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whiteknightfall

Raid Leader needs help with Frost Mage

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Hello Icy Veins Community,

 

 

I hope I'm posting this correctly as I'm not the mage in question, but their Raid Leader. Following the rules sticky'd, I have logs and armory posted at the bottom, and information about rotation a little further down.

 

 

A little bit of background, I lead a progression raiding team that's been running strong since the start of the expansion. Since day one, we've had a Frost Mage in our ranks. We've completed each tier of the expansion, with HoF/Terrace done after the nerf (stonewalled on Garalon) and ToT completed with a few weeks of Heroics to spare before Siege. Currently, we're progressing on Garrosh.

 

 

The reason I'm posting here is to hopefully get some better insight as to my Mage's performance in raid. I'm really concerned that their DPS is low for their gear level and has been low most of this expansion. Yet, while I want to help and get them where they should be, I don't play a Mage and have little idea what the problem could be. We're constantly wiping on Garrosh, and while I want to help our Mage, things are quickly getting to the point where I will have to cut them from raid as many feel they just aren't pulling their weight. On this fight specifically, they have issues getting aggro on Whirling Corruption adds and killing them, being able to interrupt as part of a rotation for Mind Controls, and survivability throughout the fight. In other fights, survivability has been a big issue, but almost consistantly, we can never seem to get their DPS up and over 200k regularly. And with an ilvl of 562 and some research on different DPS rankings, I'm thinking upwards of 300k+ is more where they should be. Though, on top of that, I have a guildie that has been trying to work with them as well who has made it seem like I expect too much from our Raiders, despite a progression-oriented environment, and that this Mage's DPS is average and enough to get us through the content. With an attitude of "we've made it this far", is my expectation of their DPS at this item level too high? Is an average DPS of 150k - 220k on buff fights like Sha of Pride normal?

 

 

As for our Mage's rotation specifically, I'm not sure what they do. I push all of my raid towards Icy Vein's guides and do the same for myself, so I expect the listed rotation for Frost is being followed. I do know they've been going through a few different rotation addons, including "Mage Nuggets" most recently, though I'm not sure what addons are currently being used. In earlier attempts to help, I've noticed some issues with talents and glyphs that weren't what Icy Veins suggested, and also moved them from using Incanter's Ward through most of ToT to now using Invocation and trying to get that uptime up and over 90%. However, even with what I've looked into, on the fights where that buff is high 80s or above, their DPS still seems low and I've really run out of ideas.

 

 

I'm posting logs (we use World of Logs, I've only recently heard of warcraftlogs) on our last good night of Garrosh progression (4% wipe), our last run through all of Siege up to Spoils, and an Armory link.

 

 

If anybody smarter in the ways of Mage than I can give me some insight, I would appreciate. I don't want to kick anybody if I'm wrong about the situation or if somebody can be helped, but I can't keep going as we are unless something changes.

 

 

Thanks for your time!

 

 

---

 

 

Log Garrosh: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/vj6g9uhqxt7zo8y7/details/8/?s=9448&e=9976

 

 

Log Immerseus - Spoils: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/gypvs9f9c7odo9cb/details/5/

 

 

Armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/thunderhorn/Alatariella/advanced

 

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Ok, from the Armory, I'm noticing the mage in question still uses Wushoolay's Final Choice, which really isn't optimal for this tier. Drops are beyond your control, but either Kardris' Toxic Totem off of Dark Shamans, or Black Blood of Y'saarj off of Garrosh (once you finally down him) would both be great upgrades. In addition, Ice Barrier is a dps loss. Temporal Shield is much better.

 

 

Looking at logs, specifically Iron Juggernaut and Malkorok:

 

Iron Juggernaut:

-Living Bomb uptime is only 81.5%, this needs to be higher.

-Invoker's Energy uptime is only 88.4%, this needs to be higher.

-41 Brain Freeze procs, only 33 Frostfire Bolt casts. Dps loss.

-Flamestrike used...really not a good ability for single target, ever.

-19 Fingers of Frost procs, LOTS of Ice Lance casts.Ice Lance should never be cast without the proc.

 

Malkorok:

-Living Bomb uptime is 87.2%, this should be at 100% on this fight.

-Invoker's Energy uptime is at 92.1%. Not bad, could still improve.

-33 Brain Freeze procs, only 26 Frostfire Bolt casts.

-Again, Flamestrike...BAD for single target.

-17 Fingers of Frost procs, but 36 Ice Lance casts. Never cast Ice Lance without FoF proc.

-only used Icy Veins and Alter Time once, should've been able to use twice.

-Good thing on Malkorok, there were no missed spell casts, but still need to fix that hit cap.

 

I'm sure Oltier and/or Akraen will take a look and give some more excellent advice, but that's something to start with.

 

Edit: Removed derp mistake on hit cap :P

Edited by Elro
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Pretty sure hit cap is 15% Elro! Whilst you are still correct, he/she could still probably optimize his/her gear by getting it closer to 15%

Edited by Wetty
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Pretty sure hit cap is 15% Elro! Whilst you are still correct, he/she could still probably optimize his/her gear by getting it closer to 15%

 

This is correct. Caster hit cap went to 15 percent at the beginning of MoP. This brings it in-line with the melee 7.5 hit/7.5 expertise targets.

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First, as a disclaimer, I don't play my frost mage competitively.  If literally anyone says I'm wrong, believe them instead of me.

Re: ice lance, I think it's possible he's casting it when he has to move.  He might also be casting it stationary without procs (bad), can't tell from logs.  Both Malkorok and Iron Juggernaut provide ample opportunities where Ice Lance on the move isn't inherently unreasonable, although Ice Floes is still better.  On Malkorok, Blazing Speed isn't as bad (if it helps you get a single imploding energy, it was worth it), though no usage of tier-1 talent on Juggernaut seems bizarre.  Re; flamestrike, I'll drop AoEs under the Norushen boss before he becomes attackable, but other than that I agree completely.

 

I'm also noticing that he doesn't seem to be pre-potting.  Or if he is, he's forgetting to use the second one in the next round of CDs.  (I had that problem for awhile.)  With the shenanigans that is Alter Time, snagging a trinket proc (Wushalay's is easy to predict, if nothing else) and a potion for those extra 6 seconds while you pop everything (and snapshot your bomb, naturally) is nontrivial burst.

 

I have a feeling that CD-usage is the real culprit here.  There's little things that can be nitpicked at, but I don't feel like they're going to add up to 50k fight dps.  Bomb snapshotting, alter time + potions and CDs, that might add up to quite a lot, though.

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You were asking what range his single-target damage should be in, so I SIMmed the toon for you.  You an see some of the results below.  It looks like a good player with his gear and talent choices should be doing an around 307K dps on a single-target light movement fight of 4.5 to 7 minutes (looking at your logs, I probably should have chosen a shorter fight time frame, so be aware of that), with a range of 270k-355k.  So, to answer your question, yes, he can be doing more.  Please note that this is just a simulation and should be used as one tool for analysis, not the only answer.  The damage sources graph should help you to get a better idea of what spells your friend should be casting and what percentage of his damage they should account for.  It's a good starting tool for evaluating the logs of a class you are unfamiliar with.  (Obviously there are circumstances where people choose to cast other things for all sorts of relevant reasons, but these graphs are a good starting place.)

 

292s0g7.jpg

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I'm also noticing that he doesn't seem to be pre-potting.  Or if he is, he's forgetting to use the second one in the next round of CDs.  (I had that problem for awhile.)  With the shenanigans that is Alter Time, snagging a trinket proc (Wushalay's is easy to predict, if nothing else) and a potion for those extra 6 seconds while you pop everything (and snapshot your bomb, naturally) is nontrivial burst.

 

I have a feeling that CD-usage is the real culprit here.  There's little things that can be nitpicked at, but I don't feel like they're going to add up to 50k fight dps.  Bomb snapshotting, alter time + potions and CDs, that might add up to quite a lot, though.

 

CD usage on Malkorok actually looks ok, not good, but ok.  It does look like he missed the pre-pot and he didn't use alter time with icy veins/potion at the beginning of the fight, although he did line up alter time with icy veins at the end.  He did cast icy veins and berserking twice.  It looks like he is using an icy veins/mirror image/berserking macro.  So, yes, his cd use isn't great, but it's ok.  I don't know how much of an effect cd use has, as I'm relatively new to mages myself, but this doesn't look to be the only culprit, although it's certainly a piece of the puzzle.  

 

4j9npj.jpg

Edited by Jariyah

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Ohh, I can't believe I misremembered hit cap xD

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Please note that simcraft is inaccurate and essentially ass for frost mages. Elro's comments are pretty accurate apart from the hitcap (15%). Using flamestrike in single target shows that your mage has pretty much no idea what he's doing, especially combined with the liberal use of normal ice lances, low uptimes and a lot of wasted brain freeze procs. So the short story is that yeah he's probably pretty bad and he also clearly hasn't done any research on his class/spec.

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Please note that simcraft is inaccurate and essentially ass for frost mages. 

 

Hmm, haven't read that anywhere before.  Just for my edification, do you have a link that explains why it isn't useful for frost?

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Hi there, I'm that link.

 

The problem lies in the decision making, I think. If we had no alter time or proc/buffs or snapshotting then it would be very accurate. Too much decision making exists for frost mage. The swings from those types of decision making are tough, it's like programming a robot to prepare a 5-star meal, sure it can maybe put the ingredients together but programming finesse is pretty difficult. Doable, but generally not for niche hobbies like WoW.

 

Anyway it's not super far off-base, but depending on how you set up a profile on simcraft, it's either going to have you do some stuff that isn't humanly possible (which is why Noxxic puts frost mages above warlocks), or it's going to suggest you do weird things (like only stack mastery and use rune of power).

 

Because of the strange outcomes in simcraft for Frost, it's strongly advised to not even attempt to use it for reference. That's why I've spent countless hours working on guides and making informative posts: because I don't want players to fall for traps and end up adopting unideal practices that usually are great-- but not this patch. I need to reiterate, the problem isn't simcraft, it's how the code interfaces with our class abilities and priorities.

 

There are ways to use simcraft, for example - if you just want to see how much x spellpower will increase your damage from frostbolt, simcraft works. But Lhivera's TheoryCraft-o-Matic Lite works better and is what I tend to use for quick calculations and when I build my own profiles in Microsoft Excel (like my Malkorok Analysis tool).

 

The mage in the OP will never, ever be able to reach 300k+ DPS in his/her gear. I guarantee it. The most they could hope for with their trinkets and itemization is 260k or so. My analysis tool says they should reasonably be able to do 247k DPS (based off if they had perfect uptimes based off the damage they do).

 

I've analyzed in great detail this mage. I can't find a nicer way to say this: they are playing like a drunk singing karaoke. Very erratic gameplay with some decisions like their Alter Time which were very expert, indicating they understand how to do things, but then some decisions as though they've been living in a cave (no glyph of Icy Veins). Here's a more detailed look at my analysis:

 

q6VJKfJ.png

 

Conclusion: I've seen much worse, actually. But this is the weirdest mage I've ever seen... He's choosing to play in a very strange way that doesn't make sense to me or to the numbers. If he would like to chat on #icy-veins IRC (quakenet.org 6667) I will be happy to chat with him.

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Hi there, I'm that link.

 

The problem lies in the decision making, I think. If we had no alter time or proc/buffs or snapshotting then it would be very accurate. Too much decision making exists for frost mage. The swings from those types of decision making are tough, it's like programming a robot to prepare a 5-star meal, sure it can maybe put the ingredients together but programming finesse is pretty difficult. Doable, but generally not for niche hobbies like WoW.

 

Anyway it's not super far off-base, but depending on how you set up a profile on simcraft, it's either going to have you do some stuff that isn't humanly possible (which is why Noxxic puts frost mages above warlocks), or it's going to suggest you do weird things (like only stack mastery and use rune of power).

 

Because of the strange outcomes in simcraft for Frost, it's strongly advised to not even attempt to use it for reference. That's why I've spent countless hours working on guides and making informative posts: because I don't want players to fall for traps and end up adopting unideal practices that usually are great-- but not this patch. I need to reiterate, the problem isn't simcraft, it's how the code interfaces with our class abilities and priorities.

 

There are ways to use simcraft, for example - if you just want to see how much x spellpower will increase your damage from frostbolt, simcraft works. But Lhivera's TheoryCraft-o-Matic Lite works better and is what I tend to use for quick calculations and when I build my own profiles in Microsoft Excel (like my Malkorok Analysis tool).

 

The mage in the OP will never, ever be able to reach 300k+ DPS in his/her gear. I guarantee it. The most they could hope for with their trinkets and itemization is 260k or so. My analysis tool says they should reasonably be able to do 247k DPS (based off if they had perfect uptimes based off the damage they do).

 

I've analyzed in great detail this mage. I can't find a nicer way to say this: they are playing like a drunk singing karaoke. Very erratic gameplay with some decisions like their Alter Time which were very expert, indicating they understand how to do things, but then some decisions as though they've been living in a cave (no glyph of Icy Veins). Here's a more detailed look at my analysis:

 

q6VJKfJ.png

 

Conclusion: I've seen much worse, actually. But this is the weirdest mage I've ever seen... He's choosing to play in a very strange way that doesn't make sense to me or to the numbers. If he would like to chat on #icy-veins IRC (quakenet.org 6667) I will be happy to chat with him.

 

 

Thank you for your response and apologies to the OP for hijacking your post!  Please forgive all of my questioning, I'm very new to mage and trying to understand as much as I can!  After a year off, catching up on a whole missed tier on a new class over the last five weeks has been a daunting task! 

 

Anyway, to my question, 260k seems really low.  Is it because the gear is so poorly itemized that the stats aren't as useful or are you saying based on this particular mage's skill level/play style?

 

Completely anecdotal and I understand that trinkets and tier sets can have huge effects, but my 552 mage with lfr/flex trinks (granted bis trinks, just low lvl) and no legendary items did 250k on Malkorok.  I'd hate to think that 10 ilvls is only a 10k increase.  Again, just trying to understand so that when my RLer comes to me and says "what can you do to put more damage out" I can have a better idea of how to figure out if I'm where I should be or if I'm doing something wrong.  Although I love the advice you and Oltier offer, I want to be more self-sufficient and not waste your time posting logs every time I hit a snag!     

Edited by Jariyah

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If he replaced Wushoolay's with KTT or BBoY he'd gain about 18-22k DPS, yes it's that big of a difference.

 

He also has some of the worst itemized pieces around.

 

Item level is ridiculous now, yes, but the pieces themselves matter a lot too. For example, a 574 mage who has a 580 weapon & 580 trinkets will outdps a 579 mage who has 580s in all slots except weapon and trinkets.

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Although I love the advice you and Oltier offer, I want to be more self-sufficient and not waste your time posting logs every time I hit a snag!     

 

We are looking for ways to somehow make a self-analysis tool that just imports a warcraftlogs file and makes an output that looks like the one Akraen posted. smile.png

 

But this will take a lot of time and we have no ETA at all when it could be ready.

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Thank you for all the valuable feedback!

 

 

It's actually a great relief to see from experienced Mages that things aren't great, certainly, but they don't seem to be as bad as I thought (300k+ dps to be expected right now). I think my mage is sitting naked in Thunderbluff right now about halfway to 30, so needless to say, I can read a guide on rotations and roll something 90 on the PTR, but that doesn't make me a seasoned expert at the class by any means.

 

The graph made on how much DPS is being missed clearly explained a lot. I hope this tool you're developing for Logs goes well, I think it would really change the landscape for honest up-and-coming raiders for the better. Especially Raid Leaders like me who enjoy tanking and don't know much beyond rotation guides on other classes, yet want to help.

 

 

I'll be honest, you talk about weapons/trinkets and such meaning THAT MUCH of a DPS increase, I can believe it, but I wasn't aware anywhere near to that extent. Our entire raid has suffered greatly from Loot RNG; I can't say there is anyone in the raid who picked up full, quality trinkets from ToT (N) and replaced both of them by now. I think a few have picked up what they're wearing, plus the Cleaving trinket, but as I understand it, outside of AOE fights, it was a quality downgrade in steady DPS. If I'm wrong, please, tell me, it was sad to see almost everyone get another trinket inside a 2 week span and it turn out to be crap 3/4 of the raid.

 

 

All being said, I'll set them up with the information laid out here and see if a few slight changes can clear up that last 50k of DPS to where it needs to be. Going from 190ish to 250ish on Garrosh would be a god-send at this point.

 

 

Thanks again!

 

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If he gets a cleave trinket that's 12 item levels higher than his Wushoolay's trinket, so basically Flex or better, then it's worth him equipping it over Wushoolay's just because of the int proc.

 

But yeah not much we can do about loot RNG :(

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your mage could definitely be doing more, but it really depends on what type of environment you try to set for your raid team.  in these logs from last week i was 552 no legendary cape (currently 554) frost

 

shamans: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/jq571c4tkb8x3qvn/sum/damageDone/?s=1947&e=2206

juggernaut: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-1uea9ys5xrsxco9h/sum/damageDone/?s=9437&e=9753

malkorok: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/jq571c4tkb8x3qvn/sum/damageDone/?s=3865&e=4108

 

you can compare them with yours if you want but idk whether your mages dps is acceptable is really up to you and how strong you guys are looking to be.  if its more of a relaxed environment i would say its fine although maybe they could tweak a couple things here and there, but if youre looking to go much further then maybe you guys need to talk it out

 

also is your mage on engineers for garrosh?

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also is your mage on engineers for garrosh?

I hope he is not.. What a waste of DPS...

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your mage could definitely be doing more, but it really depends on what type of environment you try to set for your raid team.  in these logs from last week i was 552 no legendary cape (currently 554) frost

 

shamans: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/jq571c4tkb8x3qvn/sum/damageDone/?s=1947&e=2206

juggernaut: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-1uea9ys5xrsxco9h/sum/damageDone/?s=9437&e=9753

malkorok: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/jq571c4tkb8x3qvn/sum/damageDone/?s=3865&e=4108

 

you can compare them with yours if you want but idk whether your mages dps is acceptable is really up to you and how strong you guys are looking to be.  if its more of a relaxed environment i would say its fine although maybe they could tweak a couple things here and there, but if youre looking to go much further then maybe you guys need to talk it out

 

also is your mage on engineers for garrosh?

I know you didn't post these for me, but for the raid leader, however, I'm glad you did!  My mage is very similarly geared to yours and my numbers look similar.  Unless we're both doing it wrong, makes me a little more confident in what I'm doing! So, thanks! :D

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So, as the 'drunk singing Karaoke'...*sigh*.  

 

I was using firestrike because it was in the lineup that I read here, on icy veins.  I do prepot, and yes, there are times I forget to hit the second cooldown, especially on Juggernaut and Malkorok...which are practically on farm for our raid.  There are some that are still difficult for us, like the shamans...etc..but some are just easy/ier.

 

Some of the icelance use was for moving, some of it was because I forgot they fire by themselves when stacked at 5.  Swear it would be nice if that was more apparent..just like it would be nice to see the icy boulder that is supposed to fall when you have all 4 tier.  

 

No, I don't have the icy veins glyph because I like haste.  I did have the splitting ice one for a while but recently changed that out for cone of cold specificially for garrosh and his adds.  I keep the evocation glyph so that I have a handy little heal to help out on healing...part of that survivability thing that the raid leader who posted this wanted me to work on.  

 

So..yes..I do research...I read...I work at my mage.  I'm not perfect.  Apparently I play like a drunk monkey in some people's opinions.  Well...you haven't actually seen me..you just see the logs.  They are part of the story and a good part...but not the whole thing.  

 

The main take away I get from this is that I needed a better trinket...which I already knew.  Been trying to get one for a long time now.  The opinion that ice barrier is a dps loss is interesting...might have to see if the temporal shield is helpful or not...the times I've switched to it before didn't go so well, but that was a while ago.  

 

I wouldn't mind talking to you, Akraen, but frankly I'm a little overwhelmed by all this...at least you were somewhat kind in your post and helpful along with the critical.  The sad thing is I've gone back and forth from being called 'very good' to being almost kicked out of the raid...(when I was very good it wasn't with this group...it was back in ICC)  It's frustrating to feel like nothing I try works.

 

Ala

Edited by Alatariella
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I think you'll find Akraen's drunk monkey comment more as an entertaining way to explain confusion, and not so much as meaning to be insulting. :) He's a super helpful dude :)

 

Mages manytimes seem to be one of those classes that crash and burn with just a few minor screwups/misses.

 

You should chat with him! I'm sure in a couple weeks you'll be cranking along again after you've been able to chit chat back and forth and start narrowing down the changes.

 

My dps is somewhat low but that's usually because I have no-one to talk to on a regular basis I think. My server is crazy far behind on progression (I'm not entirely certain we even HAVE a full heroic clear yet on the server. Might be mistaken) so I don't get a chance to chitchat on Ventrillo and raid alongside other mages much.

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So, as the 'drunk singing Karaoke'...*sigh*.  

 

I was using firestrike because it was in the lineup that I read here, on icy veins.  I do prepot, and yes, there are times I forget to hit the second cooldown, especially on Juggernaut and Malkorok...which are practically on farm for our raid.  There are some that are still difficult for us, like the shamans...etc..but some are just easy/ier.

 

Some of the icelance use was for moving, some of it was because I forgot they fire by themselves when stacked at 5.  Swear it would be nice if that was more apparent..just like it would be nice to see the icy boulder that is supposed to fall when you have all 4 tier.  

 

No, I don't have the icy veins glyph because I like haste.  I did have the splitting ice one for a while but recently changed that out for cone of cold specificially for garrosh and his adds.  I keep the evocation glyph so that I have a handy little heal to help out on healing...part of that survivability thing that the raid leader who posted this wanted me to work on.  

 

So..yes..I do research...I read...I work at my mage.  I'm not perfect.  Apparently I play like a drunk monkey in some people's opinions.  Well...you haven't actually seen me..you just see the logs.  They are part of the story and a good part...but not the whole thing.  

 

The main take away I get from this is that I needed a better trinket...which I already knew.  Been trying to get one for a long time now.  The opinion that ice barrier is a dps loss is interesting...might have to see if the temporal shield is helpful or not...the times I've switched to it before didn't go so well, but that was a while ago.  

 

I wouldn't mind talking to you, Akraen, but frankly I'm a little overwhelmed by all this...at least you were somewhat kind in your post and helpful along with the critical.  The sad thing is I've gone back and forth from being called 'very good' to being almost kicked out of the raid...(when I was very good it wasn't with this group...it was back in ICC)  It's frustrating to feel like nothing I try works.

 

Ala

Dohhh don't take it too personally. I've been in parties so drunk that I requested to sing Pinball Wizard on Rockband. We've all played like drunks before. tongue.png

 

My hope was to help show you how big of a deal some small choices are, and how small of a deal big choices are.

 

You claim that you don't use the IV glyph because you like haste. Hi, I'm Akraen, Lord of Haste. If I'm telling you to skip the haste, I must be right-- my entire reputation is based off my initial forum arguments in favor of haste. That's why there's the haste build, which I encourage you take a look at if you love the feel of haste like I do. But no matter how much you love haste, the glyph is required-- sorry. 

 

Anyway I calculated that you lost over 13k DPS because of just one glyph. So would you like to do 13k DPS more? If so, get the glyph. Use Glyph of IV, Splitting Ice, & Evocate. Cone of Cold is fun but pretty much only as skill shots with 2pc buff, so don't worry about that glyph.

 

When I saw your parse, I saw panic. Confusion, panic, hasty choices, and bad timing. I don't mean this as an insult, I just think you need more practice and to be calm during boss fights. Do you listen to music when you raid? Watch TV? Drink? Do you have a loud, mean raid leader with a New Jersey accent? I think whatever is either distracting you or giving you anxiety is your problem above and beyond anything else.

 

Flamestrike is only in the IV guide to be used when you know adds are spawning. I think you must've just misread that.

 

Anyway, at the end of the day - I'm just trying to help ya. The humor is just to help make it less serious, not to make you feel worse for problems that might make you a lower ranking mage, but no matter what - you're not a lower ranking person or raider as long as you constantly strive to better yourself.

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*sigh*  So I saw the use of flamestrike on icy veins in a buildup countdown.  It made sense to me when I looked at it because it had the tic on it since frost doesn't have as many things that dot.  Obviously using it at other times is a waste based on responses I've seen...but I was experimenting..because of that dot it was adding.  I am guessing other mages only use it on the countdown and/or for aoe purposes.  

 

second, I'm a mother, sometimes my girls are in bed and all is good, sometimes that's not the case.  It's complicated as my youngest has a serious illness.  I am not saying that is what is going on...but sometimes they are distracting.  Other times I am learning whatever new strat our raid leader is having us do.  

 

We were almost hitting phase four on garrosh before christmas...took a break and came back.  The raid started a completely different strat of only one healer.  It took a while to get used to the change.

 

As to myself, I've loved haste ever since ICC, and I was arcane then.  I went frost this expansion because it gives just a bit more mobility for me.  I'd love to take a look at the haste build.  I've missed some of the forum posts because I was looking for specifics...and math confuses the hell out of me.  I use Mr. Robot to help with gear choices...etc.  

 

Ala

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No sighs, stop that - be happy!

 

If the constant urge to perform better wasn't a happy experience for me, I would not be doing this!

 

I think it's a good thing for -everyone- no matter if they're 1/14 LFR or 14/14H to always ask themselves if they're enjoying what they're doing-- if they aren't, change it!

 

I also recognize that -you- did not make the OP, your raid leader did. That might be a conversation worth having too :P

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