Strife 6 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Oh I definately agree on that front, but they did kind of nerf Demo and then just leave them be for the rest of ToT even though they remained incredibly strong. I'm hoping that's what happens with SoO. We got our additional nerfs, as much as I hate going destro/aff instead of demo/aff which was my favorite spec, at this point I'm kind of fine with it and hope they just leave us alone for a while ~_~ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rakupenda 15 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Blizzard doesn't seem fond of carrying pieces from last tier through the next tier and possibly into the next expansion. "Who gives a rip about the Int stat if the Imps are the major source of the damage?" They probably foresaw this with its nearly-universal use through ToT. Thought they should nip it preemptively with getting rid of the Everlasting Affliction Glyph carrying 100% Crit Dooms out to 3 min for the gimmick. When that didn't work and people were still getting a large portion of their damage from imps by using UVLS to proc an army's worth, especially on multi-target fights like Guardians and Paragons, they nerfed UVLS and imps. As they said in a Blue Post...Affliction got nerfed a bit, too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kazistrasz 216 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 The only reason I linked the tweets was because it shows that they're actively looking at us. This wasn't really brought up a lot last tier. The fact that they've been constantly tweaking us since the last patch is a pretty good indication. We can keep arguing about when tweets were said or the very relevance of them, but it doesn't take away from the fact that we're currently OP and Blizz is watching us now. As an aside though, remember when they nerfed Doom and Corruption by 20% in ToT because Demo was destroying meters so hard they had to be downloaded again after each fight? I don't want to be nerfed just as much as the next person, but let's be realistic. There's nothing wrong with me beating people with a 10 ilvl advantage over me that play non-warlock classes! That's totally realistic! If only... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zagam 1,983 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Anyone in here thinking we're not suspect to immediate and harsh nerfs hasn't been playing a Warlock long enough. It's always a threat. ALWAYS. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twinkielock 15 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Bet they change KJC again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soulzar 42 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Blizzard doesn't seem fond of carrying pieces from last tier through the next tier and possibly into the next expansion. "Who gives a rip about the Int stat if the Imps are the major source of the damage?" They probably foresaw this with its nearly-universal use through ToT. Thought they should nip it preemptively with getting rid of the Everlasting Affliction Glyph carrying 100% Crit Dooms out to 3 min for the gimmick. When that didn't work and people were still getting a large portion of their damage from imps by using UVLS to proc an army's worth, especially on multi-target fights like Guardians and Paragons, they nerfed UVLS and imps. As they said in a Blue Post...Affliction got nerfed a bit, too. My beef is when they nuked the trinket. Its reasonable for me to use last tier BIS trinket during first weeks of progression, it is not reasonable for last tier trinket to be BIS this whole tier over trinkets that beat it by 40 ilvls. I am not saying I have a better solution in mind, but killing one of my two trinkets second week into this tier really ticks me off. Trinkets were hard to come by for our 10 man last tier, and I have NOTHING as a backup to replace this with and am currently using Yulons Bite detro... At least blizz tossed us a bone and put Caster BIS trinket on the First Heroic Loot pinata of this tier.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rakupenda 15 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Bet they change KJC again. To what? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twinkielock 15 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 They bring back a To what? Only works with the current spells, must activate it, 2 min CD, with a 50% movement speed penalty. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Omaric 246 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 That won't happen. They don't want a movement penalty attached to it as they've stated before. *Nobody* would take that talent as you've shown it. Unless you're kidding. I hope you're kidding, because that...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rakupenda 15 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Why not add the cast penalty like the original to go with it to really kill it? On a 2 min CD? And a 50% move penalty? People would feel like they "have" to take the Dark Soul then since KJC is more useless like that than it was. Unuseable on most fights where you need it for movement because of the speed penalty. Can't chase Thok, will get nailed by Malkorok, can't outrun magnetic pull on Siegecrafter... Cooldown would also negatively affect these fights since you're moving enough to take it as is over the Dark Soul... it would be as if you didn't have it at all. You must need to take a nap or just trollin'. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Strife 6 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 (edited) KJC - just remove everything, including the description, and replace it with "Kil'Jaeden was so cunning his gift continues to remain a secret..." Then let locks try and figure out what the trait really does but secretly Blizzard is just trolling us and made the trait do absolutely nothing, either positive or negative. Then people will spend hours testing it and coming it with crazy theories on what it does while all the devs laugh at us. Edited October 1, 2013 by Strife Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twinkielock 15 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 That won't happen. They don't want a movement penalty attached to it as they've stated before. *Nobody* would take that talent as you've shown it. Unless you're kidding. I hope you're kidding, because that...... Yes I'm kidding. KJC has been through a massive roller coaster. I made it so bad I hope no one would believe me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JvChequer 43 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Remove KJC and gives to us a pumpkin to cut and draw. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Omaric 246 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Remove KJC and gives to us a pumpkin to cut and draw. Jc for World Emperor. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rakupenda 15 Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Yes I'm kidding. KJC has been through a massive roller coaster. I made it so bad I hope no one would believe me. Thank god... Remove KJC and gives to us a pumpkin to cut and draw. Something like this? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Haegr 0 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 What are your guys' thoughts on this? http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1350333-New-SimCraft-version-is-out There is a lot of talk there about how Destruction, with the changes in the hotfix, has begun to pull ahead of Affliction in single target scenarios, and apparently there is SImulationcraft math behind it. Could you guys assess the validity of this? Did the aff nerfs and destro buffs change THAT much? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Annoroth 5 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 What are your guys' thoughts on this? http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1350333-New-SimCraft-version-is-out There is a lot of talk there about how Destruction, with the changes in the hotfix, has begun to pull ahead of Affliction in single target scenarios, and apparently there is SImulationcraft math behind it. Could you guys assess the validity of this? Did the aff nerfs and destro buffs change THAT much? Si, according to Gahhda (who does love his Destro), it's true. Unless anyone is able to prove him wrong, that mostly settles the matter. Though on fights that were already Destro niches, it's really something to behold. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lockybalboa 618 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 What are your guys' thoughts on this? http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1350333-New-SimCraft-version-is-out There is a lot of talk there about how Destruction, with the changes in the hotfix, has begun to pull ahead of Affliction in single target scenarios, and apparently there is SImulationcraft math behind it. Could you guys assess the validity of this? Did the aff nerfs and destro buffs change THAT much? Six of one, half dozen of another. Destro and aff are about cleanly even right now for ST, the deciding factor between the two is mostly player/gear. Fights with a lot of low HP adds, destro will shine. Fights with a lot of high HP adds, Aff will shine. Fights with a low-mid HP target that needs to be burnt really fast, destro. Fight with a high HP add that will be there for >30 seconds, aff. Just depends on the fight, your skill, your gear, and the RNG gods. Personally, I'll never play desto for a pure ST fight(LOL ya like when are we ever going to see a pure ST fight again). The need to be rooted in place is normally a DPS loss over aff. Sure, aff doesn't like movement. But it can handle it a lot better than Destro can. Every 10 seconds or so being forced to stand and cast a 3 second nuke, no thanks. Makes it even harder when you're trying to time it with major buffs for mad deeps. I'd much rather DoTDoTDoT and MG/SD that I can break at any time without caring much then try and stand and do a 3 second nuke with 3.2 seconds left on my BlackBlood stacks. To many things can do wrong in that situation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kuLi 11 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 It seems that a nice ~10% agony nerf just arrived on live. Hoorah... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zagam 1,983 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 Thank god... Something like this? This game...it's so sad. I used to play it all the time in high school. When college came, Mario Party only came up in discussion after the bar where many alcohol-raged feuds began... What are your guys' thoughts on this? http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1350333-New-SimCraft-version-is-out There is a lot of talk there about how Destruction, with the changes in the hotfix, has begun to pull ahead of Affliction in single target scenarios, and apparently there is SImulationcraft math behind it. Could you guys assess the validity of this? Did the aff nerfs and destro buffs change THAT much? It's been largely discussed a lot...Destruction is quite decent, but the fact it has a Haste ceiling makes it so scaling doesn't work as well as it does with Affliction. Destruction is fine...but it feels a bit below Affliction on a pure single target push, mostly because of the reliance on KJC and still having to plant your feet for Chaos Bolt. I perform better single target Aff than I do Destruction by a substantial amount with 10k Haste and 20k Mastery. Is Destruction fine? Yep. Is Affliction fine? Yep. Simcraft is fine to evaluate numbers, but you're far better off going and looking at REAL data. So many people put stock in Simcraft when there are real logs out there that show the capacity of specs on fights. Dig a while and you'll see specs are largely FIGHT DEPENDENT and there is no 'this spec is best' type answer. Six of one, half dozen of another. Destro and aff are about cleanly even right now for ST, the deciding factor between the two is mostly player/gear. Fights with a lot of low HP adds, destro will shine. Fights with a lot of high HP adds, Aff will shine. Fights with a low-mid HP target that needs to be burnt really fast, destro. Fight with a high HP add that will be there for >30 seconds, aff. Just depends on the fight, your skill, your gear, and the RNG gods. Personally, I'll never play desto for a pure ST fight(LOL ya like when are we ever going to see a pure ST fight again). The need to be rooted in place is normally a DPS loss over aff. Sure, aff doesn't like movement. But it can handle it a lot better than Destro can. Every 10 seconds or so being forced to stand and cast a 3 second nuke, no thanks. Makes it even harder when you're trying to time it with major buffs for mad deeps. I'd much rather DoTDoTDoT and MG/SD that I can break at any time without caring much then try and stand and do a 3 second nuke with 3.2 seconds left on my BlackBlood stacks. To many things can do wrong in that situation. We 3 shot Heroic Iron Juggernaut last night....tried two pulls as Destruction. Fuck casting Chaos Bolt with that stupid saw blade. Went Affliction, gained 50k DPS, ranked #55, got H WF belt. Planting your feet during lots of mini-movements is an awful time. Let those DoTs tick. For me, single target - Affliction. It seems that a nice ~10% agony nerf just arrived on live. Hoorah... Got any proof? Links or logs are typically good to put with a statement like this. Rumors are not nice. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Annoroth 5 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) Got any proof? Links or logs are typically good to put with a statement like this. Rumors are not nice. Not a log, but a quick pre-work training dummy test matches up with that statement. UA is overtaking Agony on Damage done. Screenshot: http://i.imgur.com/HnB118q.jpg Edit: Due to lack of a raid buff, there is an effect where Agony isn't getting the extra tick. But even so, it's always overtaken UA for damage done. Edited October 2, 2013 by Annoroth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zagam 1,983 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 There's no proof Agony got nerfed 10%. On all of my Affliction parses last night, Agony beat UA damage. That parse you posted has very little time spent. UA always does the same damage while Agony scales up to 10 stacks. If you don't do your rotation for a period of time, of course UA will be ahead of Agony. Over time, Agony will beat UA every single time. Heroic Dark Shaman wipes last night for proof: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jacehv8xqh73vvep/sum/damageDone/?enc=wipes&boss=71859 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Annoroth 5 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 There's no proof Agony got nerfed 10%. On all of my Affliction parses last night, Agony beat UA damage. That parse you posted has very little time spent. UA always does the same damage while Agony scales up to 10 stacks. If you don't do your rotation for a period of time, of course UA will be ahead of Agony. Over time, Agony will beat UA every single time. Heroic Dark Shaman wipes last night for proof: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jacehv8xqh73vvep/sum/damageDone/?enc=wipes&boss=71859 Like I said before, those were very rough numbers, I'm definitely going to look more into this this evening. From what I understand about the rumor though, the hotfix was applied last night (unfortunately that's the problem with rumors, hard to verify anything). I can add though that from the simple "test" I ran, my maximum UA tick was 81k, compared to a maximum 10-stack tick of 71k. It could just be RNG combined with a bad test though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Omaric 246 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 Hold onto your butts, we may be in for further nerfs. Honestly I wouldn't be surprised at all if we were. Just wanted to requote this because cups made out of cheese. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kuLi 11 Report post Posted October 3, 2013 (edited) Got any proof? Links or logs are typically good to put with a statement like this. Rumors are not nice. Unfortunately it's official: Warlock AfflictionAgony damage has been reduced by 15%. Edited October 3, 2013 by kuLi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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