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IndrekAamann

feral dps output whit better gear.

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So atm feral is average on dps ladders to u think they scale much better whit good gear  or they stay average? if to look lder expansions then they scaled up wery well whit better gear :P what is ur opinion?   

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So atm feral is average on dps ladders to u think they scale much better whit good gear  or they stay average? if to look lder expansions then they scaled up wery well whit better gear tongue.png what is ur opinion?   

 

Not sure where you are getting your numbers from, but Ferals are currently high-end damage for single target, not average. Our aoe is just terrible. To answer your questions, our scaling will be decent but we are not one of the classes that will likely become absurd in later tiers, we will probably drop down to middle of the pack. 

 

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T17P.html-> this is DPS at IL 630

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T17N.html-> this is DPS at IL 655

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T17M.html-> this is DPS at IL 685

 

Now, you can see that we are in top 5 of the first 2, and middle of the pack in the last. I believe this is largely due to Highmaul itemization, and we will spike back up for Blackrock Foundry (which has amazing gear for us), then probably settle in middle of the pack in the tier after Blackrock.

Edited by Bradykin

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well i myself was between ret and feral for raiding so i gues ret scales best whit bad gear  so  i guess dosnt matter much wich1 i pick they both are middlepack class later :P or am i missing something ?

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well i myself was between ret and feral for raiding so i gues ret scales best whit bad gear  so  i guess dosnt matter much wich1 i pick they both are middlepack class later tongue.png or am i missing something ?

 

Look at the links I posted, Ret is terrible in bad gear, whereas Feral is amazing. 

 

mathwise, Feral is currently stronger then Ret at every gear levels (in terms of raw damage).

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If your concern is to scale well with gear at all item levels, Feral is one of the best melee specs, only edged slightly by Fury. The highest of the high-end WoL Mythic parses have a lot of Retribution and Fury and only a couple scattered Ferals, but that's indicative of the normal raid composition of those groups.

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Not sure where you are getting your numbers from, but Ferals are currently high-end damage for single target, not average. Our aoe is just terrible. To answer your questions, our scaling will be decent but we are not one of the classes that will likely become absurd in later tiers, we will probably drop down to middle of the pack. 

 

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T17P.html-> this is DPS at IL 630

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T17N.html-> this is DPS at IL 655

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T17M.html-> this is DPS at IL 685

 

Now, you can see that we are in top 5 of the first 2, and middle of the pack in the last. I believe this is largely due to Highmaul itemization, and we will spike back up for Blackrock Foundry (which has amazing gear for us), then probably settle in middle of the pack in the tier after Blackrock.

 

Those links are using Blackrock Foundry gear by the way.  Which are indeed itemized a whole lot better, so these numbers should be taken with that in mind, also with the 4-piece set bonus and such.

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Those links are using Blackrock Foundry gear by the way.  Which are indeed itemized a whole lot better, so these numbers should be taken with that in mind, also with the 4-piece set bonus and such.

 

Hmm. I hadn't noticed that, thanks for pointing it out. 

 

I do have some qualms with the math behind feral simulations (I think the sim has some rotational errors) and they still have the old weapon enchants, but that does put a different perspective on it.

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@Bradykin

 

What exactly do you think is wrong about it?

 

Also, the you can sub out the old enchants for new ones yourself quite easily.

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@Bradykin

 

What exactly do you think is wrong about it?

 

Also, the you can sub out the old enchants for new ones yourself quite easily.

 

Yeah I'm going to play with it once I get back from class.

 

Thrash shouldn't be part of the single-target rotation with our current low amounts of mastery, that's the big obvious one for me. Beyond that, i'm going to have to analyze it further, but a lot of the logic feels off.

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The script was recently updated which (to my knowledge) better reflects the gear from BRF. 

 

Following the action priority list, it only calls to use Thrash if and when you have OoC while at 5 cp or you have already pooled energy and are at 5 cp while nothing needs refreshed (in real time this is when you have 15 sec on SR and 10 sec on Rip).  The rarity of the situation is reflected in the uptime of ~10%.

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The script was recently updated which (to my knowledge) better reflects the gear from BRF. 

 

Following the action priority list, it only calls to use Thrash if and when you have OoC while at 5 cp or you have already pooled energy and are at 5 cp while nothing needs refreshed (in real time this is when you have 15 sec on SR and 10 sec on Rip).  The rarity of the situation is reflected in the uptime of ~10%.

 

It's still wrong to use Thrash at the moment in those scenarios. I've done the math on this and talked to Stenhaldi about it, Thrash in current gear is not ever worth it single target.

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Yeah I'm going to play with it once I get back from class.

 

Thrash shouldn't be part of the single-target rotation with our current low amounts of mastery, that's the big obvious one for me. Beyond that, i'm going to have to analyze it further, but a lot of the logic feels off.

 

I believe that this is because the gear that they're current using does not exactly have low mastery.  [630] 55% / [655] 52.21% / [685] 55.93% (these are raid buffed).  So I can see this being enough to make Thrash worthwhile.  And if it wasn't only that, the T17 2-piece set bonus provides 1 energy every time an energy takes bleed damage.  So overall, I can see why they'd use Thrash every once in a while, especially on OoC procs, since you'd essentially be getting free energy and the damage is on par I'd think with that much mastery.

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I believe that this is because the gear that they're current using does not exactly have low mastery.  [630] 55% / [655] 52.21% / [685] 55.93% (these are raid buffed).  So I can see this being enough to make Thrash worthwhile.  And if it wasn't only that, the T17 2-piece set bonus provides 1 energy every time an energy takes bleed damage.  So overall, I can see why they'd use Thrash every once in a while, especially on OoC procs, since you'd essentially be getting free energy and the damage is on par I'd think with that much mastery.

 

I was refering to now, not with late blackrock gear, where i'm not sure if we would yet, but you are probably correct that in foundry we will return to using it in our rotation for single target.

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