Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
Amygdalla

2H weapon or 1H w/ Shield?

8 posts in this topic

Hi Guys,

 

I am in a pickle. I got a new weapon the other day in heroic sha. But it is a 2H weapon Staff Gaze of Arrogance.  But currently I have inv_mace_1h_orgrimmarraid_d_03.jpgHorned Mace of the Old Ones and inv_shield_orgrimmarraid_d_02.jpgNorushen's Enigmatic Barrier. I  cannot tell which one is better and I have a lot of people telling me that 2H are for priests, and that a 1H and shield is better for shamans (and I agree). But I am not sure which one is a better upgrade atm. I am hoping I get a heroic weapon soon =/

 

Helps! and thank you smile.png

~Mojo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For dps, spellpower always wins.  You'd need your offhand to be ~ilvl 600 for it to even be a question.

 

For survivability, spellpower probably still wins because more damage -> fight shorter, since armor applies to approximately nothing in siege (for non-tanks), except for Iron Juggernaut (a lot of that damage is properly physical and not sonic).  Even still, unless you're getting 2-shot by stuff, stick with the staff, and gratz!  I hope I get mine this week.

 

 

EDIT:  2hs also favored by elemental right now because TOO MUCH SPIRIT OH MY GOD.  If you're resto, then yes, 1H-shield is ostensibly a little better, but that's icing on the cake compared to "higher spellpower".

 

EDIT 2:  Wow, I actually beat Hybrys to answering a question.  This hasn't happened in weeks.

Edited by SparkSovereign
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For dps, spellpower always wins.  You'd need your offhand to be ~ilvl 600 for it to even be a question.

 

For survivability, spellpower probably still wins because more damage -> fight shorter, since armor applies to approximately nothing in siege (for non-tanks), except for Iron Juggernaut (a lot of that damage is properly physical and not sonic).  Even still, unless you're getting 2-shot by stuff, stick with the staff, and gratz!  I hope I get mine this week.

 

 

EDIT:  2hs also favored by elemental right now because TOO MUCH SPIRIT OH MY GOD.  If you're resto, then yes, 1H-shield is ostensibly a little better, but that's icing on the cake compared to "higher spellpower".

 

EDIT 2:  Wow, I actually beat Hybrys to answering a question.  This hasn't happened in weeks.

Too bad it's not right!

 

Check this out:

 

Base 2h:

2268 Int

1462 Crit

1573 Mastery

13499 Spell Power

 

MH+Shield combo:

2396 Int

1299 Spirit

573 Haste

1080 Mastery

12602 Spell Power

 

If we apply Ele stat weights, the MH/OH comes out ahead as long as you can use most of the hit, mostly because Crit isn't great!  If we apply Resto stat weights however, the 2h will come ahead by just a little bit.

 

Base 1h:

863 Int

598 Spirit

573 Haste

12602 Spell Power

 

+ Base OH

1228 Int (+165 from OH Enchant)

701 Spirit

920 Mastery

+140 Int / 160 Mastery (from gem + bonus)

 

Weight Bases:

 

Ele, relatively universal stat weights:

Spirit/Hit = 6.5

Int = 5.2

SP = 4.2

Mastery = 3

Haste = 2.9

Crit = 2.35

 

Resto, Crit Build:

Int = 5

SP = 3.75

Spirit = 3.25

Haste before 8.8k = 3

Crit = 2.25

Mastery = 2.15

 

 

TL;DR, MH/OH combos are typically better, just because of the gems and enchants.  It can come very close, with differentiating item levels, though.

 

Ele also does not favor 2h weapons, and would rather have either spell mace (Horned Mace of the Old Ones/Kardris' Scepter) and the Garrosh OH (Revelations of Y'Shaarj) for their Best In Slot setup.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If we apply Ele stat weights, the MH/OH comes out ahead as long as you can use most of the hit, mostly because Crit isn't great!  If we apply Resto stat weights however, the 2h will come ahead by just a little bit.

I don't think I'm wrong, I think we're looking at different scenarios.

 

Key phrase is "as long as you can use most of the hit".  I've been at least 1% over since week one of 5.4, and was for awhile using stamina gems to match blue because otherwise I was 5% over (only reason I'm not doing that now is because I'm OS resto atm).  When I finally got my tier pieces this problem lessened considerably, but it won't go away until I get a Signet of the Dinomancers.  Crit is a pretty bad stat for elemental, but spirit past cap is worth literally nothing, and I'm still hitcapped with no weapons equipped, so if you take that into consideration:

 

Using the stat weights you posted, except assuming we're already hitcapped (spirit = 0):

2H - Weights sum to 76644.1

MH/OH - Weights sum to 70289.3

Even if you took all the spirit on the MH/OH and converted it to mastery, 2H still wins here (just by 5% instead of 10%).  To go further, I took a look at what happens if you upgrade the MH to heroic:

 

Gain 64 intellect, weighted at 332.8

Gain 43 spirit, weighted at 0, or 129 if converted to mastery

Gain 41 haste, weighted at 118.9

Gain 850 spellpower, weighted at 3570

Overall gain 4021.7, or 4150.7 if spirit converted to mastery

New MH/OH weight: 74311, or 78337 if spirit converts 100% to mastery

 

Since you can only convert 40% of the spirit to mastery, MH/OH is still less than the 2Her if you don't need your weapons to hitcap.  If you do, MH/OH wins.  So I guess the lesson here is that I need to convince my raid to run Thok again instead of spending 100% of our time on heroic progression.

 

Re: resto, my answer was entirely off the cuff (related to armor since I assumed the stat difference was fairly insignificant), I defer to the experts on that one.

Edited by SparkSovereign
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Something else to consider is the value of the +8 upgrade somewhere else untill you have fully upgraded gear.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think I'm wrong, I think we're looking at different scenarios.

 

Key phrase is "as long as you can use most of the hit".  I've been at least 1% over since week one of 5.4, and was for awhile using stamina gems to match blue because otherwise I was 5% over (only reason I'm not doing that now is because I'm OS resto atm).  When I finally got my tier pieces this problem lessened considerably, but it won't go away until I get a Signet of the Dinomancers.  Crit is a pretty bad stat for elemental, but spirit past cap is worth literally nothing, and I'm still hitcapped with no weapons equipped, so if you take that into consideration:

 

Using the stat weights you posted, except assuming we're already hitcapped (spirit = 0):

2H - Weights sum to 76644.1

MH/OH - Weights sum to 70289.3

Even if you took all the spirit on the MH/OH and converted it to mastery, 2H still wins here (just by 5% instead of 10%).  To go further, I took a look at what happens if you upgrade the MH to heroic:

 

Gain 64 intellect, weighted at 332.8

Gain 43 spirit, weighted at 0, or 129 if converted to mastery

Gain 41 haste, weighted at 118.9

Gain 850 spellpower, weighted at 3570

Overall gain 4021.7, or 4150.7 if spirit converted to mastery

New MH/OH weight: 74311, or 78337 if spirit converts 100% to mastery

 

Since you can only convert 40% of the spirit to mastery, MH/OH is still less than the 2Her if you don't need your weapons to hitcap.  If you do, MH/OH wins.  So I guess the lesson here is that I need to convince my raid to run Thok again instead of spending 100% of our time on heroic progression.

 

Re: resto, my answer was entirely off the cuff (related to armor since I assumed the stat difference was fairly insignificant), I defer to the experts on that one.

It's very true, but balancing on throwing away a stat isn't valid to me, since I've always been able to tweak within .5% of hit from ilvl 450 to 582.  Hell, right now, I could be at 14.99% if I swapped by pant enchant.  You would, however, have to be able to use at least 75% of the Hit to make them even, and if the situation were that it would be wasted, the staff would be better...

 

Just gotta rely on Tier and the Siegecrafter Boots (Powder-Stained Totemic Treads) to get rid of all that hit.

 

We can also weigh in Reforging:

 

2H: 1462 Crit --> 585 Haste & 877 Crit

 

1H: 598 Spirit --> 239 Mastery & 359 Spirit

OH: 701 Spirit --> 280 Haste & 421 Spirit

 

Which would make them surprisingly even, with the 2H at 76965.9, and the MH/OH at 76888.3.  For the MH/OH combo being an average 3.5 ilvls lower, at it's base, it's kind of impressive.

 

If the choice was to be made now from an Ele perspective, I'd opt to keep what's already valor upgraded.

 

The same goes for Resto as well, really.  I wouldn't spend 1k valor to 8/8 it if your other gear is already upgraded.  I would instead upgrade something else with a good difference to it's upgrade (such as Chest/Pants/Helm/Trinkets/Cloak).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Hopper2011
      I was wondering if there were any theorycrafters or DK enthusiasts interested in helping me pick out some heroic brf weapons, and to pick which would be best for me.
      I've asked every Death Knight i've ran into for advice, and they've been flat out stumped. I'm torn between a heroic warforged burning blade, versus a heroic burning blade with a socket (50 multi). The exchange in stats are (Socketed: -29.31 dps, -16 str, -25 stam, -8 mastery, +38 multi)(Warforged: +29.31 dps, +16 str, +25 stam, +8 mastery, -38 multi). Below is a link to my personal armory.
       
      http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/bleeding-hollow/Dkumad/simple
       
      Thank you.
    • By Stomyshiv
      Hi. new rouge here and i have some questions about combat gearing in relation to the weapons now i know that the icy-veins page for combat tells you to use slower weapons but I am wanting to know why that is. I trust it works but I like to understand my class and why it works. Any info is great thanks!!
    • By Werehowl
      My progression guild's 'off' tank and I are both warriors, and have had varying luck when it comes to getting our new weapons. He's currently using Tanar's, and I have Kro's fist.
       
      The question came up about which weapon would be 'better' from the prot standpoint. Obviously, Tanar's is leagues above when it comes to fury, but as our stat priority stands now, both have a useful stat, and a rather undesireable. Mastery is our first choice, which goes to Kro's, with Crit as our second, which would be the sword.
       
      On the flip side, stat priorities on IV show Haste > Multi, which would make me assume the mace is best. That said, the multistrike, however small, from the sword at least procs blood craze. A pathetically small boon, but a boon none the less. I can imagine the extra haste working wonders for fights like Beast - my AoE bleeds usually do about 45% of my damage, even WITH ravager and failstorm.
       
      Bottom line is this - when it comes to BRF, which is the better weapon? We're at Heroic level right now, so obviously mythic cleaver from butcher crushes the competition, but we've not the numbers to get in there.
       
      Sword, or Mace? And if both, which situations does one shine above the other?
       
      Thanks!
    • By deftec
      i am fury war and i am a little unlucky on getting 1h weapons, so for 1h weapons i have 1 645ilvl and 1 640ilvl 1h weapons. last night i killed with my guild Imperator Mar'gok on normal and was lucky enought to get 2 times the 2h weapon (655 ilvl).
       
      but overall i have 656ilvl (with the 1h) and 657ilvl (with the 2h) so with this ilvl i should be using 1h weapons for single-targets and the 2h for aoe.
       
      is it worth doing macros to equip the 2h weapons to use the aoe skills and macros to equip the 1h weapons to use single target skills?
       
      examples:
      #showtooltip Raging Blow /equipset dps 2h /castsequence  Whirlwind, Whirlwind, Raging Blow   #showtooltip Bladestorm /equipset dps 2h /cancelaura Bladestorm /cast Bladestorm   #showtooltip Execute /equipset dps 1h /cast Execute
    • By scratchie
      So i wanted to ask the community about some blood dk questions, as i am new to the whole tanking bizz, as i usually heal. 

      Death knight Runeforging. 
      What runeforge should i be using? i see StoneSkin Gargoyle mostly, Although fallen crusader and swordshattering seem to be popular.
      Plague Leech
      Plague leech i love, but without roiling blood i seem to have problems with holding aggro, Am i doing something wrong or is it just better in most situations to use roiling blood? 

      Lichborne Vs Anti Magic Shell.
      Anti magic shell seems good for alot of fights (immersius) however lichborne seems a good way to go, if you need purgatory it usually seems like its a wipe anyway. Which one is best?
       
      Outbreak Macro's 
      Out Break glyph seems almost mandatory with plague leech, if its viable (see above) what would be a macro to use for it? since you would need immediate re-issuing of the diseases.

      I wanted this because it seems like i cannot find straight answers to these questions, (i did finally find macros for Death pact that worked correctly and lichborne). hopefully this thread will help not only myself, but the other new dks.