight. Your opener should look like this:

  1. 11s before pull, use Premeditation
  2. 1s before the full, use Slice and Dice and prepot
  3. On the pull, use Vanish
  4. Use Shadow Reflection to start it copying your skills asap
  5. Cast Rupture
  6. Use Shadow Dance
  7. Begin your normal rotation. This includes making sure Rupture is always up on your target and Slice and Dice is always on yourself.
  8. Towards the end of Shadow Dance (probably about 7-8 seconds in) you will have a free second where you don't have energy for another Ambush. Use Preparation in this window for a second Vanish
  9. Cast Vanish as soon as Shadow Dance is over

Another thing to watch out for when playing Sub in particular is how much energy you have. You stay at very very low energy for most of a fight, which means that you can't capitalize on your cooldowns properly. When you aren't using Shadow Dance, you should try and only use Backstab and/or Hemorrhage if you're at 90 energy or more. Additionally, you should not be spending any combo points unless you are at 8 (5 points + 3 stacks of Anticipation). Again, this is to maximize your efficiency with which you use your energy

The last thing I would like to point out is that Glyph of Hemorrhage is very beneficial in a large number of situations. It allows you to use Hemorrhage as a filler, so you can get a 30% damage bonus through your passive Sanguinary Vein on targets that would otherwise die before Rupture is able to fully tick on them.

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Thanks @Carrn for your fast and very detailed answer ! I will test it and hopefully this will improve my DPS overall :)

One (last) question:  Should i use Vanish only infight combined with Shadowdance ( and "waste" for example 15 seconds while waiting for SD?)

Or should i use Vanish then and 15 seconds later SD? ;)


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It depends.

You should save Vanish if:

  1. Shadow Dance will be available in 6s or less
  2. Shadow Reflection (and therefore also Dance) will be available in the next 12s or less

In all other situations, it is an increase to use Vanish on cooldown

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