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Lotrix

Log issue and Dark Shamans opener question.

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Hello.

So my guild killed spoils on HC i upload log and the uploaded log somehow cut dmg done from other side by 30M-50M. Is that because I was to far away for combat log to see it? Does on boss 3 and 4 ( when banished ) going to be the same?

 

My opener on Shamans HC:

-prepot

-infernal ( i like it more than anything else in game ^^ i use it only on aoe fights )

-DS

-RoF

-Immolate 3-4 targets depends on if meta gems procs ( I try to get all with haste and crit boof for tons of embers )

-RoF all time and i refresh it on last sec of meta gem

-Chaos bolt spam my best was 7 before DS expire

I do not use our Curse because we have 2 locks in grp like always.

I dont have log forgot to type /combatlog ;/ but its not about the numbers just what my goals are on opener wich is build tons of embers and spam chaos bolt on 1 of dogs than havoc shadowburn > mantain RoF and Immo > more chaosbolts > And another havoc shadowburn. From this point we split boss so nothing to think about here.

Love you

~Hellgrind

Edited by Lotrix

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I wouldn't use infernal in your opener.  It's a waste of a GCD that you could use casting something else.  Generally what I do is.

 

Pre-pot

 

DS

 

FnB Immolate

 

RoF

 

I try to build two embers as quickly as possible.  I glyph Havoc on this fight and cast 2 havocd chaos bolts before my trinkets run out.

 

Right from there I go into some FnB spam.  

 

I usually will cap around 2.3 million dps or so before the first dog dies. 

 

Like I said it seems like you aren't really using FnB in the opener which you should be.  Hard to tell without logs though.  100% you shouldn't use infernal.  Doomguard is way better for your 25% burn phase later in the fight since you will benefit from the increased damage it does.  I personally find infernal to be trash in all situations.

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Don't quote me on this but I would incinerate 1 dog to hope to god trinkets proc, RoF then FnB immolate

Then incinerate until you have 2 embers then (if you do have 4piece set bonus) havoc and then chaosbolt, personally I would chaosbolt the dog to get them down b4 the split .

Also on this fight on a personal note the focus havoc macro works a treat here.

And havoc glyph is good here also.

Edited by Nalar

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Ohh infernal sucks big style, never use it..... Period

Might seem good with the aoe start but it's not I'm sorry to say.

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Hmm, what is it with people and their fascination for the infernal.

 

All I ever see in LFR/Flex and even stuff like Ordos is people dropping Infernals/Abbysals everywhere. Even on single target, and most of the time they miss the impact!

 

If you're set on using the Infernal, you need to know how to use it.

 

First off - it brings a large radius AoE stun, which is decent.

 

Second - the damage it does is pathetic, however the damage it does when it lands (Infernal Awakening) is actually quite potent.

 

Third - the damage Infernal Awakening does is buffed by Metamorphosis, so the best time to use an Infernal is in demon form with Dark Soul up.

 

I think to make it worth it for Destruction/Affliction, it has to hit something like 8 targets at least. Doomguard will probably be doing about 1.5M damage, so you need to have Infernal do more than this to make it worth it.

 

As you say you just killed Spoils, you may find using Infernal on Thok when the bats come down a suitable time to use it. Get RoF down and a FnB Immolate on the bats, then summon your infernal on the clumped up pack to get a nice stun and hopefully some big impact damage. Second pot here too if you're struggling. Pop Unending Resolve and go to town on the bats, before Havocing the boss (with glyph) and copying 6 shadowburns into boss from the bats. 

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I think to make it worth it for Destruction/Affliction, it has to hit something like 8 targets at least. Doomguard will probably be doing about 1.5M damage, so you need to have Infernal do more than this to make it worth it.

It's more like 12-16 targets.  The Infernal is a sack of shit and only has value on trash packs and if a bunch of Immerseus adds are close together.  It literally cannot be used anywhere else to get more DPS than a Doomguard.

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Perhaps it was 8+ targets for Demonology in Meta. Not really a big deal anyway because it's just padding really.

 

I use it on Immerseus and Nazgrim and that's it, and both of these have like 20 targets or more so it's irrelevant. 

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I love you all :] Why you ask? Ok than!

 

But first ill say something about me. I consider my self as pro/hardcore player who in past played 16 hours a day with guild in order to progress. Now my time is limited ( I can be on 2/3 raid days most of time and im in casual guild now ) and i feel I can dish out a lot more dps even if i ignore our 10 min cd. We kill shaman with no real problem so i dont have lots of wipes to test out openers.

 

I study The Warlock Forum here on Icy-veins. So im 100% up to date. I believe so that I know 99% tricks warlock have. Now its up to how ill use my powers. I menage to use havoc 2 times on dogs so its 6 shadowburns ( last 3 are cloned to boss ) But the idea of glyph havoc x2CB is my new toy for next time ill face shamans THANKE YOU for that !! :D.

 

I know Infernal is crap. I dont need you all to "learn" me that. I just LOVE it so bad im going to use it everywhere I can use extra stun or I dont need that extra dps. ( I even use it on Nazgrim fight for adds after he spawn extra wave for example if somehow shaman rush his way to nazgrim. Infernal stun followed by Sac sucubus push back. ) Infernal is like Drain Soul, Shadow bolt or Our Demons ... In my nightmares I log in my lock and I cant summon Infernal :D.

 

Now to the point I dont want to talk about numbers I want to know openers you use and what are your goals in the opener. Later on we can drop some logs to compare openers or maybe you already know the best one? I still think it depends on trinket proc.

 

I was not going to list Infernal at start but its a GCD and it should be there for you to know and discuss about. But dont threat every new guy here like "noob" and that you need to learn him what I believe is  basic and core informations.

 

Sadly I log out in my off spec items ;/ on top of that i somehow cant copy anything here ... same for Qnote.. maybe I dont know something ... ill check it when im home.

 

Same for Log.. ill try to find last old one. But I dont think that you need a log to tell me your opener and what is your goal in  that opener.

 

<3 <3 <3

 

PS. And what about my log issue? Can I track dps on other side of spoils? Or it will be same bad as recount? And yes I have 4pc.    More <3

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It's fine that you love Infernals. But the people helping here assume you want to discuss the best openers dps wise and not the most cool/fun. So they respond to the Infernal since it is a mistake compared to the Doomguard from that perspective. And it's hard know which spells you are serious about and which are just pure fun.

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Agree. But I ask for openers and goals to achive in 1st 30 sec of fight. But I got only informations how Infernal suck. :] And I do not see anything wrong about it. Just its not the point I open a topic like this.

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I'm sorry to say this but you put down your opening rotation and you said you use infernal , yes I agree with other posters that infernal is bad but we do advise you to use the doomguard instead , you can take the criticism how you like but were being honest.

Ok you would like the nitty gritty opener , have havoc glyph, /focus , one of the dogs doesn't matter which one.

I use a buff macro which is

/cast dark soul

/use potion of the jade serpent

/cast (And any other buffs you can get)

Onto 1 macro saves a lot of time and clicking , they all go off at once.

Now to the rotation,

Start off with Incinerate one of the dogs,

Then hope trinkets proc

Then RoF (with 2dogs and the 2 bosses you should be getting embers lik crazy)

Then with all your buffs up and your 4 piece proc'ing use havoc and click on the dog you have focused and you can do

2x2 chaosbolt's and then just go into your normal rotation .

That's what I would do for you for now, but.......

You can use a mouseover macro or a focus macro if you want , for the shammy's fight I prefer a focus macro which I will put

On this post later as I'm on my phone at the moment,

But the reason why I prefer to use a focus macro over a mouseover macro is that they are bunched up together and easily miss clicked to one of the shammy's instead when your trying to get the doggy's down,

Also with the focus macro you don't have to worry about the chaosbolt going somewhere it shouldn't as long you have the other doggy on focus your laughing .

Some people would say 'why didn't you FnB , but that's all well and good but when you have the opportunity when your 4 piece proc's with all your buffs do you cast 2x2 chaosbolts or do you cast FnB and immolate, for me it's a no brainer.

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I don't like "1shot macros" I pop all cds 1 by 1 it give me more control overall. I already use 3 macros for Shadowburn 3 macros for Havoc 3 macros for pet special ability. Its for my target cast, mouseover and focus. I have 5 macros ( bind to my naga ) to target enemy by their name so I do not need to target by use of my cursor or tab <target = dogname cast X spell>   It just take me a bit time between pulls to copy them all from notebook. On top of that I have lots and lots more macros to help my reaction times. I swap them depends on my needs. I would love to have 100 + macro spots ;/

 

edit: I just press ALT + 5,6,7,8 on my naga and I have 4 targets with immolate. Just need to swap macros before pull. Maby this will help someone? Most of time people say im insane I do that rofl.

 

Also back to Infernal. I know he is BAD and its a waste of GCD but my guild kill Shamans with NO problems I do not need to do more dps. I would like to do more for my personal needs and if Infernal generate a lot more fun for me im going to use it every time I DO NOT NEED EXTRA DPS. Also doomguard dps is so little that I can get more out of better opener than him. Its like you say "play only destruction  because we discuss only #1 stuff every other thing does not matter" :]

So please drop that "infernal is crap" thing. I would love to get  more info about how you handle opener. Be it with Doomguard or not.

 

Also I hard cast 3-4 time immolate only if my meta gem proc like right after I pop DS while I still wait for trinkets to proc. Sotmetimes they proc before my meta gem. Had only few wipes and few kills so I did not test and learn it to perfect yet. Later on I use FnB Immolate, RoF, Chaos Bolt spam. Up to point we split them or both dogs die.

 

Im going to do 2x2 chaos bolts next week and FnB immolate. If we 1 shot again I need to wait another week to test different opener ;/ THATS my issue. I do not have any problems to do 330k on this fight and that's when rng hates me. I hope I will not forget to type /combatlog again.

 

Don't try to guide me on stuff that I already know and focus on what I ask for please.^,...,^ <3

 

edit: When I list my opener I type this " I like it more than anything else in game " to stop Doom>infernal discussion at start. But it fail thought ;/

Edited by Lotrix

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Ok looks like you have all the answers already.

So won't bother you anymore.

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But dont threat every new guy here like "noob" and that you need to learn him what I believe is  basic and core informations.

 

Agree. But I ask for openers and goals to achive in 1st 30 sec of fight. But I got only informations how Infernal suck. :] And I do not see anything wrong about it. Just its not the point I open a topic like this.

 

Also back to Infernal. I know he is BAD and its a waste of GCD but my guild kill Shamans with NO problems I do not need to do more dps. I would like to do more for my personal needs and if Infernal generate a lot more fun for me im going to use it every time I DO NOT NEED EXTRA DPS. Also doomguard dps is so little that I can get more out of better opener than him. Its like you say "play only destruction  because we discuss only #1 stuff every other thing does not matter" :]

So please drop that "infernal is crap" thing. I would love to get  more info about how you handle opener. Be it with Doomguard or not.

 

Question: Is English a second language for you? If so, what is your first language? 

 
Be less defensive man, people are trying to help you. Most of the people that come here and ask questions are at least some level of noob-ness and do need information that is basic and core to the class. 90% of the problems we find are simple snap shotting mistakes, the #1 core idea of destro. So when you make a post asking a question about your opener and you list a spell that has no place in it, people are going point it out. They aren't talking down to you or treating you like you suck, they are just starting with the basics and building from there.
 

Your first post is really hard to read, you say you have a question in the thread title about your opener on Dark Sham, but then you don't really ask a question about it. You list what you do and state what your goals are, but there is no question attached to it. Since you're posting "a question" we assume that you're asking what you're doing wrong or what you can do better, both of these include not using the Infernal. 

 

 

Don't try to guide me on stuff that I already know and focus on what I ask for please.^,...,^ <3

 

 

You're asking us to read your mind and only answer what you don't know, but we don't know what it is that you don't know so we can't tell you what you don't know, ya know? 

 

From what I can tell your only question about openers is what *we* do, right? Just an open ended question to gather information. Is that correct?

 

Liquidsteel, Nalar, Notoris, Zagam, and Killingjoke have all replied with the intent of helping you. We're a friendly bunch here and want to help, but if you keep snubbing them like you have than their willingness to offer their advice will quickly diminish.

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I learn English when i start play WoW. At first my friend explained me what all skills do and i took notes. I learn it on online guides up to point you see now. Sadly its not as good as i would like. Im from Poland. :) 

 

Some of you for me are gods. The work you do for this community is amazing. If not you i would be really behind in planing my rotations.

 

Sorry I understand my first post is not clear enough and generated misunderstanding. Later i try to explain you that what i actually need but it fail to.

 

 

Ok looks like you have all the answers already.

So won't bother you anymore.

 

Yes you provide me exacly what I need thank you. And it was this:

 

Now to the rotation,

Start off with Incinerate one of the dogs,
Then hope trinkets proc
Then RoF (with 2dogs and the 2 bosses you should be getting embers lik crazy)
Then with all your buffs up and your 4 piece proc'ing use havoc and click on the dog you have focused and you can do
2x2 chaosbolt's and then just go into your normal rotation .

 

 

And all Liquidsteel post was total miss of what i need but its still a good information for someone else.

 

Hmm, what is it with people and their fascination for the infernal.

 

All I ever see in LFR/Flex and even stuff like Ordos is people dropping Infernals/Abbysals everywhere. Even on single target, and most of the time they miss the impact!

 

If you're set on using the Infernal, you need to know how to use it.

 

First off - it brings a large radius AoE stun, which is decent.

 

Second - the damage it does is pathetic, however the damage it does when it lands (Infernal Awakening) is actually quite potent.

 

Third - the damage Infernal Awakening does is buffed by Metamorphosis, so the best time to use an Infernal is in demon form with Dark Soul up.

 

I think to make it worth it for Destruction/Affliction, it has to hit something like 8 targets at least. Doomguard will probably be doing about 1.5M damage, so you need to have Infernal do more than this to make it worth it.

 

As you say you just killed Spoils, you may find using Infernal on Thok when the bats come down a suitable time to use it. Get RoF down and a FnB Immolate on the bats, then summon your infernal on the clumped up pack to get a nice stun and hopefully some big impact damage. Second pot here too if you're struggling. Pop Unending Resolve and go to town on the bats, before Havocing the boss (with glyph) and copying 6 shadowburns into boss from the bats. 

 

You see the difference now?

 

If you feel im snubbing than im sorry i did not notice it. I also do not think im defensive its just that you guys talk about infernal how it should be used why its bad and when its good. When I try to get information about opener. 

 

I wouldn't use infernal in your opener.  It's a waste of a GCD that you could use casting something else.  Generally what I do is.

 

Pre-pot

 

DS

 

FnB Immolate

 

RoF

 

I try to build two embers as quickly as possible.  I glyph Havoc on this fight and cast 2 havocd chaos bolts before my trinkets run out.

 

Right from there I go into some FnB spam.  

 

 

This information. Where Killingjoke post his opener and goal he want to achieve. ( 2x2 chaos bolt before trinkets go out ) 

 

So i cast Chaos Bolt only with havoc? So embers spend on FnB will do more dmg than on CB?

Anymore ways to start shamans? 

 

Sorry if i did harm ;/ I really want to fix this topic. <3 I hope you understand me now. If not please let me know so ill just shut up ^^ no sense if we do not understand each other.

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I learn English when i start play WoW. At first my friend explained me what all skills do and i took notes. I learn it on online guides up to point you see now. Sadly its not as good as i would like. Im from Poland. smile.png

 

Sorry if i did harm ;/ I really want to fix this topic. <3 I hope you understand me now. If not please let me know so ill just shut up ^^ no sense if we do not understand each other.

 

 

Blame Google if this isn't right:

 

Witamy na forum Icy-żył, bardzo fajne, że tu jesteś.

 

No harm at all friend, just a little communication error, it happens. Glad you're here and that we could help out, you're welcome here any time - just be patient with us if we misunderstand anything. English is a complex and annoying language so I admire your ability to learn it from a game!

 

Fun fact, WoW is how I learned to type. I started playing when I was a young teen, trying to raid lead at 14 yrs old with no voice chat was truly hateful. Had to learn how to type fast to do it. I still rest my fingers on WASD when I type, even when I'm not in game.

 

Let us know if we can help more!

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I dig out old log from WoW Logs. 

 

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/HDbrFRKYPqwyGaxv#fight=38&type=damage-done&source=9

 

It was my first time on that boss on IJ HC. Its a mess in that report but maybe you like to look at it. 

 

Witamy na forum Icy-żył, bardzo fajne, że tu jesteś.

 

Well it Should be Lodowe Żyły. But close enough. ^,..,^ 

 

edit: Im Hellgrind in that fight btw. Two warlocks <3

Edited by Lotrix

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