wow Pelagos Reflects on His Mortal Life in Shadowlands

[Stan 5,022]

Pelagos is the first transgender character in World of Warcraft and one of the Kyrian Covenant soulbinds. Recently, Blizzard gave Pelagos more dialog options, giving players the opportunity to find out more about his mortal life.

Pelagos reveals to you in the game that he had a female form in life and appreciates that you listen to his story. We transcribed the whole dialog and you can read the lines below.

Quote

Precious little, in recent times.

The memories fade naturally as my former life draws ever more distant, and many others have let go of willingly to fulfill my duties here.

Except...

Pelagos

<Except what?>

Quote

Except for one.

It can be difficult to think about. I know I should let it go but...I want... maybe need...to remember it.

It is too much a part of who I am to forget.

Pelagos

<I'm listening.>

Quote

I appreciate your listening. Truly. As soulbinds, I know I can trust you.

<Pelagos takes a deep breath, then exhales slowly.>

I had a female form in life. I don't recall my former name, or even my race, but I...never felt like my physical form represented who I was inside.

It never felt as clear to me then as it does now. I struggled with that identity for my entire life...

Pelagos

<Continue to listen>

Quote

But when I arrived in Bastion I became an aspirant that looked like, well...

<Pelagos gestures to himself.>

This! A male form!

I felt...comfortable! Excited! like who I was inside matched what others saw for the first time!

All of those feelings in my life finally made sense.

Pelagos

<Continue to listen>

Quote

I may not reach ascension as fast as some. Pelagos, but I am truly happy on the path I follow.

Not many kyrian discuss their pasts, or even remember them! I believe we have much to learn as a people in that regard.

When I told Kleia, she listened--just as you have. And she has been as steadfast a friend as I could have hoped for--just as you have.

Thank you. I am glad that I was able to share my story with you.

Pelagos

<Thank you for sharing it, Pelagos>

Pelagos was a woman in his mortal life, but chose to be a man in his afterlife, so to respect his identity, Blizzard started referring to Pelagos as "he/him" instead of "they/them" on the Shadowlands Alpha.

(Source)

In an upcoming build for the Shadowlands alpha, we are updating some dialog and quest text referring to a key character to the Bastion storyline: Pelagos. While normally we wouldn’t share these changes in advance, we recognize there is a higher than usual possibility of this being misunderstood if (and when) it is discovered out of context through datamining, and wanted to make sure that our intentions are clear.

A key part of the Bastion storyline is that Aspirants are able to choose a physical form that represents their true self. Pelagos, who presented as a woman in his mortal life, chose to be a man in the Shadowlands. The team had originally written him to use they/them pronouns but received feedback that he/him would be more respectful of the character’s wishes to be identified as a man. This change is simply the result of us listening and responding to that feedback.

[Borgoff33 92]

again virtue signaling by blizz but yeah..... not a "transgender" in anyway since it seems that when you die you can i guess somewhat be what ever you want to be in death so you are a completly new being

[BobTheHuman 72]

Boring heaven theme + lol owls, annoying WQ and transgender angels, I'm not choosing that shi t with any of my characters.

[Dejo93 984]

Right after the Method scandal. Thia reminds mw of Riot releasing Neeko right after it was revealed to be full of *filtered* pests 

[Senou 40]

To be honest, I think everyone deserves the right to live their life as they please to, but why on earth do we need THIS much depth to a video game character?`Its not like we will sit down with them ever and talk about such things. It doesn't matter if the writers make them homosexual, transgender or have three extra limbs.
I for my part do not care, it is just annoying that everyone has to jump onto the bandwagon to not be called "sexist". I am aware that this is a much more complex discussion that we initially would think but can we maybe keep that topic out of things where everyone can get involved even if they don't want to? Not forcing someones opinion down your throat is an option. Just move on, be self- aware and respect others as individuals surely should be more than enough.

[Ravenclaw89 27]

2 minutes ago, Senou said:

To be honest, I think everyone deserves the right to live their life as they please to, but why on earth do we need THIS much depth to a video game character?`Its not like we will sit down with them ever and talk about such things. It doesn't matter if the writers make them homosexual, transgender or have three extra limbs.
I for my part do not care, it is just annoying that everyone has to jump onto the bandwagon to not be called "sexist". I am aware that this is a much more complex discussion that we initially would think but can we maybe keep that topic out of things where everyone can get involved even if they don't want to? Not forcing someones opinion down your throat is an option. Just move on, be self- aware and respect others as individuals surely should be more than enough.

Yes... and no.

As part of the LGBT+ community, I enjoy Blizzard do this kind of things. It feels really good when your favorite game has at least little representation. And Im sure it could be more, but the community it's not ready yet for this kind of things. 

 

"It doesn't matter if the writers make them homosexual, transgender or have three extra limbs.". It does, and a lot ? 

[Fredfuchs 5]

Anyone think that transgender NPC will make it into Chinese release. Hypocrisy and pandering.

[Halock 156]

56 minutes ago, Ravenclaw89 said:

As part of the LGBT+ community, I enjoy Blizzard do this kind of things. It feels really good when your favorite game has at least little representation. 

Does it feel like a good representation to you? How about Mathias + Shaw? Does the quality even matter?

And that's not trying to catch you out or anything, just trying to work stuff out and I'd love your opinion. Something's been bugging me about both. 

[Dejo93 984]

2 minutes ago, Fredfuchs said:

Anyone think that transgender NPC will make it into Chinese release. Hypocrisy and pandering.

Don't say that. You'll make Xinnie the Pooh sad

[Teufel 331]

17 minutes ago, Halock said:

Does it feel like a good representation to you? How about Mathias + Shaw? Does the quality even matter?

And that's not trying to catch you out or anything, just trying to work stuff out and I'd love your opinion. Something's been bugging me about both. 

Leaving my 5 cents, since I happen to belong to it as well, in case you're collecting opinions.

Absolutely hate the entire "token Asian/Black/Latino/Gay/Lesbian/Trans/Bi" tendency that's plaguing the modern media. Accent on "token". Most people I know want equal treatment, and acts like those of Blizzard on the subject, especially since the entire batch happens at the same time, looks like a bone thrown a dog's way, not "representation" and especially not after 15 years of lacking it.  To add insult to injury, it is "3rd-4th row" characters, that contribute next to nothing to the story, nor they are memorable. A token to appease, nothing more.

Execution matters A LOT. A side example, there's a show I watch and it has a spinoff - both have "diverse" casts. Except the latter shoves it down your throat from ep1 to the point a character unsubtly confirms to another character he's being hired  - with additional salary - mostly because he's a trans. Meanwhile, watching the former, the "diversity" part didn't even occur to me until the "racist *filtered*" character called it out, nor their character's storylines are rooted in their race/sexuality, so seamless it was written. That is what I think is "representation" done right.

WoW's universe in general lacks those social stigmas our society does to make such traits as sexuality or sexual identity matter and contribute to a character in a meaningful way. If it was gradual population of the world over the expansions with some minor LGBT characters here and there, like it is a common occurence, no one would bat an eye. As it is... well. Read above.

[Ravenclaw89 27]

30 minutes ago, Halock said:

Does it feel like a good representation to you? How about Mathias + Shaw? Does the quality even matter?

And that's not trying to catch you out or anything, just trying to work stuff out and I'd love your opinion. Something's been bugging me about both. 

 

No, it could be better BUT it's something. It's the begining. Gamer community its kinda homophobic, so I get why they go slowly. 

Mathias + Flynn for me was amazing, I was sorpresed that a "main" character was canon-gay. I mean, does it matter the sexuality in a war game? Not at all, but as it doesn't matter if it is straight, why not gay? 

"Does the quality even matter?" I don't get this one ? You mean the way they introduce this details? 

[Monlyth 75]

2 hours ago, Senou said:

To be honest, I think everyone deserves the right to live their life as they please to, but why on earth do we need THIS much depth to a video game character?`Its not like we will sit down with them ever and talk about such things. It doesn't matter if the writers make them homosexual, transgender or have three extra limbs.
I for my part do not care, it is just annoying that everyone has to jump onto the bandwagon to not be called "sexist". I am aware that this is a much more complex discussion that we initially would think but can we maybe keep that topic out of things where everyone can get involved even if they don't want to? Not forcing someones opinion down your throat is an option. Just move on, be self- aware and respect others as individuals surely should be more than enough.

What's wrong with adding more details and dialogue to create an interesting minor character? WoW has done that since 2004 and people have loved it. The world is full of NPCs, books, dialogue and other stuff that doesn't serve much of a purpose in terms of gameplay, but has a surprising amount of depth if you choose to interact with it, or just gives the player a subtle nod to tell them that they've found something special. It makes the world feel alive and more like a real place, and it rewards players who like to explore all the little details in the various nooks and crannies.

Edited July 19, 2020 by Monlyth

[Halock 156]

27 minutes ago, Teufel said:

... especially since the entire batch happens at the same time, looks like a bone thrown a dog's way...

You said a lot, and thanks, I was interested. But just picking this out --

It seems pretty clear to me that this is one of those big changes they save for the start of an expansion, and I would very much guess they're going forward with it. They've got to start somewhere, right? 

But it can easily feel bad, and I think it can do so on multiple fronts. To you it may feel like a bone thrown; but to some it could seem to be trying to change their opinion with a hammer.

It's a bit sad, really. There's so much discomfort around the subject all sides struggle to let it lie easy. 

[Halock 156]

36 minutes ago, Ravenclaw89 said:

"Does the quality even matter?" I don't get this one ? You mean the way they introduce this details? 

I think so. ? I gathered that the representation was important to you -- which you've further clarified. You look at Flynn and think something along the lines of 'it's nice that he's gay', right? But do you find it natural for him to be gay? Had you been able to pick any character to be gay, would you have picked a different one? 

Or, like I said, does it not really matter? Is whether he's a good fit a non-issue, provided someone's gay? 

See, that might be a stupid question. But I initially heard of Mathias + Flynn and thought little of it. After a few days, I realised it didn't feel like a good pairing to me. And then I saw your comment and thought 'well, there's somebody who's really keen on the representation part of it -- I wonder what they think about the quality?'

[Rag 16]

1 hour ago, Halock said:

Does it feel like a good representation to you? How about Mathias + Shaw? Does the quality even matter?

And that's not trying to catch you out or anything, just trying to work stuff out and I'd love your opinion. Something's been bugging me about both. 

Not really, most heterosexual relationships/characters in these games are paper thin. Representation, even if its forced or awkward at first, can help, and *filtered* relationships and identities don't need to be perfect to still matter to people. They don't need to cross some higher bar, and in fact that's the usual over correction. When pop culture realizes its had some *filtered* representation, they swing so hard they end up creating the "magical old black man" or "*filtered* friend who has spot on perfect relationship advice" tropes. And for if it's needed, well no, but would that question come up had the character not had some elements of trans identity? It'd just be "oh cool this character has a bit more lore". If people don't care to read it, dope. Most of us skip quest text, this won't be any different. And for those for whom it's representing, great! They feel more at home in the game.

[Teufel 331]

48 minutes ago, Halock said:

You said a lot, and thanks, I was interested. But just picking this out --

It seems pretty clear to me that this is one of those big changes they save for the start of an expansion, and I would very much guess they're going forward with it. They've got to start somewhere, right? 

But it can easily feel bad, and I think it can do so on multiple fronts. To you it may feel like a bone thrown; but to some it could seem to be trying to change their opinion with a hammer.

It's a bit sad, really. There's so much discomfort around the subject all sides struggle to let it lie easy. 

My two problems are still timing - as explained above - and execution. The game is just too old, and this whole ordeal really looks like "Dumbledore is gay" thing back from HP's earlier days.

I've also heard there is some Night Fae content related to Night Warriors and even more "sudden homosexuality" in WoW, but unless someone can confirm it, I'd rather not bring that to the table.

And, again, it adds virtually nothing to the characters or the story, despite the author claiming he wants to give some "depth". Either the aftermentioned stigmas need to be introduced/retconned into the lore to create narratives (at least we knew for awhile that sexism is a thing in WoW. Looking at you, Magni.), or there's some creative next-level writing Blizz do not seem capable of these days. So, still most likely to end up a bland pandering.

PS: finding it pretty amusing that the Alliance characters are involved, when the whole "acceptance" thing is something usually attributed to the Horde. At least the way Thrall envisioned it.

[Halock 156]

10 minutes ago, Teufel said:

And, again, it adds virtually nothing to the characters or the story, despite the author claiming he wants to give some "depth". Either the aftermentioned stigmas need to be introduced/retconned into the lore to create narratives (at least we knew for awhile that sexism is a thing in WoW. Looking at you, Magni.), or there's some creative next-level writing Blizz do not seem capable of these days.

I keep turning that problem over in my head. It is difficult to find what it adds. Not solely in this case, but generally. Not impossible, I think, but difficult. But I think that runs deeper, into the fact we haven't really examined these things closely. 

Defining these things by What A Bad Time They've Had possibly has its place, but is dangerous. That can turn shallow and bitter. ?

I feel like Pelagos does add something to his character, to the character of Bastion. I'm not sure it adds something that really works well, unfortunately, though I'm keeping an open mind on that. Blizzard's surprised me before.

[Monlyth 75]

33 minutes ago, Teufel said:

My two problems are still timing - as explained above - and execution. The game is just too old, and this whole ordeal really looks like "Dumbledore is gay" thing back from HP's earlier days.

I dunno. It seems like people complain when minor characters are introduced because they're "meaningless token characters", but when they reveal the sexual orientation of a major character, people complain that it's a "Dumbledore is gay" moment instead. Seems like you can't win.

Personally, I don't take any issue with "Dumbledore is gay", anyhow. I don't recall Dumbledore ever saying or doing anything that made it clear he wasn't gay.

And in my opinion, this still does add depth to the story, because this implies that your soul's form can differ greatly from your mortal body's form after you die, to the point where you can have a mortal woman become a man. It adds worldbuilding and can be expanded upon with other characters.

[durdyenglish 298]

People trying to label this 100 ways from Sunday - it's just representation, and if you think they are really pouring it on for Shadowlands, you should ask why there are so many gaps to be filled in the WoW universe to begin with. They have 15 years worth of content to evaluate.

 

[Grumar 185]

I would just like to point out, trans people use a lot of the same phrases and words as furries. 

Edited July 19, 2020 by Grumar

[Arcling 877]

10 hours ago, Monlyth said:

And in my opinion, this still does add depth to the story, because this implies that your soul's form can differ greatly from your mortal body's form after you die, to the point where you can have a mortal woman become a man. It adds worldbuilding and can be expanded upon with other characters.

Aren't all of these four factions formed from souls of different race? Like Kyrian, Venthyr, Necrolord and Night Fae could have been human, orc, dwarf etc. during their lives but once they are chosen, their souls are used to create a new being (afaik Kyrian even lose their memories?).

As for representation, it's not wrong, although no one should be praising them for it. Would have been a different thing, if they were doing it like 15 years ago. They are only introducing such characters, because it's safe and many other companies have been doing the same. Would have been a different story, if for example one of their RTS games had such characters, because it was unpopular back in the day and required to take some sort of risk. I wonder though, how that is going to be translated in Russian and Chinese version, since they actually do have laws against it, especially given game's age rating (are these texts the same or there is no Russian/Chinese beta?). Also, are Flynn/Shaw going to be just friends in these versions? 

[herbies 0]

oh hell yeah ? trans rights babey

[SidonisAntares 288]

Half this page is angsty posts from people who've never had a problem being represented in entertainment, because they're cishet, and likely white on top of it. How sad is your life that you have to dump on others getting to feel represented when it doesn't affect you in any way.