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Starym

Thrall Returns in New Safe Haven 8.2 Cinematic

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Excellent cinematic.  

I know Bliz has said repeatedly ol' Sylvanas isnt going to be evil Horde Leader V2.0, but i mean holy F, its getting to the point theyre going to have to Retcon some major stuff to fix all this and make her believably 'acceptable.'

It took several EXPANSIONS worth of story to make Illidan's change believable.  

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Nice cinematic, but the story is a bit...

 

I mean, Sylvannas decides to kill Thrall (who has been doing nothing this whole time and hasn't been a threat...oh, and she kind of owes him a LOT).  

That aside...So she sends...2 rogues?    Against one of the most renowned fighters in the entire world?     Even if Saurfang hadn't come, the ease they were beaten down with speaks volumes.   Remember his wife is also pretty powerful (and unlike Thrall has full access to Shaman magic).

Also a bit sad we didn't get to see or hear a name for Thralls child/children, which suggests we never will.   

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1 minute ago, Migol said:

Nice cinematic, but the story is a bit...

I mean, Sylvannas decides to kill Thrall (who has been doing nothing this whole time and hasn't been a threat...oh, and she kind of owes him a LOT).  

That aside...So she sends...2 rogues?    Against one of the most renowned fighters in the entire world?     Even if Saurfang hadn't come, the ease they were beaten down with speaks volumes.   Remember his wife is also pretty powerful (and unlike Thrall has full access to Shaman magic).

Also a bit sad we didn't get to see or hear a name for Thralls child/children, which suggests we never will.   

Sylvanas went full moustached villain by now. She will kill anyone who might stand on her way (even considered slaughtering her sisters, as seen in "Windrunner"). She knows how honorable Thrall is, and how he could come back to right her wrongs, which explains why she sent the Rogues to kill him just in case he had a change of heart.

She didn't send the Rogues after Thrall and Saurfang; just Thrall. Saurfang says he was tailing the two Rogues. But I agree that sending just two is pretty underwhelming.

Regarding Thrall's children, maybe we will get to know them in a possible questline. Who knows.

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5 hours ago, Arcling said:

Nope, he isn't with Blizzard anymore and hasn't written anything for them in a long time. I'm not sure I would like Metzen back, story probably would have been in similar state as it is now, he was the one who came up with Cataclysm plot after all.

Still disappointed how many characters in Legion went "missing". Final war against Burning Legion and someone as important as Thrall, who fought them before and played important role in beating them back, disappears (same can be said for Jaina and several others, who had personal stakes at that war).

As far as I'm aware the last true expansion that Chris actually helped with story development wise was MoP (for sure) or possibly WoD (unclear) both of which and including cata, were all better iterations of the current game and story right now. Anything he has contributed is far better than what we have now.

Edited by Serrated
Grammar
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5 hours ago, Migol said:

Remember his wife is also pretty powerful (and unlike Thrall has full access to Shaman magic).

I can imagine Thrall and Aggra fighting Forsaken Assassins like that old couple in "Kung Fu Hustle".

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Blizzard is obviously a HUGE fan of DnD.

Everything a character does seems to be decided by the throw of a dice.

Characters don't do what makes sense, what is sensible. There is no plot that evolves, everything that happens next is completly random.

Kill somebody? Befriend the same? Completly ignore him and do nothing? Decided by a throw. Oh, and if the character happens to throw a 1 - critical failure - he commits suicide.

 

Blizzard used to be good in storytelling.

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13 minutes ago, WedgeAntilles said:

Blizzard is obviously a HUGE fan of DnD.

Everything a character does seems to be decided by the throw of a dice.

Characters don't do what makes sense, what is sensible. There is no plot that evolves, everything that happens next is completly random.

Kill somebody? Befriend the same? Completly ignore him and do nothing? Decided by a throw. Oh, and if the character happens to throw a 1 - critical failure - he commits suicide.

 

Blizzard used to be good in storytelling.

It seems that the current writers of Blizzard and Game of Thrones graduated together.

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42 minutes ago, Valhalen said:

It seems that the current writers of Blizzard and Game of Thrones graduated together.

Where can i get my "popular-character-killing" major?😁

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I haven't seen an actual in-game or recently mentioned model of Sever, Garad's axe that Durotan wielded after Garad's death.  My money is on them naming this axe Sever.  No reason not to.  Change my mind.

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15 hours ago, Migol said:

Nice cinematic, but the story is a bit...

 

I mean, Sylvannas decides to kill Thrall (who has been doing nothing this whole time and hasn't been a threat...oh, and she kind of owes him a LOT).  

 

This is what I hate so much. At this point despite saying "Nah she's not just Garrosh 2.0" they're basically just having her do thing to look evil. Like no rhyme or reason, just "Well, let's have her stab a baby purely to show how EVIL she is." TBH it makes me think of DMC  when a pregnant woman who's a non-combatant is just... shot in the back as a building point of "this villain is so bad!" It just feel really cliche.

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19 hours ago, Arcling said:

One thing, there is some contradiction as rogues (along the likes of warriors and hunters) were described as non-magical (though they sometimes use enchanted weapons and equipment).

Rogues are not non-magical; All 3 Rogue Specs use limited Shadow Magic (Stealth / Cloak of Shadows). 

Subtlety Rogues are balls deep into Shadow Magic.  Sub uses Shadow Magic to empower their Attacks and their Weapons. 

Sub Rogues use Shadow Magic around the same level as Shadow Priests they just do it in Melee instead of at Range.  Sub Rogues have their own Void Form style buff in Shadow BladesShadow Blades  and they use Shadow Clones as a finisher in Secret TechniqueSecret Technique  in addition to the main ability being Shadow DanceShadow Dance .

Edited by geofferson

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1 hour ago, geofferson said:

Sub Rogues use Shadow Magic around the same level as Shadow Priests they just do it in Melee instead of at Range.  Sub Rogues have their own Void Form style buff in Shadow BladesShadow Blades and they use Shadow Clones as a finisher in Secret TechniqueSecret Technique  in addition to the main ability being Shadow DanceShadow Dance .

Those are game mechanics, it was about how it actually looks in lore. If we were going by game mechanics, that means every warrior can charge at super speed, leaving flames behind and hunters conjure animals out of nothing and at one point everyone learned to create unlimited ammo, no point discussing this, it's just how game works. Shadow abilities existed long before that retcon "everything with shadow=void dimension", it was a literal shadow back then. Until this cinematic, rogues were just sneaky (even sometimes having trouble with moving unnoticed, wouldn't happen with full invisibility), so in case of this cinematic it was just a rule of cool or retcon. In RPGs rogues are among non-magical classes, the reason stealth exists as literal invisibility, because it's convenient from gameplay perspective, rather than creating a complicated cover system, which would have been useless in many environments.

Edited by Arcling

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1 hour ago, Arcling said:

In RPGs rogues are among non-magical classes, the reason stealth exists as literal invisibility, 

I agree that in most RPGs Rogues are non-magical. 

Rogue's use of Shadow Magic in WoW is a deviation from most RPGs.  The Cloak of ShadowsCloak of Shadows ability in general is a Rogue wrapping themselves in Shadow Magic to remove Magical Abilities; Again, almost everything a Sub Rogue does is Shadow Magic.  I played Sub for years and if you play Sub at max level for any amount of time you will not call Rogues non-magical.  StealthStealth is described as hiding in the shadows.  Hiding in the shadows when there are no shadows because you are standing in the daylight requires magic.

If you really want to go by RPG Rules, Hunter's shouldn't even be a class.  Hunter's according to most RPGs should just be a spec of the Scout / Rogue class.

The only non-magical classes in WoW are Hunters and Warriors.

Edited by geofferson

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1 hour ago, geofferson said:

The only non-magical classes in WoW are Hunters and Warriors.

But that's the thing, some of their abilities also look magical. Do they use magic themselves or just in-game representation? I guess it can be handwaved as them using magical trinkets, enchanted equipment etc., although it's also a common explanation for rogues (non-magical, some might have used specific enchanted items). This cinematic is the first canon representation of actual invisibility for rogues.

Subtlety (even specs are also more like game mechanics, since many characters don't fit them, like Thrall fighting as mix of elemental/enhancement shaman) used these abilities before void retcon and back then (outside of game mechanics) rogues were represented as non-magical, like this guy: https://wow.gamepedia.com/Brink_Spannercrank

Only used a magical trinket. But that's likely overthinking, they probably didn't care and thought it looked cool.

Edited by Arcling

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27 minutes ago, Mythicdruid said:

I wonder if it was Nathanos that sent the assassins and not Sylvanas...

I was thinking the same thing, either Nathanos or some other third party. With all her cunning I don't think the Warchief herself would make the obvious mistake of sending 2 low level rogues against Thrall. Some sort of elaborate trap would be much more or her liking.

Edited by lChronosl

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6 hours ago, lChronosl said:

I was thinking the same thing, either Nathanos or some other third party. With all her cunning I don't think the Warchief herself would make the obvious mistake of sending 2 low level rogues against Thrall. Some sort of elaborate trap would be much more or her liking.

Maybe that WAS a part of said trap? To lure Thrall, Saurfang and other resistance, clump them all together at one point and mana-bomb the heck out of it or something.

Edited by Steveson

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On 5/15/2019 at 1:34 PM, Tupi said:

i wish game story had the same affect on me as the cinematic. 

I'd love to see a full movie done with these BfA cinematic developers at the helm.

anyone else see Josh Brolin playing Thrall in a live action movie?

I just looked him up and I totally agree with your assessment.

And victory for Sylvanas? Victory for anyone who will OPPOSE her! I have always and will always hate that b**ch. My bloodknight even hates her. He only grudgingly does as he is bidden IF it isn't outright evil. Seriously, he will never support her and he and Nathanos have a healthy dislike for one another. All I can say is BRING BACK THRALL AND I WILL FOLLOW HIM LOYALLY!

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2 hours ago, Rhaazyk said:

I have always and will always hate that b**ch

Alert! Alert! Salty Banshee Queen fanboys are coming! Proceed to the nearest bunker! This is not a drill! Repeat - THIS IS NOT A DRILL!

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18 hours ago, geofferson said:

If you really want to go by RPG Rules, Hunter's shouldn't even be a class.  Hunter's according to most RPGs should just be a spec of the Scout / Rogue class.

I'm pretty sure WoW's hunters are based off of D&D' 'Ranger' class which IS a magical class in that it eventually gains access to Druid/Nature spells...and D&D's Ranger was surely a nod to Tolkien's Aragorn. And, initially, Ranger's were a sub-class/spec of Fighters.

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Another thing that is bugging me about it is that how did Saurfang know and see to follow the assassins in the first place? When he first walked into Thrall's place, did anyone notice that he was looking around even before he spoke? 

Also, those assassins were not that good because they were heard before being seen. Saurfang looking back, Thrall looking up to the roof...

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