Damien

Guardian Druid 7.3

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This thread is for comments about our Guardian Druid guide for Legion.

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The talents recommended could use a little further clarification and discussion.  

In a single target fight, properly timing Bristling Fur and SotF will generate more rage over the course of the fight.  In multi Target fights, Galactic Guardian and Blood Frenzy will generate more rage.

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The Tier 5 talents are not very good described. Galactic Guardian gives you 15 rage when you use moonfire after it triggers. from a mathematic standpoint Galactic Guardian is nearly twice as good as Soul of the Forest without even considering the that it can trigger on every damaging event! Also it does more damage than soul of the forest, It should be described as the best talent in this tier with Guardian of Elune being the best for burst and soul of the forest being behind.

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It may be useful to consider that Crit also directly increases our Dodge, which should slightly increase its value.

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18 hours ago, Guest Raamak said:

The talents recommended could use a little further clarification and discussion.  

In a single target fight, properly timing Bristling Fur and SotF will generate more rage over the course of the fight.  In multi Target fights, Galactic Guardian and Blood Frenzy will generate more rage.

 

14 hours ago, Guest Atreyou said:

The Tier 5 talents are not very good described. Galactic Guardian gives you 15 rage when you use moonfire after it triggers. from a mathematic standpoint Galactic Guardian is nearly twice as good as Soul of the Forest without even considering the that it can trigger on every damaging event! Also it does more damage than soul of the forest, It should be described as the best talent in this tier with Guardian of Elune being the best for burst and soul of the forest being behind.

Thank you both. We pushed a rather large update through last night that I think addressed these (and other) issues. Hopefully.

10 hours ago, Guest Rrah said:

It may be useful to consider that Crit also directly increases our Dodge, which should slightly increase its value.

Thank you, I'll be adding this mention.

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1 hour ago, dranet said:

hi thinkin ov rerollin gardian druid in legion do u have any tips or can u help me with a guide ? 

Personally, I would recommend the guide at this link. It's very good, at least in my opinion. 

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Not convinced by your reasons for taking resto affinity over feral (but always open to the possibility that I'm the one who's wrong).

The passive from resto is a 3% heal every 5 seconds. In raids where you might have downtime, you can shift out of bear form and cast Swiftmend. I haven't played the test servers, but seem to recall Blizz saying they were working on minimizing tank downtime.

Feral, on the other hand, gives an always convenient 15% movement buff AND 35% faster energy regeneration.

At the very least this sounds like a viable option, while you make it sound one-sided.

 

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Though it sort of obvious, but I would suggest adding a brief note about Guardian of Elune talent: its important to track the buff and make sure not to override it using Mangle unless you pooling rage for a specific event as it reduces value of the talent / AM uptime.

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Not convinced by your reasons for taking resto affinity over feral (but always open to the possibility that I'm the one who's wrong).

The passive from resto is a 3% heal every 5 seconds. In raids where you might have downtime, you can shift out of bear form and cast Swiftmend. I haven't played the test servers, but seem to recall Blizz saying they were working on minimizing tank downtime.

Feral, on the other hand, gives an always convenient 15% movement buff AND 35% faster energy regeneration.

At the very least this sounds like a viable option, while you make it sound one-sided.

Good thoughts!
Since you already have really good mobility with Dash, Stampeding Roar and Displacer Beast/Wild Charge (If you chose one of them) I wouldn't say that the 15% movement speed increase is needed.
I'd recommend going for Balance Affinity if you feel that the passive healing aint beneficial.

5 yards increased range on all your spells should be prioritized over 15% movement speed in most scenarios.
Since you will be sitting in Bearform almost all the time (Might be a few fights where its not needed) the 35% energy regeneration is not going to benefit you alot.

 

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Though it sort of obvious, but I would suggest adding a brief note about Guardian of Elune talent: its important to track the buff and make sure not to override it using Mangle unless you pooling rage for a specific event as it reduces value of the talent / AM uptime.

I'll describe this talent more briefly, thanks for letting me know!

Cheers,
Naowh

Edited by Naowh

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Hi. I would see if anyone could give advice. I'm really struggling to keep aggro with this spec!  Any suggestions would greatly help 

Hi FuzzyFace5,

I noticed this yesterday aswell during our mainraid, both on my monk and druid. 
The TPS (threat per second) is pretty unbalanced right now, since your Artifact plays a big role.

I guess we sadly have to wait for Legion..
Although, Incarnation: Guardian of Ursoc is great for threat. Just make sure to spam mangle and use Growl to build as much as you can while its active.

Cheers,
Naowh

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I do not understand the recommendation to ever use Maul. Ever. Maul does not trigger Gore, and it does less damage than Swipe. A rage dump is not a justifiable excuse for the damage loss/missed Gore proc.

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I do not understand the recommendation to ever use Maul. Ever. Maul does not trigger Gore, and it does less damage than Swipe. A rage dump is not a justifiable excuse for the damage loss/missed Gore proc.

Hi archlael.

Maul should only be used when sitting on full Rage and your AM (Active Mitigaion) aint needed, for example when you're not actively tanking.
Maul is not on the GCD (Global Cooldown) and that is why you should use it to dump excessive Rage. Swipe is on the GCD however, and that is why it should only be used as a filler when your other abilities are on cooldown.

Cheers,
Naowh

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On July 22, 2016 at 7:42 AM, Naowh said:

Hi FuzzyFace5,

I noticed this yesterday aswell during our mainraid, both on my monk and druid. 
The TPS (threat per second) is pretty unbalanced right now, since your Artifact plays a big role.

I guess we sadly have to wait for Legion..
Although, Incarnation: Guardian of Ursoc is great for threat. Just make sure to spam mangle and use Growl to build as much as you can while its active.

Cheers,
Naowh

I am so glad to hear you say this. I play with a DK co-tank and did with a pally co-tank as well. Both are better geared than me, but it wasn't too dramatic. Prior to the patch I had no trouble holding aggro. After the patch I literally could not hold AE aggro in any situation. They had to tank everything or just auto attack. Even in single target situations I would commonly have to taunt back. It was extremely discouraging / worrying to me. 

Has anyone tanked as a guardian in a raid in Legion beta? I love my bear but I cannot go through the expansion like this. 

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I am so glad to hear you say this. I play with a DK co-tank and did with a pally co-tank as well. Both are better geared than me, but it wasn't too dramatic. Prior to the patch I had no trouble holding aggro. After the patch I literally could not hold AE aggro in any situation. They had to tank everything or just auto attack. Even in single target situations I would commonly have to taunt back. It was extremely discouraging / worrying to me. 

Has anyone tanked as a guardian in a raid in Legion beta? I love my bear but I cannot go through the expansion like this. 

Hi Ebonhorn,
Yeah I had to use my taunt button frequently last raid, I feel you..

I've been playing BrM / Guardian / Blood DK in Legion raids so far, and I havn't noticed anything special when it comes to threat.
Aritfact weapons plus all traits are going to play a big role for Legion so it's hard to say much right now, but atleast it's looking way better!

Cheers,
Naowh

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On 7/21/2016 at 2:12 AM, Arrawnn said:

Not convinced by your reasons for taking resto affinity over feral (but always open to the possibility that I'm the one who's wrong).

The passive from resto is a 3% heal every 5 seconds. In raids where you might have downtime, you can shift out of bear form and cast Swiftmend. I haven't played the test servers, but seem to recall Blizz saying they were working on minimizing tank downtime.

Feral, on the other hand, gives an always convenient 15% movement buff AND 35% faster energy regeneration.

At the very least this sounds like a viable option, while you make it sound one-sided.

 

Resto Affinity isn't that good, also it doesn't heal for 3% in Bear Form, in Bear Form it only heals for 1.5%. But out of bear form it heals for 3%. Bear form has a passive effect that reduces its effect by 50%, as can be seen on wowhead as well as in game by doing the math on the amount it heals you for in bear form.

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23 hours ago, Guest Super Bear said:

Resto Affinity isn't that good, also it doesn't heal for 3% in Bear Form, in Bear Form it only heals for 1.5%. But out of bear form it heals for 3%. Bear form has a passive effect that reduces its effect by 50%, as can be seen on wowhead as well as in game by doing the math on the amount it heals you for in bear form.

Really not convinced that any of the talents on that tier are must-haves. Extra range on Thrash and Swipe is ok, but most mobs come to us anyway and it's not hard to dance around thrashing to bring them all in. My bear is around 718 atm, with 850k health, and resto is giving him 12k heals every 5 seconds. And then there's feral with its 15% movement buff, which can be handy on Mannoroth or for any fight where you're running stuff out of group more frequently than roar comes off CD.

I've been spec'ing feral mostly as a QoL choice. It's just nice being a wee bit faster all the time.

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I strongly disagree with the tier 3 talent choices. Feral affinity is by FAR the best and really only good choice in this tier. If you are running 5 mans then balance could come into play for when a dps accidentally aggros another mob but other than that the extra range is kind of pointless and the heal from resto is just bad. Feral affinity is currently offering ~30% dps increase which is HUGE. However, the playstyle completely changes with it. You guys should add that feral is the top choice and give a in dept guide over how to bearcat.

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On 7/24/2016 at 1:23 AM, Guest Super Bear said:

Resto Affinity isn't that good, also it doesn't heal for 3% in Bear Form, in Bear Form it only heals for 1.5%. But out of bear form it heals for 3%. Bear form has a passive effect that reduces its effect by 50%, as can be seen on wowhead as well as in game by doing the math on the amount it heals you for in bear form.

If this isn't a bug, this is pretty stupid overall.  

3% is already borderline not competitive.  

Also, I just tested it and it is 1.5% whether you are in Bear Form or not, just by being in Guardian spec.  I tested in Caster, Bear, and Cat, still 1.5% in all of them.  

No tooltip anywhere in-game lists a reduction in the effect and every tooltip for Ysera's Gift says 3% while in Guardian spec, regardless of form.

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On 30.7.2016 at 3:08 AM, Guest Phyraan said:

I strongly disagree with the tier 3 talent choices. Feral affinity is by FAR the best and really only good choice in this tier. If you are running 5 mans then balance could come into play for when a dps accidentally aggros another mob but other than that the extra range is kind of pointless and the heal from resto is just bad. Feral affinity is currently offering ~30% dps increase which is HUGE. However, the playstyle completely changes with it. You guys should add that feral is the top choice and give a in dept guide over how to bearcat.

How does movement speed increase your damage? Or are you talking about the few encounters were you can leave bear for like 5-10 seconds? Either way 30% more dps sound like you made something up.

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I've just started with this build, and my buttons for Ironfur and Frenzied Regeneration are grayed out and never pop. Am I doing something wrong? Is it bugged? Should I petition it? I've been reading and some guides say that Ironfur isn't in the game currently?

Thanks for any help! I usually run a BrM or DK tank, so this is all new to me.

 

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I have a question for the artifact, even if it's not in this guide yet. Which golden trait should we pick first as guardian ?

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I've just started with this build, and my buttons for Ironfur and Frenzied Regeneration are grayed out and never pop. Am I doing something wrong? Is it bugged? Should I petition it? I've been reading and some guides say that Ironfur isn't in the game currently?

Thanks for any help! I usually run a BrM or DK tank, so this is all new to me.

Both Ironfur and Frenzied Regeneration requires Rage as a resource.
Both spells are in the game currently, so it seems like a bug to me since I havn't had any problems with this myself.

Try sending a ticket to blizzard!

Cheers,
Naowh

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