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Augmentation Evoker PvE

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Guest Enasdargos

BTW the interaction between Armored to the Teeth and Blistering Scales was removed.

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I have a question.

I was playing with augmentation a bit on ptr, and it came to me that Dream of Spring cames along pretty nice with that passive Aug have that makes it free every time an enemy is killed. It seems to be able to give a bit of better sustain of Ebon Might.

Would it not worth it because of opportunity cost?

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Guest Schmu

How is UH Dk being not basically on par with Demo Lock - They have the same slow opener for breath of eons, they have super similar dmg patterns and everything - I feel like the value of UH Dk is severly wrong and should be below Arcane Mage / Dev Evoker (and maybe even Marksman Hunter)? Would like any info on that, cause if i check logs, i can't find any reason to buff uh dk over any of those 3 classes especially in breath window

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On 7/11/2023 at 9:07 AM, Guest Enasdargos said:

BTW the interaction between Armored to the Teeth and Blistering Scales was removed.

This was changed but unfortunately didn't make it into initial release.
Thank you for pointing it out it should be fixed now.

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38 minutes ago, Fearitha said:

I have a question.

I was playing with augmentation a bit on ptr, and it came to me that Dream of Spring cames along pretty nice with that passive Aug have that makes it free every time an enemy is killed. It seems to be able to give a bit of better sustain of Ebon Might.

Would it not worth it because of opportunity cost?

The main issue with the Dream of Spring talent is the opportunity cost of taking it. It not only costs one talent below the 20 point line it also costs a minimum of one extra talent point to take the Symbiotic Bloom point (Swap Power Nexus, Swap ?, put two points in Symbiotic Bloom).

It's definitely good passive sustain and I would definitely recommend running it for Open World Content. I will be looking more into the healing builds to add a post to the main guide for Raiding/Mythic+.

From a raiding perspective it would look right now that it's roughly ~+17k HPS for -10k DPS to play Dream of Spring, getting you about 4 casts of Emerald Blossom a minute.

The main concern with running it in raid is that it just costs so much mana that you run oom quickly. I need to look into if healer trinkets like Rashoks Molten Heart can help alleviate this to a noticeable extent.

For Mythic+ you already have lost points on the talent tree to pick up extra M+ Utility or damage which makes it more awkward to take than before. It's definitely possible to do, but something will have to be dropped. Either DPS nodes or other healing throughput nodes like Molten Blood.
This could still be a valid trade for making your weekly keys easier as Augment can do a lot of HPS while it has the mana and in M+ you get time to regenerate mana between pulls and don't need to always be healing. It's something I'm going to be keeping an eye on as well as trying myself now that the class is live!

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21 minutes ago, Guest Schmu said:

How is UH Dk being not basically on par with Demo Lock - They have the same slow opener for breath of eons, they have super similar dmg patterns and everything - I feel like the value of UH Dk is severly wrong and should be below Arcane Mage / Dev Evoker (and maybe even Marksman Hunter)? Would like any info on that, cause if i check logs, i can't find any reason to buff uh dk over any of those 3 classes especially in breath window

A significant portion of the damage being allocated for the opener recommendation comes from the Ebon Might and Versatility buffs from mastery, not just Eons.
While the Unholy DK damage peak is delayed just like Demonology Warlock they still start doing damage earlier.
This initial damage which occurs during their Eons makes the Eon not completely wasted - still weaker than it could be on better class specifically for Eons, but still has a reasonable hit whereas Demonology just hasn't started doing noticeably at all yet in this window so their Eons is extremely small which lowers their value enough to make them not recommended.

All of the recommendations were from doing 1minute 0 length variance simulations which take into account the relative delay of each specs cooldowns.
This takes into account whether the Augmentation *should* delay their cooldowns for them, and I found that on average a delay of 2 Globals performed the best for everyone so this is what is used for the recommendations and the ranking order for opener.
lasses like Demonology benefited greatly from a 6-7 GCD delay but by that point other specs you would buff have fallen off massively which made it inefficient.
It does not take into account whether other specs should delay anything on their opener to make it better for the Augmentation.

Once again, these are early simulations and there's a possibility that they're wrong or slightly off - now that the class is live we will start getting actual log data of Augmentations (sadly doesn't work on pets right now) to help form better opinions.

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Guest Icytroll

Quick comment on Elemental Shaman, this tier our Crit scaling is quite good since we're not running perma Lava Burst builds but casting spells that can actually benefit from Crit. Our entire kit revolves around a 1min cd called Stormkeeper, I think we should be present in that bracket as a good buff target.

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Another question, if I may.

I'm 421 ILVL augmentation evoker with a build pretty close to all-round build from the guide, but without Accretion talent. Question is, "How to improve" page hammer the point that Essence should be spend as it's fills up. Now, a question is: what I'm supposed to spend if for?

I have two essence spenders: Eruption and Emerald Blossom. Eruption do 20244 dmg, with 1.7 sec cast, and damage is split between everything nearby. Living Flame, though, have the same cast time, hits two targets and deal a bit more damage. So, what's the benefit of casting Eruption, if I'm not in Ebon Might phase and do not have Accretion? (Or the answer is "well, that's why you take Accretion"?)

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On 7/12/2023 at 8:51 PM, Guest Icytroll said:

Quick comment on Elemental Shaman, this tier our Crit scaling is quite good since we're not running perma Lava Burst builds but casting spells that can actually benefit from Crit. Our entire kit revolves around a 1min cd called Stormkeeper, I think we should be present in that bracket as a good buff target.

I have changed the comment about the Crit scaling to make it more clear that diminshing returns are reducing the value of Prescience. Should be updated by tomorrow.

As per the Stormkeeper being a good buff target at the one minute mark: Yes, but it's not noticeably better than Elemental is at other points. The point of the listed cooldowns is to indicate a required cooldown for the spec to perform in the position it's ranked at.
Elemental is currently just listed in the fallback section as always being good to buff with Ebon Might no matter the time.

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On 7/13/2023 at 2:42 AM, Fearitha said:

Another question, if I may.

I'm 421 ILVL augmentation evoker with a build pretty close to all-round build from the guide, but without Accretion talent. Question is, "How to improve" page hammer the point that Essence should be spend as it's fills up. Now, a question is: what I'm supposed to spend if for?

I have two essence spenders: Eruption and Emerald Blossom. Eruption do 20244 dmg, with 1.7 sec cast, and damage is split between everything nearby. Living Flame, though, have the same cast time, hits two targets and deal a bit more damage. So, what's the benefit of casting Eruption, if I'm not in Ebon Might phase and do not have Accretion? (Or the answer is "well, that's why you take Accretion"?)

Eruption. And yeah. This is why you have Accretion 😛
Accretion is effectively a "mandatory talent" because under normal play it brings upheaval down to the same cooldown as Ebon Might & Fire Breath resyncing them.
Ideally, you extended your Ebon Might enough that you wont actually evercap on Essence before it comes off cooldown again but we don't live in an ideal world and sometimes you'll get a short Ebon Might.

Further comments about Dream of Spring:
You do not have the mana regeneration to sustain using Emerald Blossom as a primary spender for long.
Even if you take Dream of Spring it's recommended to only use them as a spender with an essence burst (as it would otherwise be 3 essence vs eruptions 2) and if you wouldn't overwrite an Ancient Flame. (If you're using it on progress and you pooled resources to dump several it can be fine to overwrite them to just dump the blossoms to deal with the damage event, but as a rule try to avoid it.)
 

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32 minutes ago, Saeldur said:

Even if you take Dream of Spring it's recommended to only use them as a spender with an essence burst (as it would otherwise be 3 essence vs eruptions 2) and if you wouldn't overwrite an Ancient Flame

Yeah, I also noticed that casting Emerald Blossom if you have both Essence Burst and Nourishing Sands active, it consumes both.

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8 hours ago, Saeldur said:

I have changed the comment about the Crit scaling to make it more clear that diminshing returns are reducing the value of Prescience. Should be updated by tomorrow.

As per the Stormkeeper being a good buff target at the one minute mark: Yes, but it's not noticeably better than Elemental is at other points. The point of the listed cooldowns is to indicate a required cooldown for the spec to perform in the position it's ranked at.
Elemental is currently just listed in the fallback section as always being good to buff with Ebon Might no matter the time.

Fair enough, thank you for elaborating.

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Guest klewy00

Outlaw doesn't have cooldowns?
Umm.. you sure sure about that, bud?

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