Blainie

Max Camera Distance in WoW

10 posts in this topic

fGcSaJH.png

For years, players have used a script to "unlock" the maximum camera distance in game. In Legion, the maximum distance will now be restricted to nearly half as far.

Let's start this off by looking at the blue post from Watcher over on the forums. 

Blizzard LogoWatcher on Camera Distance

This is one of this changes that we realize will be intensely unpopular with the group of players that has used console/WTF CVars to increase camera zoom beyond what the UI slider permits. For everyone else, they probably won't see what the big deal is, since it's removing a hidden option that most never used. But for those who are accustomed to an increased max zoom, it's changing the way you're experiencing the game in a way that feels restrictive and simply worse. So why would we do that?

In a broad range of gaming genres (from RTS to Action RPG), being able to zoom out and see more of the world around you provides an objective advantage in the form of information. Due to that competitive advantage, camera-unlocking or increased zoom distance are features commonly found in third-party hacks for a variety of games. Whatever the maximum allowed, that's what competitive players will use in order to maximize performance, even at the expense of the game's overall look and feel. 

We strongly believe that there needs to be parity in this area between players who are using the default UI and those who have addons or knowledge of hidden console variables. One option was certainly to just allow the in-game slider to go all the way up to the CVar hardcap. But that scale is beyond the one around which the game was designed at its core. The development team builds the world, its art, its combat mechanics, and other interactions, around the base UI experience and scale. At the 3.4-CVar zoom level, your heroic Warcraft avatar takes up about as much screen-space as one of the dozens of marines you might control in a game of Starcraft.

Basically all of us started out playing WoW at the UI-enabled zoom level, and fell in love with that world enough that we now find ourselves here posting on an expansion beta forum discussing its future. At some point, we saw a raid video and wondered how they could see so much of the field at once, or we saw a forum post or got a helpful tip from another player, and learned that if you typed "/console CameraDistanceMaxFactor 4" you could zoom out way more, and we never looked back. But was that original experience bad, or have we just grown accustomed to something different?

There may also be a bit of hyperbole in the discussion around the change. This is a screenshot I just took with the max UI-selectable zoom settings in the current Legion build: http://i.imgur.com/e8vFT6t.jpg

I'm not sure it's fair to say that this level of zoom entails your character dominating the screen, or removes all awareness of nearby threats.

Finally, why did this happen suddenly now, late in the beta cycle, seemingly without any communication? Honestly, the intent was for the change to have been in place from early alpha onwards. I believe that what happened was that one of the CVars (CameraDistanceMaxFactor?) was clamped from the start, but a second CVar (CameraDistanceMax?) was overlooked. That issue was entered and tracked as a bug, and was just fixed recently. As a development team, at this point we're fixing up to 2000 Legion bugs a week, and it's not always obvious which player-facing build will contain a particular one of those fixes. This clearly wasn't something we ever imagined could just be swept under the carpet.

(source)

We can very clearly see where the development team's thinking lies, but is it really being considered in the context of the gameplay itself?

The screenshot provided by Watcher is a simple shot, with nobody around him and in an empty zone. If we consider this change in regards to raiding, it paints a slightly different picture. Take Archimonde as an example; the boss is huge, he has mechanics that happen 50+ yards away from the melee, you have to find your character in the middle of all the other melee, hunter pets and mechanics, and still focus on the boss. I understand that the developers want us to experience the art as it was intended, but staring at Archimonde's hooves while your character joins a mosh pit underneath him isn't exactly a positive experience, at least in my opinion.

It's also important to note that this will severely hinder the field of view of, for example, a raid leader that plays a melee or tank. While a ranged/healer can still get a good view of the fight in front of them, the melee/tanks will be unable to see much of what is happening in front of them or behind the boss.

Was this the right change? Should the maximum distance have just been added to the default UI and allowed every player to use it?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

categorizing it as a bug really? that console command has been in the game for how many years now? since its creation it certainly was there when i started raiding seriously in Wrath...   Both alpha and beta testing including raid testing went on with this in the game with no adverse effects on immersion or gameplay and suddenly its a problem? why?  and im not buying that the game was designed around that either. If it gives an advantage the solution is mindnumbingly simple increase the allowable max camera distance in the UI and then remove the cmd I dont melee and it is glaringly obvious to me why this is a problem they create the game and dont see why this is a problem

Im sorry i don't believe a word of that hogwash its like they need to piss off ppl or they don't feel good. Who ever came up with and implemented that idea has never tanked/ melee dps or Raid leaded ever and needs to be shown the door (same with the whoever came up with that new rested area talent restriction  get those people need to go)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

archimonde was a great example when u need that zoom out. i've been there on mythic and it's alot to handle and the distance is huge. having that extra zoom helps out alot.

if blizzard now wan'ts to remove it they should atleast make the bosses smaller and easier to handle with less zoom out view.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, exaldor said:

archimonde was a great example when u need that zoom out. i've been there on mythic and it's alot to handle and the distance is huge. having that extra zoom helps out alot.

if blizzard now wan'ts to remove it they should atleast make the bosses smaller and easier to handle with less zoom out view.

This is a serious problem, especially given how HUGE some of the Legion bosses are. I can only pray they reverse this.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Never used that feature and it was never a problem for me as ranged DPS, but cutting a feature that is:

1)practically very useful

2)accessible to all players because you can just google how to do it

3)isn't a 3rdparty app or somehow breaks anything

4)doesn't give an advantage in PvP

5)belongs to a game that's slightly light on "visual information coming in" matter

is not really a great idea design-wise. Make it a UI option so we can do it without console, if you want to "preserve parity".

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At some Bosses I'm using my Max-5-Macro and I will not miss it.... :(

The new distance should be at 1,9!!!!! 1,9 to 5!!!!! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sure, parity is a reasonable concern.

But, the developer's attitude is "players are doing something that helps them - but when we originally designed the game this isn't what we intended - so let's remove that option". How does it matter that this wasn't "how the game was designed at it's core" or "what we fell in love with" when the game began. If you apply that logic then the game will hardly ever improve.

Blizzard, let's consider this. Who cares what you originally intended! We are your paying customers, and this makes the game more enjoyable. And, you persevered with this whilst admitting it will be intensely unpopular.

Someone at Blizzard should adjust the thinking of your developers. Where are the Blizzard executives who will stand up for customer service and satisfaction ?

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Stan

      Season 4 isn't ending this week and during Hallow's End, you'll be able to queue up for Headless Horseman at a lower level for a chance to get The Horseman's Reins mount.
      Season 4 Cutoffs
      Blizzard's periodically updating cutoffs for Season 4 and you can find them here.
      Placeholder for tweet 897976866178334720 Season 4 End Date
      PvP Season 4 isn't ending this week.
      Placeholder for tweet 899704462972919808 Hallow's End Queue @ Level 23
      Blizzard has been updating world events to allow lower level players to queue up for bosses like Ahune and Headless Horseman will be no exception. When the event is next up, you can queue up at Level 23. The latest update to Hallow's End introduces a new battle pet Naxxy, purchasable for 150 Tricky Treats.
      Placeholder for tweet 898581888222101504 Patch 7.3: Crafted Items Upgrading
      Pre-7.3 items can be upgraded only to item level 900 using Obliterum. New 7.3 crafted items (base ilvl 885) can be only upgraded with Primal Obliterum up to ilvl 935. More information can be found here.
      Placeholder for tweet 897964671298265088
    • By Stan

      Many players are still waiting for Patch 7.3 to go live, before they complete the Mage Tower Challenge for their Artifact weapon appearance, because with increasing item level, the challenge becomes more trivial. If you have your appearance unlocked and think how good you are, you probably haven't heard of Muddymonk!
      The player wrote on reddit that he finished Mage Tower Challenges for each class / specialization - that's a total of 36 challenges. Congratulations! We're posting some screenshots and the rest can be found by visiting the link at the bottom of the article.

      You can find more screenshots here.
    • By Stan

      Patch 7.3 adds entirely new crafted items for professions and a new obliterum to increase their item level up to a max of 935. We datamined all new recipes that were added in Build 24473. Most of them are tied to new Profession quests.
      Instead of bumping crafted items that existed since Legion launch, Blizzard decided to add an entirely new tier of items, available on Argus (no-fly zone).
      Professions
      Crafed gear can be upgraded through Primal Obliterum by +5 ilvls (up to a maximum level of 935). Requires 1 Primal Sargerite and the target item must be soulbound New Items
      Astral Glory - new Argus herb Empyrium - new Argus ore Fiendish Leather - new Argus leather Lightweave Cloth - new Argus cloth Primal Sargerite - new reagent from Transmuting (requires 25 Bloods of Sargeras) New Gems Argulite Chemirine Labradorite Lightsphene Alchemy
      Lightblood Elixir - Use: Increases damage by 100,000 against demons. Only usable outdoors on Argus and the Broken Isles. Lasts 30 min.
      Lightblood Elixir (Rank 1) Lightblood Elixir (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Lightblood Elixir (Rank 3) - chance to create multiple elixirs Astral Alchemist Stone - new ilvl 885 trinket
      Astral Alchemist Stone (Rank 1) Astral Alchemist Stone (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Astral Alchemist Stone (Rank 3) - chance to create multiple stones Tears of the Naaru - Use: Shows the location of all nearby demons on the minimap for 30 min.
      Tears of the Naaru (Rank 1) Tears of the Naaru (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Tears of the Naaru (Rank 3) - chance to create multiple Tears of the Naaru New Transmutation - Transmute: Primal Sargerite > Primal Sargerite
      Blacksmithing
      Empyrial Breastplate - new ilvl 885 Plate Chest
      Empyrial Rivets are needed to craft the Chest Empyrial Breastplate (Rank 1) Empyrial Breastplate (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Empyrial Breastplate (Rank 3) - even more efficient craft Felslate Anchor (Felslate Anchor) - Use: Attach an anchor to your legs which sends you plummeting towards the ocean floor. Only usable in water.
      Cooking
      Feast of the Fishes (Recipe: Feast of the Fishes) - Use: Set out a Feast of the Fishes to feed up to 50 people in your raid or party! Restores 2,400,000 health and 1,200,000 mana over 20 sec. Must remain seated while eating. If you spend at least 10 seconds eating you will obtain all of the powers of a fish.
      Fishing Artifact
      Underlight Emerald (Deep Green) new green appearance for Underlight Angler Herbalism
      Astral Glory - Restores 1% health every 5 sec for 15 min
      Astral Glory - Gather Astral Glory more effectively Astral Glory - Find rare materials when gathering Astral Glory Astral Glory - Receive a chance to gain a small heal over time when gathering Astral Glory Engineering
      Gravitational Reduction Slippers (Schematic: Gravitational Reduction Slippers) - Use: Affix the Gravitational Reduction Slippers to your current footwear allowing you to jump higher and fall farther. Wormhole Generator: Argus (Schematic: Wormhole Generator: Argus) - Use: Teleports the player to a random location on Argus. Inscription
      Mass Mill Astral Glory - Mill multiple Astral Glory at once Jewelcrafting
      Design List: Argus Crowns - Jewelcrafters can now craft ilvl 885 crowns
      Empyrial Crown of the Cosmos - new ilvl 885 Cloth Helm
      Empyrial Crown of the Cosmos (Rank 1) Empyrial Crown of the Cosmos (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Empyrial Crown of the Cosmos (Rank 3) - even more efficient craft Empyrial Crown of the Depths - new ilvl 885 Leather Helm
      Empyrial Crown of the Depths (Rank 1) Empyrial Crown of the Depths (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Empyrial Crown of the Depths (Rank 3) - even more efficient craft Empyrial Crown of the Elements - new ilvl 885 Mail Helm
      Empyrial Crown of the Elements (Rank 1) Empyrial Crown of the Elements (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Empyrial Crown of the Elements (Rank 3) - even more efficient craft Empyrial Crown of the Titans - new ilvl 885 Plate Helm
      Empyrial Crown of the Titans (Rank 1) Empyrial Crown of the Titans (Rank 2) Empyrial Crown of the Titans (Rank 3) Design List: Argus Gemcutting - epic Gems have been added to the game
      Deadly Deep Chemirine - +250 Primary Stat and +188 Critical Strike Masterful Argulite - +250 Primary Stat and +188 Mastery Quick Lightsphene - +250 Primary Stat and +188 Haste Versatile Labradorite - +250 Primary Stat and +188 Versatility Mass Prospect Empyrium - Prospect multiple batches of Empyrium at once
      Leatherworking
      Fiendish Shoulderguards - new ilvl 885 Leather Shoulders
      Fiendish Shoulderguards (Rank 1) Fiendish Shoulderguards (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Fiendish Shoulderguards (Rank 3) - even more efficient craft Fiendish Spaulders - new ilvl 885 Mail Shoulders
      Fiendish Spaulders (Rank 1) Fiendish Spaulders (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Fiendish Spaulders (Rank 3) - even more efficient craft Mining
      New Mining Techniques have been added to the game
      Empyrium Deposit (Rank 1) - Increase the amount of material found in Empyrium Deposits Empyrium Deposit (Rank 2) - Chance to find rare materials in Empyrium Deposits Empyrium Deposit (Rank 3) - Increase the amount of material found in Empyrium Deposits Empyrium Seam (Rank 1) - Increase the amount of material found in Empyrium Seams Empyrium Seam (Rank 2) - Chance to find rare materials in Empyrium Seams Empyrium Seam (Rank 3) - Increase the amount of material found in Empyrium Seams Skinning
      New Skinning Techniques have been added to the game
      Fiendish Leather (Skinning Technique: Fiendish Leather (Rank 1)) - Gather Fiendish Leather more effectively Fiendish Leather (Skinning Technique: Fiendish Leather (Rank 2)) - Find rare metarials when gathering Fiendish Leather Fiendish Leather (Skinning Technique: Fiendish Leather (Rank 3)) - Gather Fiendish Leather more effectively Tailoring
      Lightweave Breeches - new ilvl 885 Cloth Legs (Design: Lightweave Breeches (Rank 1))
      Lightweave Breeches (Rank 1) Lightweave Breeches (Rank 2) - more efficient craft Lightweave Breeches (Rank 3) - even more efficient craft
    • By Stan

      Primal Obliterum can only upgrade new Patch 7.3 crafted items to item level 935. Pre-7.3 items can only be upgraded to 900 with Obliterum.
      To upgrade Obliterum into Primal Obliterum, you will need 1 Obliterum & 1 Primal Sargerite. Another Primal Sargerite will be consumed when you upgrade an item with Primal Obliterum by 5 ilvls.

      New 7.3 Crafted Gear
      Only the following items can be upgraded to 935. It doesn't matter if you craft older items after 7.3 goes live, they won't go beyond 900.
      Astral Alchemist Stone Empyrial Breastplate Design List: Argus Crowns Fiendish Shoulderguards Fiendish Spaulders Lightweave Breeches Placeholder for tweet 897964671298265088
    • By Stan

      Obliterum has been a steady gold maker during Legion, but what's the future of crafted items in Patch 7.3?
      Patch 7.3 added the following strings to the game:
      "SPELL_FAILED_CUSTOM_ERROR_345","This item requires basic Obliterum to upgrade."
      "SPELL_FAILED_CUSTOM_ERROR_346","This item requires Primal Obliterum to upgrade."
      We did some testing on PTR and old crafted pre-7.3 gear (ilvl 835/850) can be upgraded with Obliterum up to ilvl 900. You can't use Obliterum to upgrade the new 7.3 crafted items. Instead, you will need to use Primal Obliterum that can upgrade it up to ilvl 935.
      Primal Obliterum is forged by combining a new Blood of Sargeras called Primal Sargerite and good old Obliterum. Primal Sargerite can be transmuted by Alchemists (Transmute: Primal Sargerite) at the cost of 25 Bloods of Sargeras. There are various sources of Primal Sargerite (world quests, shoulder enchant etc). The item's required for many new recipes, so a person would be forced to have Alchemy and that's not a design Blizzard would choose.
      The good news is Obliterum will still be profitable in 7.3 and if you plan to sell Primal Obliterum, you will need to combine Obliterum with Primal Sargerite.