Starym

Legion Hotfixes: September 8th

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23026-legion-hotfixes-september-7th.png

 

Gem nerfs, no more mid-air stops after movement abilities, Blackrook Hold fixes and more.

The third set of hotfixes in as many days, a relatively minor one with the biggest change addressing the issue that gem secondary stats were a little out of order and made sockets a far too valuable affix on items, so they were toned down. Read the rest:

Blizzard LogoSeptember 8th

September 8


Hotfixes

Classes

  • (In progress) Players should no longer be stopped abruptly when executing uncontrolled movement spells such as Roll, Fel Rush, and Flying Serpent Kick.

Priest

  • (PvP) Holy Word: Chastise will no longer remove periodic damaging effects from targets in PvE situations.

Dungeons

  • Black Rook Hold
    • Fel Vomit from the Smashspite the Hateful encounter in Black Rook Hold will no longer persist after the encounter is defeated.

Items

  • The secondary stats on Legion gems have been significantly decreased.
    • Developers’ notes: Gems are not in the same place as they were in previous expansions. They’re a bit too powerful, and this was not intended. Sockets are still quite valuable and will continue to be so, but we need to reduce the difference between an item having a socket vs. not having a socket.

PvP

  • Ashran
    • Ashran Dominance now rewards 500 honor for completion.
    • Slay Them All now rewards 200 honor for completion.
  • Honor awarded from skirmishes has been tripled.

Professions

  • Enchanting Rank 2 and Rank 3 recipes now have the “Requires Previous Rank” text.
  • Mass Prospecting should now return the same amount of gems as normal Prospecting.

Quests

  • Players can now complete "WANTED: Shara Felbreath" after leaving combat and returning.
  • Enemies should now have lower health and damage in Chapter 3 of the Warrior Class Hall scenario.
  • A marker on your map should now appear for the objective of the Stormheim quest “The Trials Continue”.
  • Marksman hunters who left Niskara without talking to Vereesa can speak to her at Krassus' Landing to complete the "Rescue Mission" quest.
  • The Mage Order Campaign quest "What Is Going On Here" objectives should now complete reliably.

 

Suramar

  • Blackhawk's Bulwark PvP Captains should respawn more quickly.
  • Fel Cannons in Felsoul Hold should respawn more quickly.
  • The World Quest map marker for Starstalker Point Alliance has been moved to its accurate location.
  • During “Ghostship”, players can no longer use the Valarjar Harpoon to damage other players or player controlled NPCs.

 

 

Blizzard LogoBlizzard, September 7th

Classes

Hunter

  • Barrage now fires in a tighter cone, and its visual has been improved to better show its area of effect.
    • Developers’ Notes-- Barrage fulfills a fantasy of a wild spray of shots in a large area. Of course, that can be dangerous, and often Hunters accidentally pull additional enemies with Barrage, especially in Legion dungeons. We saw this as a failure on our part to convey what it actually does. This hotfix should allow Hunters to get a feel for the shape and size of it and build a reliable expectation of what will happen when they cast Barrage. No change was made to Barrage’s damage. We hope that this helps Hunters and their groupmates to have a more pleasant dungeon experience.

Rogue

  • Outlaw Rogues with Curse of the Dreadblades ability active will no longer take the backlash damage if Saber Slash strikes a second time.

Shaman

  • The Enhancement Shaman Stormflurry Artifact Trait will now properly interact with the Ascendance talent and the Windstrike ability.

Warrior

  • The Fury Warrior Artifact Trait Odyn's Champion has had its chance to activate doubled, but its effectiveness has been lowered. The tooltip will be incorrect until a future patch.

Class Halls

  • The Vault Ticket (Rogue) is now a daily reset instead of weekly reset.  This may not take effect until next Tuesday if you have already looted the Vault this week.
  • The "Deadlier Warglaives" quest (Demon Hunter) will now only consume a single Obliterum.

Dungeons

Maw of Souls

  • Helya: Decreased the frequency of Helya's Taint of the Sea during the Breached Vessel phase.
  • Helya: Altered the visual of Corrupted Bellow in order to perform better on lower-end machines.
  • Helya: Lowered the baseline damage of Corrupted Bellow and added a damage increase on subsequent damage events.

Holiday

  • Darkmoon Faire tinctures and droughts no longer work at 110.

NPCs

  • Vault Keepers in Stormheim should no longer become stuck and prevent players from looting the Glimmering Treasure Chest.

PvP

  • Players in a raid group will no longer earn PVP credit, nor receive Sightless Eyes in the Underbelly.

Professions

Cooking

  • (Work in progress) Fixing a bug that prevents players from being able to turn in “Opening the Test Kitchen” to Nomi.

Fishing

  • Players with the artifact trait "Better Luck Next Time" now have a chance to catch boots.

Quests

  • The damage done by the Fel Annihilator in the Battle for the Exodar scenario has been reduced.
  • Players who have completed "Jarl Come Back Now" but are not Neutral with Jandvik Vrykul can return to Toryl in Jandvik to get their reputation reset.

Suramar

  • Blackhawk's Bulwark PvP Captains should respawn more quickly.
  • Fel Cannons in Felsoul Hold should respawn more quickly.

 

Zones

  • An unintended increase in player population in certain zones, notably Class Halls, has been fixed.

 

Blizzard LogoBlizzard, September 6th

Classes

Demon Hunter

  • (Hotfix in testing) Demon Hunter Sigils will now correctly activate if the Demon Hunter is crowd controlled after placing the Sigil.

Priest

  • The Discipline Priest artifact trait Sins of the Many will now properly increase Atonement healing done.
  • Spending artifact trait points as a Discipline Priest should no longer reduce the amount of Atonement healing done by Shadowfiend or Mindbender.

Class Halls

  • In Skyhold, Quartermaster Durnholf will pay more attention to players and not walk away from them so quickly.

Dungeons

  • Assault on Violet Hold
    • Mindflayer Kaahrj's Faceless Tendril should now prefer targets that are not being targeted by Eternal Darkness.
    • Corrected a spawn location for Mindflayer Kaahrj's Faceless Tendril that was inside the floor.
  • Maw of Souls
    • Helarjar Champions’ Bone Chilling Scream does not hit pets anymore.
  • Darkheart Thicket
    • Rotheart Keeper's Vile Mushrooms now explode, damaging nearby enemies.
       

Items

  • (Hotfix in testing) Rocfeather Skyhorn Kite: cooldown raised to 15 minutes (was 2 minutes). Shared cooldown raised to 3 minutes.
  • (Hotfix in testing) Brulfist Idol: Knockback height reduced significantly.
    • Developers’ Notes: The two toys above (combined, or in conjunction with other things such as Emerald Winds) were too effective and diminished the value of utility and world-navigation tools that are core to certain classes and professions.
  • Touch of the Void: the tentacles summoned by this trinket no longer scale past level 100.
  • Reduced the active effect potency of Heirloom trinkets acquired from Warlords of Draenor Mythic Dungeons.
  • Fixed a bug that could cause players, who were simultaneously both very lucky and very unlucky, to receive the same legendary item more than once.

Missions

  • Significantly improved the quality of the bonus reward available on Artifact Power missions..

NPCs

  • Pollous the Fetid in Val'sharah should no longer evade and become unkillable.
  • Unstable Powers now target fewer players with their Unstable Power orbs.
  • Inquisitor Tivos’ Drain and Searing Gaze should now target fewer players.

Professions

Engineering

  • Gunshoes and Gunpowder Charges should now craft stacks instead of single items.

Skinning

  • The amounts of leather and scales dropped per creature skinned have been reduced.

Quests

  • Druids who abandoned either "Essence of Balance" or "Essence of Regrowth" should now be able to reaccept the quests by returning to the Emerald Dreamway.
  • Profession World Quests can now be completed in a raid group.

Suramar

  • Completing the quest "Make Your Mark" should now properly count progress towards the achievement "Why Can't I Hold All This Mana?"
  • Players who have completed "Jarl Come Back Now" but are not Neutral with Jandvik Vrykul can return to Toryl in Jandvik to get their reputation reset.

 

Blizzard LogoBlizzard, September 2nd

Classes

Demon Hunter

  • The Havoc Demon Hunter Artifact ability Fury of the Illidari no longer plays an extra spell effect visual from the gold trait Rage of the Illidari without the Rage of the Illidari trait learned.

Druid

  • Healing Touch (Balance and Guardian Druids) healing increased 33% and mana cost increased 100%.
  • Full Moon will now always deal full damage to the primary target. Damage is reduced for secondary targets.

Hunter

  • Dead Survival Hunters will now be able to swim in their Eagle Ghost Form.

Priest

  • Spending trait points in the Discipline Priest Artifact will now properly also increase the damage of your Mindbender or Shadowfiend summons.

Shaman

  • The Sharas’dal, Scepter of Tides buff Queen’s Decree is no longer dispellable.

Warlock

  • Soul Harvest should no longer incorrectly aggro all enemies in sight.
  • Demonic Empowerment, Demonwrath, and Thal'kiel's Consumption no longer require line of sight to your pets.

Class Halls

  • Artifact Power gained from class-specific Class Hall Missions have been increased.
  • Priests who have completed the quest "Recruiting More Troops" should now be able to recruit troops from Vicar Eliza.
  • Bubbling Keg in the Monk Class Hall now respawns more quickly.
  • The Swirling Void Potion item from the Priest Class Hall Advancement "Altars of Blessing" now properly provides the Void Infused buff to players.
  • The different areas of the Shaman Class Hall have been united into a single chat channel.

Dungeons

  • Players are able to enter a Random Legion Heroic if they are locked to all Legion Heroic Dungeons.

Neltharion's Lair

  • Ularogg Cragshaper now starts with more energy when he enters combat.

NPCs

  • Helarjar Soulkeepers will no longer cast Expel Soul.

Professions

  • The engineer-only auction house in Dalaran should now be fully functional.
  • Players should no longer be spammed with new recipe notifications during the blacksmithing quest "Ironhorn Leysmithing".

PvP

  • Demon Hunter Glide speed is reduced while carrying a battleground flag.
  • Demon Hunter Fel Rush speed is reduced when cast in the air while carrying a battleground flag.

Quests

  • The Druid quest “Focusing the Energies” will no longer consume all Blood of Sargeras in your inventory.

Artifact

  • Players who log out during “The Heart of the Dreadscar” should be able to proceed with the quest when they log back in.
  • For “The New Blood”, players can now loot an additional Tome of Blighted Implements to fulfill the requirement to do so if they already have the Tome of Blighted Implements in their inventory.
  • Fleet Admiral Tethys is now available in the Hall of Shadows to turn in "The Dreadblades", even when Fleet Admiral Tethys is in Stormheim.
  • Warriors who enter the scenario for "The Hunter of Heroes" will now properly advance the quest if they walk into Tideskorn rather than take Aerylia’s ride.
  • Tyrosus will now be waiting in Dalaran correctly for Holy Paladins returning to turn in "The Silver Hand".

Azsuna

  • Players should more reliably receive credit during the quest "Back From The Dead".

Highmountain

  • The Legion has it out for Malfurion in the War of the Ancients quest “Huln’s War – Reinforcements”. They are now sending three times as many wrathguards to stop him from summoning dryad reinforcements.

Stormheim

  • Players are now able to turn in "Blood and Gold" at Yotnar, who is visible after completing the later trials in the quest chain.
  • The Ancient Tideskorn Blade for the quest "To Honor the Fallen" should now drop 100% of the time from Kvaldir vrykul in Helmouth Shallows.

Suramar

  • Players leading a Withered army after turning in “Feed Thalyssra” should be able to access a chest that was previously inaccessible.

Zones

  • Added a new graveyard at the top of Thorim's Peak in Stormheim.

 

Blizzard LogoBlizzard, September 1


Hotfixes

Classes

Death Knight

  • Anti-Magic Barrier should no longer grant more than the intended bonus when combined with other effects that increase health.
  • Vampiric Blood should no longer grant more than the intended bonus when combined with other effects that increase health.

Mage

  • Ignite spreading will no longer incorrectly remove other Mages' Ignite.

Monk

  • Fortifying Brew should no longer grant more than the intended bonus when combined with other effects that increase health.

Shaman

  • Enhancement Shamans should no longer be prevented from using instant Healing Surge while moving.

Warrior

  • Commanding Shout should no longer grant more than the intended bonus when combined with other effects that increase health.

Items

  • The tooltip for Tome of the Clear Mind now correctly states a maximum player level of 109 for its use.
  • Equippable items from Legion dungeon treasure chests should match your class proficiencies.
  • Skaggldrynk should now properly share a cooldown with other combat potions.

NPCs

  • Tarben <Jarl of Tideskorn Harbor> should now cast his Jarl’s Command fear spell a bit less often.
  • In Darkbrul Arena, Stonefist Brawler’s stun attack should now be removable by effects that remove stuns.

Professions

  • Reaves Module: Snack Distribution Mode no longer requires feasts.

PvP

  • Experience earned from gaining Honor has been reduced by approximately 50%.
    • Developer’s note: We want battlegrounds and skirmishes to be a worthwhile and rewarding activity while leveling, but that should not be the most efficient method for gaining XP. While we've decreased the experience from PvP, it is still more efficient than it was in previous expansions.

Quests

  • Fixed an issue where faction transfers would interfere with Death Knight's ability to complete the Class Hall quest "The Firstborn Rises".
  • Fixed a bug causing players who died during the sequence of Dalaran's teleportion would get stuck in Deadwind Pass.
  • Paladins should now be able to progress with their Class Hall Campaigns after completing the quest "The Scion's Legacy", by speaking with Lord Maxwell Tyrosus.
  • Teensy Weensy Fae Dragons should now appear more frequently during the quest “Teensy Weenies!”.

Artifact

  • Rogue player should no longer sometimes experience issues using their Smoke Bomb during "The Unseen Blade".
  • Players should no longer be erroneously placed in a phase in Deadwind Pass that makes them unable to complete quests in the area, including "Following the Curse."
  • Hunters completing to quest to obtain their second or third artifact should no longer receive the quest "Hunter to Hunter" after turn-in.
  • The points of interest for the Warrior quest “Legacy of the Icebreaker" are now displaying correctly and the stage objectives update appropriately.

Azsuna

  • Daglop should no longer disengage with the player, allowing “Minion! Kill Them!” to be completed normally.
  • During "The Right Weapon for the Job", shipwrecked captives in the Shipwreck Arena clubhouse should no longer glow as if they’re viable targets for the quest.
  • Players who leave the area and return during the “The Scythe of Souls” should be able to complete the quest.
  • Players entering the Nor'danil Wellspring in Azsuna should no longer be incorrectly queued to enter the Withered Scenario in Suramar.
  • Players should no longer fail to loot several quest objects in the Nar’thalas Academy during quests such as "Study Hall: Combat Research" and “Dressing with Class”.

Highmountain

  • The bungee rope attached to the player should no longer disappear during the quest “Going Down, Going Up”.
  • Mayla Highmountain should no longer leave combat and reset the Wrath of Dargrul boss fight during “The Underking”.
  • On “Murlocs: The Next Generation” and “Oh, the Clawdacity!”, Murky’s abilities no longer affect other players in PvP. Gurrullrurlll mrrrgrglru ruluulll.

Stormheim

  • "Waking the Shieldmaiden" now has a correctly-placed location dot on the map.

Val’sharah

  • Fixed a number of issues with the "Defend The Temple" Bonus Objective in Val'sharah.

UI

  • Obelisk of the Void should appear in the Dungeon Journal for all ranged damage dealers and healers.

Zones

  • Orgrimmar, Stormwind, and previously invasion-affected areas should once again be unified for single realms.
    • Developer’s note: On RP servers, we’re setting sharding and cross-realm zoning back to how things were working before the Burning Legion invaded. This had been changed for stability during pre-launch events and invasions.
 
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I feel the gem nerf is counter intuitive to what the devs have denoted as their intention earlier. With WoD the new system was that gem slots would be super valuable. So, a raid drop could be the basic version. Then it could be warforged. Then the top goal was the have warforged with a socket. This was to encourage people to repeat the same raid (and keep those sub fees coming in) and to reward them for it. By nerfing it in many ways that goal is sort of gone. If I am to keep doing the same content the reward must be worth it and be satisfying. A sizeable dps increase is a good reward. Something like a 1% increase, not so much. Now, I know they were trying to address the issue of power creep. Where suddenly we get a tier bonus or trinket and our dps triples and we can face roll anything. However, you lower that too much and the incentive to continue is gone. 

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19 minutes ago, demonardvark said:

I feel the gem nerf is counter intuitive to what the devs have denoted as their intention earlier. With WoD the new system was that gem slots would be super valuable. So, a raid drop could be the basic version. Then it could be warforged. Then the top goal was the have warforged with a socket. This was to encourage people to repeat the same raid (and keep those sub fees coming in) and to reward them for it. By nerfing it in many ways that goal is sort of gone. If I am to keep doing the same content the reward must be worth it and be satisfying. A sizeable dps increase is a good reward. Something like a 1% increase, not so much. Now, I know they were trying to address the issue of power creep. Where suddenly we get a tier bonus or trinket and our dps triples and we can face roll anything. However, you lower that too much and the incentive to continue is gone. 

For sure. It feels like now the focus is entirely on the new Titanforged system, rather than caring about sockets.

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Just now, Blainie said:

For sure. It feels like now the focus is entirely on the new Titanforged system, rather than caring about sockets.

Agreed and I frankly don't like the titanforge system that much. I feel its purely designed to keep people resubbing somewhat if you will like a slot machine. Now, not only do you need a specific piece to drop at X percent, now you need to roll, to try to get it to stack to an appropriate ilvl. Now, you can somehow earn seals or whatever currency to do so, but then you in theory have to burn them all for a single piece. Now, i've already seen some crazyness, a guy in my guild had an item titanforge like 4 times in a row. However, I can math good. The odds are exceedingly low. 

Now, it is clear to anyone that played both games, that Legion is heavily influenced by Diablo. World quests, keystones, etc. I think the loot system is to match that. Where in diablo its not enough to get the item drop it needs the right stats. So you can spend 300 hours trying to get the right weapon. If the raid drops are more frequent that's not necessarily an issue, however, it took me 89 kills and 36 caches to get vial of convulsive shadows off iron maidens in wod. Now your telling me I need to roll it better? 

Certainly hardcore min maxers will be drawn to this, however, I don't feel many people will want to play titanforge slot machine.

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14 minutes ago, demonardvark said:

Agreed and I frankly don't like the titanforge system that much. I feel its purely designed to keep people resubbing somewhat if you will like a slot machine. Now, not only do you need a specific piece to drop at X percent, now you need to roll, to try to get it to stack to an appropriate ilvl. Now, you can somehow earn seals or whatever currency to do so, but then you in theory have to burn them all for a single piece. Now, i've already seen some crazyness, a guy in my guild had an item titanforge like 4 times in a row. However, I can math good. The odds are exceedingly low. 

Now, it is clear to anyone that played both games, that Legion is heavily influenced by Diablo. World quests, keystones, etc. I think the loot system is to match that. Where in diablo its not enough to get the item drop it needs the right stats. So you can spend 300 hours trying to get the right weapon. If the raid drops are more frequent that's not necessarily an issue, however, it took me 89 kills and 36 caches to get vial of convulsive shadows off iron maidens in wod. Now your telling me I need to roll it better? 

Certainly hardcore min maxers will be drawn to this, however, I don't feel many people will want to play titanforge slot machine.

A good comparison that seems to be being made more and more as the days pass. I don't think it's a bad thing and I really do love Legion right now, but the gearing system could perhaps use another look.

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27 minutes ago, Blainie said:

A good comparison that seems to be being made more and more as the days pass. I don't think it's a bad thing and I really do love Legion right now, but the gearing system could perhaps use another look.

pretty much 100% agree. The other game i compared the loot system to was destiny, there it works because you can roll a lot more frequently so it's not the big of a deal. It follows the diablo trend a little harder, 95% of what you get will be garbage, but once you get something it's a guaranteed (more or less) upgrade.

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9 minutes ago, demonardvark said:

pretty much 100% agree. The other game i compared the loot system to was destiny, there it works because you can roll a lot more frequently so it's not the big of a deal. It follows the diablo trend a little harder, 95% of what you get will be garbage, but once you get something it's a guaranteed (more or less) upgrade.

At least in Diablo, when I do get something good, I'm overjoyed. It's also good that we can trade the loot away if it is on PL. I don't want to be sitting there disenchanting my BiS chest just because it isn't titanforged by 5 more item levels.

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Re: Titanforging, I'm pretty sure blizz at one point confirmed that the 'hit' chance for each roll was the same (5% if I remember correctly).  

And yeah, gems losing their luster (what secondary stats?) is pretty disappointing.  Probably a good thing I sold as many as I could early :\

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Just now, MrEdren said:

Re: Titanforging, I'm pretty sure blizz at one point confirmed that the 'hit' chance for each roll was the same (5% if I remember correctly).  

And yeah, gems losing their luster (what secondary stats?) is pretty disappointing.  Probably a good thing I sold as many as I could early :\

Correct, however, the way statistics works when calculating the chance of an action repeating you multiple the probability of it not add it. So, flip a coin whats the percent chance you get heads? 50/50. Flip two coins, what the percent chance you get 2 heads. people want to say 50/50 but it's really 25%. This compounds. So, lets say a piece of gear needs to titan forge 4 times. 5% chance alright lets roll, wrong. A 5 percent chance is .05 so multiplied four times you get 0.00000625 or .000625% chance of success. So, while our first roll might be good, the odds of each additional roll succeeding becomes exponentially worse. They way this plays out if you basically have to default get a higher titan forge before wasting seals to roll on it. Simply because you only need say 2 success now vs four, however, there is still the default 5% or lower chance of the initial titan forge.

So, in short, that 7% drop item, has a much higher chance of garbage because of the needed additional rolls on it.  So, the short of it is patience will be mandatory. You need the initial luck of a pre-titan forged item (which of course has lower drop rate) and then it's worth the risk to spend the currency for additional rolls on it. Now, if there is no cap on total owned or a high one (i think 10 was old one) then it's not terrible but it dictates a whole lot of work for just one good item (better spend it on them trinkets that are supposed to be so good xD)

also i feel bad for all the jewelcrafters out there, demand is going to be low

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2 hours ago, demonardvark said:

I feel the gem nerf is counter intuitive to what the devs have denoted as their intention earlier. With WoD the new system was that gem slots would be super valuable. So, a raid drop could be the basic version. Then it could be warforged. Then the top goal was the have warforged with a socket. This was to encourage people to repeat the same raid (and keep those sub fees coming in) and to reward them for it. By nerfing it in many ways that goal is sort of gone. If I am to keep doing the same content the reward must be worth it and be satisfying. A sizeable dps increase is a good reward. Something like a 1% increase, not so much. Now, I know they were trying to address the issue of power creep. Where suddenly we get a tier bonus or trinket and our dps triples and we can face roll anything. However, you lower that too much and the incentive to continue is gone. 

While I agree with that (and the rest you posted) I have to say I'm pretty happy about this change for the world first race. The less randomized top gear is the fairer the race. As you say personally I REALLY need big incentives to keep running the same stuff again and again, this is where is fully disagree with Blainie and Diablo, there really is NOW big upgrade in that game anymore as you get basically all you need in the first 3 days of a season and then the rest is just Ancient upgrades that are not as huge.

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17 minutes ago, Starym said:

have to say I'm pretty happy about this change for the world first race.

Fact is: most of us don't care at all about the world first.

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1 hour ago, Starym said:

While I agree with that (and the rest you posted) I have to say I'm pretty happy about this change for the world first race. The less randomized top gear is the fairer the race. As you say personally I REALLY need big incentives to keep running the same stuff again and again, this is where is fully disagree with Blainie and Diablo, there really is NOW big upgrade in that game anymore as you get basically all you need in the first 3 days of a season and then the rest is just Ancient upgrades that are not as huge.

that is the one thing that blizz devs said they wanted to fix and they did. Another big one is the raid power as a whole. Atypically what happened was one person would get tier set or super trinket, or they would be gifted it via master looter, and all of a sudden they are doing exponentially higher damage than everyone else. While I liked this myself as it helped progression blizzard didn't like it. Their words and the math shows, that the raid as a whole will sit at more or less the same total power, and will rise  as a whole gradually. So instead of one person getting 50% more damage each week we'll ALL get like 2-3% if you will.

53 minutes ago, Kirr said:

Fact is: most of us don't care at all about the world first.

I agree with this too. Especially world first class or server first class to top level. That just means you took the day off and burned through everything as fast as possible without enjoy it, it's almost sad in a way. Plus the world first race is like the top of the diablo rift leaderboards, there is a lot of cheating and exploiting going on. While Blizz addresses some if it, its well known that account sharing and character transferring, etc, goes on a lot. Heck, in my backwater server the top guild is known to pay for realm transfers and stuff.

Plus with a lot of the add ons and extensions people get you have to question if that counts. Now like Mythic Kormrok in HFC would have been a @#$@# without add ons. but still. I'm glad blizz is limiting them. Picture related :)

1ab6jx.jpg

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I just meant the actual main race for World Firsts. I feel for those guys in the top guilds working so hard to be competitive and really don't like when there's so much randomness and then the win might come just down to who got better RNG or grinded more beforehand (like what happened on Spine of Deathwing with the legendary staff).

As I said for me I prefer the BIG upgrades, they're the only ones that make me want to keep playing after the rest of the content is done (although Legion is doing a superb job of having that pre-grind content last a looooong time).

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5 hours ago, Starym said:

While I agree with that (and the rest you posted) I have to say I'm pretty happy about this change for the world first race. The less randomized top gear is the fairer the race. As you say personally I REALLY need big incentives to keep running the same stuff again and again, this is where is fully disagree with Blainie and Diablo, there really is NOW big upgrade in that game anymore as you get basically all you need in the first 3 days of a season and then the rest is just Ancient upgrades that are not as huge.

Thing is, surely Warforged is simply the same as Ancient now? You get your normal set of items which can comfortably see you through the content at hand. Then you get your Warforged items for that tiny boost of damage, then you sit there and watch as other WF pieces pass you by, praying that one of them has a socket or has rolled a higher TF version, in the same way that you're waiting for your new Ancient piece to finally roll CHD or whatever.

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6 hours ago, Blainie said:

Thing is, surely Warforged is simply the same as Ancient now? You get your normal set of items which can comfortably see you through the content at hand. Then you get your Warforged items for that tiny boost of damage, then you sit there and watch as other WF pieces pass you by, praying that one of them has a socket or has rolled a higher TF version, in the same way that you're waiting for your new Ancient piece to finally roll CHD or whatever.

The difference being Diablo items all have actual abilities and aren't just stats, so getting that intitial item that changes the way you play is huge. getting that same item but ancient is boring. In wow it's just stats for both versions.

Except ofc for sets, they just ruined everything in D3.

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7 hours ago, Starym said:

The difference being Diablo items all have actual abilities and aren't just stats, so getting that intitial item that changes the way you play is huge. getting that same item but ancient is boring. In wow it's just stats for both versions.

Except ofc for sets, they just ruined everything in D3.

I should have clarified, I was making the comparison between the set items. I agree that it's less similar with things like off-pieces. You're definitely right there.

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    • By Starym
      Update: it seems the whole thing was a misunderstanding:
      You can also check out his thoughts on the whole thing in our interview.
      Ythisens (source)
      As a reminder, posting about account actions is generally not allowed on the forums and it is not a means to appeal or resolve issues. This was resolved privately between this player and us after the video he posted this morning.

      Just pulling back the curtain a little here but long story short, this was a mistake on our end. This player actually has a great history of reporting issues with us that they've found, and they wait for us to verify it's fixed before they put the videos up. This was a case of not everyone internally knowing this was happening and that the exploits he showcased were fixed, before the videos were posted.

      The videos being posted are an example of great bug reporting in how detailed they are in showing how exactly to reproduce an issue. This is something Ion hit on in the last Q&A where he talked about the Quality Assurance team and how they have to reproduce issues that players report to us. Sometimes reports aren't detailed enough and it makes it a little harder to figure out some issues.

      I just want to end this by plugging the correct channels to report bugs in.
      To report a bug in-game: Click Help to open the Customer Support window.
      Click Submit Bug.
      Enter the details of the bug, making sure to follow the guidelines outlined on the submission form.
      Click Submit.
      You can also report bugs over in the Bug Reporting Forum here:
      https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/1012660/

      If you'd like to report something like an exploit and not advertise it, a way you can report that it is here:
      https://us.blizzard.com/en-us/submit/hacks.html
       
      This is not the case at all on any point that you've made. The MVPs@blizzard.com email address is for any and all concerns regarding the MVPs. Please stop trying to spread false information in threads.  
      Updated.
      Well this is a little sad, or great depending on your outlook - Rextroy, the Paladin who recently soloed both MOTHER and Vectis in Uldir (with Vecits taking all of 0.5 seconds) with very, very creative use of game mechanics, got banned for a month. The Vectis kill in particular seemed to be a sore spot, as it got him reported many times, but there's still no word from Blizzard on what specific incident caused the ban.
       
      Check out Rextroy's thoughts on the matter below and check back later in the week when we'll be posting an in-depth interview with the new solo king (or rather, highest profile soloer at the moment), focusing on the exploit/creative use of game mechanics dichotomy.
    • By Starym
      The community is split over Rextroy's solo kills, especially the recent ones in Uldir, and the age-old argument over what constitutes an exploit and a bannable offense has returned. Everyone has their own opinion on the matter, but Blizzard has stepped in and given their opinion, with Rextroy receiving a 1 month ban earlier today. We were already in the middle of an in-depth interview with the man himself when the ban hit, so we're going to be splitting in into two, with today's focusing on the ban itself, as well as what he thinks of the exploit vs. creative use of game mechanics issue. We also get to hear about how he could have used the mechanics he found to one-shot Mythic bosses, but instead decided to do it on Normal.
       
      What are your thoughts on the ban in general?
      Well it feels quite bad, but I was prepared to someday be banned for the things I do, most of my major solo kills use some kind of "cheese" or unintended interaction between abilities. However, it was never to gain any competitive advantage over other players. I do really wish I knew what the exact reason I was banned was (if it was for Vectis… killing people in Stormsong, stacking traits for one shotting people in Arena or something else)

      Do you feel like more of a beta tester for Blizzard? You’ve said in the past that you send the reports in advance of posting your videos.
      I don’t send reports on all the videos, I only do it on the major ones that could be exploited for competitive gain (the Vectis one and one earlier back in Legion, when you could turn immune to damage and solo bosses).
      One thing I need to clarify about the monkey - guard one shot combo that I saw people talk about is my use of it in Stormsong Valley VS Uldir. I did use the same tactic a few weeks ago to one shot people in Stormsong. I didn’t bother to report about it back because I never thought it were anything major. You could spend 30 minutes to gather up guards, to turn into a slow moving one shot machine that couldn’t chase anyone that didn’t engage. And that had 2 easy counters: killing the monkey and other alliance players. At the time I just thought that it was something silly broken for WPvP (like a lot of other things), I didn’t think about the Uldir strat back then and that it could be used in bigger ways than expected.
      When I discovered about the raid warlock summon tactic, I kept trying it until I got the timing right. I had my friends wait probably 8 hours in total until I finally got it down (I have really good friends!) This cheesy strat however, I realized could be used for Mythic progress etc, so I asked WoWhead if they could help me get in contact with someone from Blizzard, which they helped me with!
      I reported it to them and they fixed it within a few hours. After that I uploaded the video since it's quite an insane bug and I was sure most people would enjoy seeing it, however wouldn't be able to take advantage of it. (And no I got no ingame advantage from it, I don’t care about the 355 trinket since I got great 365 ones)
      Now to get back to the point, I guess I feel a bit like a QA tester, however I don’t fault Blizzard for having these bugs not fixed. They are quite out of the box and most people wouldn’t think of them.

      Is 1 month too much for a first infraction?
      It's my first infraction, and I would have liked a warning!... Or at least an email saying the exact reason I got banned.

      How did the ban make you feel?
      Well I did get a bit surprised since I talked to a US customer manager about it, and the team seemed alright with my videos, and since I made sure to have it fixed before uploading the Vectis kill so no one could abuse it…
      I am currently appealing the ban, seems like the EU devs suspending me didn’t know that I had contact with them from US. Will see where it leads. However, if the ban stays I feel a bit uncertain what things that are ingame are considered exploits, and which things are considered clever use.

      So the big question at the center of everything: what is an exploit and what is creative use of game mechanics? Do you consider what you do exploiting/cheating?
      This is one of the questions I am sure a lot of people wonder about and that I can’t give an answer to, don’t think anyone can. I don’t actually consider what I do exploiting. I personally consider exploiting using tactics to gain an unfair advantage in a competitive sense. Nothing (in my opinion) that I have done so far has been with a competitive advantage. My solos back in Legion usually took 6-9 hours to defeat a single boss. Vectis one shot took A LOT of hours to get the timing right (it also took a lot of time from my friends helping me, who didn’t get any loot) and Mother solo also took a long time to bring all the worms. All of this could be done much MUCH faster with a standard group.
      If I had used the tactic (with the monkey and a group of friends) to one shot mythic bosses and gain gear and achievements from it that I needed, I would consider it exploiting, since I would be using it to gain an advantage.
      Now some people can bring up the point about the Last Surprise one shot. I don’t consider that an exploit either since it really is just stacking up 3 traits… That would be like a talent being OP and people using it would be exploiting. Is using something overpowered an exploit?

      At what point do you feel an exploit should be punished with a ban?
      This is really hard to tell, there are a lot of exploits which aren’t ban worthy by my own definition. Such as the Spellsteal incident back in Legion in Black Rook Hold (spellstealing a buff to gain a huge damage increase in a competitive sense). According to my own definition it is an exploit... but it is such a simple and obvious exploit (using a class ability) so that it in no way deserves a ban. It is more of an oversight from Blizzards part.
      If you found something huge, game-breaking that would take days for Blizzard to fix and would ruin things such as the Arena ladder, World First Mythic Race, crash the server and you intentionally use it simply to maliciously grief the things listed then I would consider it ban-worthy.
      However, I wouldn’t say most other things are ban-worthy. I really enjoy the creativity players have when they find things. If I were a game developer and people found unique ways to play through challenges I put in front of them I might fix their method (if it is broken), but I would approve of them thinking outside the box and discovering things, never ban them. It would be my own mistake for letting it slip into players hands. I do wish Blizzard would put a better definition when it comes to clever use and exploits. It feels really vague right now.

      Do you have any alts you’d continue your solo attempts on in this month (or in general if you got perma-banned)?
      I didn’t have any major solo plan this month (I did think about some m+), but Uldir wise I am temporarily out of ideas. Might discover some of course, but thought about focusing on some guides / PvP. I will most likely wait out the monthly ban if it ain't appealed and then return afterwards. If I someday were perma banned I'm quite positive I would create a new acc (I wouldn’t give up on Rextroy easily tho!)

      You don’t actually “profit” from these kills in terms of gear, correct? Your gear is above the one you get from them and you presumably have a raid group that’s on Heroic or higher difficulty?
      I currently got 368. So far I haven’t benefited gear wise from any of my solo kills (both in Legion and BfA). Have read a lot of people saying I exploited to get the trinket from Vectis but I could happily delete it since I don’t feel I got any use of it. I got 365 trinkets right now.

      Have you ever run across anything as ridiculous as the Vectis trick/bug? What would be your second and third favorites?
      Vectis is surely one of my top ones, however there are two back in Legion I felt really happy about finding.
      The first one is a bug when you became immune to damage taken inside the Antorus raid. I could if I wanted to solo a lot of Mythic bosses but I reported it and just demonstrated it on normal High Command (it never went viral tho, most likely because BFA was around the corner).
      My Khadgar “solo” was also hilarious, both of these videos I linked were such ridiculous bugs but also really fun ones. They were amusing to edit as well!
      I kinda want to give an honorable mention to my Kin’garoth solo. I attempted him for quite a long time to try him the normal way (outlive the berserk) and then someday I figured out the strat to bug out the adds and get him down, felt really good finding out about that strat!

      Are you/will you be trying Mythic+ solos?
      Fun thing is that I was going to attempt +8 Motherlode today but then I noticed I got banned… But yes I plan to attempt quite a few of those, will be fun trying it out! I also look forward to future raids to see the boss mechanics / ways around them.

      Will you continue to test out the limits of bosses and try to kill them in the weirdest ways possible in the future?
      Definitely! One of the best feelings is finding out these strange tactics and sharing them with the community (after a fix has been applied if it is too major)!
      It is like the iconic Kazzak Reckoning bomb and Naxx Mage solo videos, people seem to really enjoy those and I feel like it can strengthen the WoW community / keep people interested in the game. Because if people notice these things they can be inspired to play in other unique ways… If you get my point!

      Do you think what you do benefits the game?
      I do think so. I doubt World of Warcraft lost many people because of my videos but hopefully a lot of people stayed / started playing again because they were inspired. When it comes to bug finding I'm sure it benefits the game as well, since Blizzard will know about it for the future and be more on their toes when they release things.

      What would you say to the many community members that reported you and, well, basically hate you because they think what you’re doing is wrong?
      Well I don’t agree with their opinion that what I did was wrong, it is not like I broke anything or gained any major advantage of it. Just simply showed off a cool unique mechanic. I didn’t try to ruin anyone's game!
      With that said I was once much more strict and much less “clever”, always used to play the exact way the game was intended but since I started soloing seriously / finding out all the weird ways around things, I do explore the “clever” part of the game a lot more. I still got a strict sense of not using any exploits for competitive advantages, I am sure some of our community members think I do use it for those reasons but it is not my intent.
       
      That's it for part one and we'll be back next week(ish) with the second, focusing more on Rextroy's WoW background, inspirations for starting up soloing and more.
      What constitues an exploit and a bannable offence, consequences of the ban and more.
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      Image source: Reddit
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      Wowprogress still hasn't updated with the KJ kill - if it ever does, given that it was done by a disbanded guild
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    • By Stan
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