Mythic Archi specific tips + Sub rotation

3 posts in this topic

Hey guys

So my wife has been progressing on Mythic Archi for a while with her guild and her dps is definitely on the low side. She is still not 100% used to the subtlety rotation so that's probably one of the reasons but I was hoping one of you could give some specific tips to increase her DPS on Archi.

Here's her armory (739 ilvl)

Here's some logs from today

Last week:

If anyone feels like they're willing to chat with her on mumble or something and give her some tips, that would be great too, I feel like that's probably the easiest way for her to learn and see what she is doing wrong/different.

I play a ret pally and have 0 experience with rogues so I can't tell her how to do sub, just trying to be a helpful husband here and help her out a bit. Doing low dps is definitely getting to her and it's stressing her out a bit.

Appreciate any help guys! Thanks

Edited by TheGamingCouple

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok well before breaking anything down too much, I'd like to suggest working on her opener. 


I took a quick look through about 5 of the logs from the first set you linked - in each one of them, the opener is different. This leads me to believe that she isn't sure what she should be doing, and there weren't any logs from any other bosses to prove otherwise.


The opener should be:

  • Premed 11s before the pull
  • SnD 1s before the pull
  • Vanish + Prepot on the pull
  • Shadow Reflection
  • Rupture
  • Shadow Dance
  • Preparation (first free gcd inside Shadow Dance, normally with around 2.5-1.5 seconds remaining)
  • Vanish (after Dance

Practicing this and pulling it off properly is crucial, since it takes advantage of all your cooldowns and procs and multiplies them all with Soul Cap. Practice this on a target dummy for an hour or two minimum... I'm not kidding, the first 15-20 seconds of a fight should be complete muscle memory , since they shouldn't change at all every time.


I also checked the longest fight for uptimes on her maintenance spells - 81% uptime on Rupture is very very low, as is 91% on SnD (although it's better). I would suggest that an absolute minimum of 98% on both be a target to reach for, if not 100%.


If you want to pm me to talk in Mumble or whatever feel free, and we can try to set up a time

2 people like this

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks so much, passed on the info, she'll be practicing it this weekend, I'll pm you her ID aswell, she should be available most of the weekend, pretty sure that having a chat with her on mumble would help her out even more. 

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Bunbohue
      Now with patch 7.1.5 out and the boots/talent energy refund being nerfed, does energetic stabbing become our most sought after relic trait?
      Is there any order of best > worst amongst the relic traits?
    • By Annaky
      Hi guys,
      First of all, sorry about my bad english, but i'll try to write well here.
      I'm returning to play with my rogue and trying to get him to at least heroic contend on the atual content.
      The guild made a run last night all through Normal EN and Nyth HC, and I was a little disappointed with my performance...
      Can u guys help me?
      I already saw that I could improve in SoD uptime, but i'm having problems with my energy management.
      Any help you suggest I'll be very grateful.
      Thanks in advance.
    • By Dyldoe
      So right now I play Sub as my main spec. I mained outlaw for the first week or so of Legion and honestly I hated sub (not sure why) but after I tried it, it is now my preferred spec among the 3. I know that sub scales the best with gear and is the most superior spec around 870ilv too. I never see sub in pve and usually outlaw/sin mainly (for mythic+ and raids) so I was wondering if I am doing anything wrong?
      For my talents, I use weaponmaster as it is very good for aoe pulls (I can pull about 400k dps on 3-4 targets) then followed by the traditional talents for pve sub (I go master of subtlety for raids) 
      I know my stats are not the best for sub as I need to get more mastery/vers rather than haste (crit is still pretty good if i'm correct)
      I couldn't spec into Akaari's Soul as it breaks cc in pvp with means I loose a hefty amount of dps which is very annoying and I am debating to repsec into it and put up with it in pvp for the extra dps increase.
      My weapon pathing looks like this:
      I seem to be doing everything correctly for dps but I do about 250-300k dps on single target and stays about 200k the whole time. Sometimes can go up to 350-400k depending on how smooth the fight goes but if it's anything to do with my weapon/talents/ilv/stats and even playstyle then please let me know, thanks!
      Edit: I have respecced my weapon to now look like this: 
      I should be doing better now ^^ Appreciate the help 
    • By Ysondrae
      Given the logs i checked recently for all bosses in EN heroic and normal for almost all dps specs (not only rogue), it seems sub rogues lack about 40k+ dps on average compared to lets say unholy DKs for most of the fights so maximising dps is essential if someone of our specc would want to not be stepped on by other "op" speccs in mythic raiding .Since there are no real advanced guides yet for sub rogues I am making this post so people can see some advanced tips for sub rogues and at the same time receiving feedback if anyone thinks i am missing something or saying something wrong.
      -1.1:The first point i would like to make here is that i think it is a dps gain if you refresh nightblade on 6 seconds if you got finality but not when you dont have it. So when i dont have finality i refresh it at ~=1 sec so i dont lose much dps
      -1.2:Regarding how i do my rotation and plan out my combo points(without hero/Shadow blades), when i have lets say just got out of SD and have around 30-40 energy i mostly wait only autoattacking expecting to get 1 cp from autoattacks while pooling energy and then at around 100+energy i SD-SS-SS-Finisher-SS-SS-wait for 1 cp -Finisher, this way i get 2 finishers with a single shadow dance pretty fast and i almost never run out of shadow dance charges in most Single target situations
      -1.3:Shadow blades: I would really like to know how shadow blades are supposed to be used. It doesnt give any extra damage and the +1 cp ,given the above rotation, will make little difference in dps. I mostly use it when i have pooled like 150 energy and have no SD charges just as a SD recharge mechanism using only backstab to build CP. This way i recharge 1.5-2 SD charges.Is it actually worth it popping it on hero? I would appreciate feedback on this from anyone who knows a more wise way to use it.
      -1.4:For aoe situations: With the recent changes for Sub they are pretty decent in aoe. The question i have is on how many targets is it worth it to ShurinkenSTorm instead of SS (in shadow dance state) to build cp. What i do on 3+(long living) targets is using storm to get CP and focus on keeping up nightblade on all targets.
      2)Regarding the talents i am always using 1-2-3-1-1-1-1 on all bosses currently in EN. I have seen that the only discussable talent change would be Deeper stratagem over VIgor. I prefer VIgor not only because it leaves for a bigger error window in the rotation but also because i cant see how Deeper stratagem is preferred by some people over Vigor. I mean according to logs i see many people on high % ranks with Deeper stratagem but me myself cant rly figure out how it plays out so good for them. So i have some questions
      -2.1:Are you aiming always for 6 cp finishers?
      -2.2:What happens if you want to refresh Symbols with only 100 max energy? For me it doesnt work out good because most times i lose like 1 second(or 1 shadowstrike) of SD from the lack of energy.Whereas with vigor it just fits perfect on the rotation as i have said above.If there is anyone using deeper stratagem and is really sure about his rotation give some feedback over it i would appreciate it 
      I would appreciate any feedback on any of the topics. My logs are these
      Make sub rogues great again! :P
    • By Drueger
      So as my raid starts to progress into mythic (Strength in All @ Stormrage) and I don't have any other rogues on the team to talk to, I want to compare and contrast rotations/openers.  I've been pulling top 5 dps so I know I'm doing something right (69-80k DPS (W/ 726 Ilvl) depending on fight mechanics)(Also keeping near 100% uptimes on rupture and S&D) 



      Opener: Prep @ -10 sec, Pot + Slice&Dice ~1.5 sec, Shadow Reflect > Ring & Vanish > Rupture > Ambush until Subterfuge is done ( usually burn some CPs for an extra ambush)


      Rotation after opener: dump CPs, pool energy until Find Weakness (FW) is nearly down, Shadow dance, Ambushes, wait for FW to go down, Vanish / Shadowmeld + Prep + Ambush (If vanish is 10+ seconds on CD)

      Rinse and repeat.


      So my main question here is it better to pair Shadow Reflection with ring or with Shadowmeld(EDIT: ShadowDance), I've experimented with both and they pull similar numbers.