Conso

BM DPS help

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My guild just ran Heroic EN tonight and we had someone record logs, I thought I was doing fairly well as BM but according to these logs i only beat 27% of the BM hunters, meaning, I am sucking bad at the 73%? all "encounters" including wipes, not trash, 200k DPS, that quite bad in heroic. Here's the logs for the raid...

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Yj9GmtzQcBLaDHFK/

I have been gearing using Pawn add-on and plugging in MrRobot.com stat weights, stacking for mastery then haste, here's the armory of my character...

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/icecrown/Helim/simple

Is it just me or am I doing TERRIBLE for my gear level?

Are in-game damage meters THAT innaccurate? I use Skada and it usually shows me doing a lot more, 260-270ish usually

Edited by Conso

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Straight up you have 4 items without mastery on them. They need to be replaced ASAP (Legendary is alright until you can get something better though). Your mastery is low for your ilvl, I'm only 868 at this stage and I'm at nearly 12k mastery. Also have you used Azor's pawn string? It's slightly modified and slightly more accurate. 

And in-game damage meters are usually quite good but everyone's varies. Realistically at your ilvl you should be at 300k dps single target, anything under about 270k is quite poor for your ilvl. But again that's just down to some gear choices and minor fixes (as noted below).

Stampede? Killer Cobra is by far the default choice for single target DPS. Stampede is only useful on fights where you have immobile targets for 12 seconds. 

Are you flasking and pre-potting and then potting again later in the fight?

Relic choices? Jaws of Thunder is the best choice to go for relics even if you lose multiple ilvls on the relic. If you look on the simulations section of the BM guide, it has Jaws of Thunder as a significantly high single target priority and damage bonus. Furious Swipes is okay, but Wilderness Expert is quite a poor choice. As BM, always go for Jaws of Thunder > ilvl boost.

Realistically, without being rude here, a lot of your problems could be fixed by just reading the guide already on Icy-Veins.

Let me know if you need any extra clarification or advice.

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Yes i pre-pot and then pot later on in the fight. I do read the guide, but there is a lot of what if's which can be confusing. The items without mastery though, like i said Pawn said those were an upgrade according to stat weights. So in essence then the stat weights are wrong, so might be better to just remove it since i dont know how to value weights myself. So for gear choices then just always take highest mastery regardless of the other stats unless the choices for mastery are close? Like if one piece has 1343 mastery and another has say 1313 then go by secondary stats?

 

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Well, maybe not replace the items if they're like a 20 item downgrade, but if they're within 5-10 maybe drop it for more mastery.

Realistically if it's between 50-100 mastery for example, base it on your next prioritised stat. Don't go for something that has versa and mastery over haste and mastery if its that close in mastery.

BM is a lot less based on ilvl than it is mastery and relics from my experience.

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Straight up you have 4 items without mastery on them. They need to be replaced ASAP

This is not 100% accurate...our weights are very close. Unless its rings/neck for the most cases higher the ilevel the better because the AGI increase. Sometimes it might need to be 10+ if there is no haste/mastery on the item at all.  I also have 4 items without mastery and it has very little impact on my dps. Do not get me wrong, HASTE/MASTERY items will be better...but its all about RNG....if the RNG gods keep giving you higher ilevel gear without mastery then wear it if PAWN with the right weights say too. 

I myself have way to much crit...almost at 40%...but meh RNG is RNG. 

All the information you need is already in this websites guide. 

Edited by Banard

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Like I said, within 10 ilvls sure it's better to stick with mastery where possible, but for the most part I find when I traded up about 5 pieces without mastery for the extra ilvls, I got up to 872ish and my dps significantly decreased because I went from about 96% mastery to 75% and only got about an extra 2k agi. 

But realistically hunters are all about the RNG these days. I was just doing some Heroic Guarm prog with a new guild and found myself outdpsing almost everyone in the team when they were 10-15 ilvls higher. But that could also just boil down to being a more experienced and thoughtful raider.

And I myself have about 32% crit and 13% haste, but have found I'm getting a lot more dire beast procs and I'm not running out of focus as much as I was when I tried for higher haste. 

Realistically it's all just down to your ability to execute your rotation as best you can (with the luck of RNGesus).

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1 hour ago, Andanath said:

Like I said, within 10 ilvls sure it's better to stick with mastery where possible, but for the most part I find when I traded up about 5 pieces without mastery for the extra ilvls, I got up to 872ish and my dps significantly decreased because I went from about 96% mastery to 75% and only got about an extra 2k agi. 

I have 75% mastery...and my logs are quite good, i stand by my statement. BM weights are very close and its AGI>Mastery...AGI is very important. 

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10 hours ago, Banard said:

I have 75% mastery...and my logs are quite good, i stand by my statement. 

Never said you were wrong or that I disagreed with anything you said. I just related everything I said to MY personal experiences. 
When I had 75% mastery and higher agi I did worse than I do currently. Maybe I'd just been having some poor RNG.

If you can pull off good logs like that then that's good for you but if you also have other constructive criticism for the OP then go ahead and voice it but I was just giving the advice that worked for me. 

Again, I'll reiterate that it comes down to the player not the character; having had multiple expansions of end game semi-hardcore raiding experience under my belt I've come to find that even playing an unfamiliar character I do better than some of my guild mates without that level of experience, knowledge, and willingness to improve their character on the most minute levels.

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The fight that pulled up from your link your active time was like 14%. Which means you stood there and did nothing or died. 

 

On the first pull where you didn't die in the first 53 seconds of the fight, you can look at the cast screen and see you had some gaps with out KC. I am pretty sure like with all other specs in the game where an ability should be used on CD that missing a whole KC will hurt your dps. At the end where there was hero, there were two big gaps in KC usage. Which if you take the talent killer cobra you should be able to fit like 5 or 6 plus into a window of bestial wrath in the hero. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Yj9GmtzQcBLaDHFK/#type=casts&fight=26&source=27

Overall Cenarius seems like it would be a bad fight for BM imo. As the targets are spread out and tons of travel time for the pets granted they don't experience pathing issues and the respond on time.

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We ran another Heroic Xavius tonight, and on the log on the kill is as follows...

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/nhGgMcLR1tVDZyWX/#type=summary

I pre-pot, flasked, food buffed(mastery food since im pandaren), i think i ran out of runes. I changed the one talent from stampede to killer cobra and that helped from last time. Saw my DPS jump some, but tonights DPS for Xavius was pretty disappointing, 270k i think it was, ranking had me at 25. I was able to change out 1 relic so far so i still have 1 bad relic. Gear choices I try to avoid stuff without mastery but I swear RNGesus has it out for me lol. I havent been able to acquire anything that isnt a massive ilvl downgrade (30 or more points). Someone mentioned using a string for Pawn, I dont know who the author is, where to get it, or how to apply a string to Pawn. I prefer to look up the weights on mrrobot and make my own set of values on it since Pawn doesnt update its weights regularly. Anyways using those weights I make the upgrade choices based on what Pawn says, I also use mrrobot's in-game add-on to find BiB and set up the equipment manager.

On 12/15/2016 at 1:11 PM, Bizkits86 said:

The fight that pulled up from your link your active time was like 14%. Which means you stood there and did nothing or died. 

 

On the first pull where you didn't die in the first 53 seconds of the fight, you can look at the cast screen and see you had some gaps with out KC. I am pretty sure like with all other specs in the game where an ability should be used on CD that missing a whole KC will hurt your dps. At the end where there was hero, there were two big gaps in KC usage. Which if you take the talent killer cobra you should be able to fit like 5 or 6 plus into a window of bestial wrath in the hero. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Yj9GmtzQcBLaDHFK/#type=casts&fight=26&source=27

Overall Cenarius seems like it would be a bad fight for BM imo. As the targets are spread out and tons of travel time for the pets granted they don't experience pathing issues and the respond on time.

14%? you are probably looking at a failed attempt where I died early on, I have never seen myself at less than 95%-ish activity in any fight unless I died early. Only guess for the gaps of KC is where my pet has to run to the mob and wasn't in range.

To start I pre-pot @ 3s > MD > AMoC > BW+KC > DB > Titan's Thunder > CS > KC > CS > KC > CS > KC > CS > KC

During this time whenever DB is up, either from a proc or c/d it gets prioritized over KC and CS. After this opener I keep everything on c/d and dont use CS unless high focus or in BW. When BW is coming off c/d I pool at least 100 focus before hitting it. AMoC, BW, DB, KC, and CS all have /petattack macros attached to them as well. BW macro also has a KC line and AotW line in it as well, set up after the actual BW. I have read the guide on Icyveins multiple times and following that I am doing my rotation correctly, maybe a few missed times due to switching targets or some boss mechanic. On my Skada damage meter I see my burst in that opening phase go really high as people have mentioned. I just dont see any way to improve my DPS aside from RNGesus love.

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Use checkmywow.com to import your logs and analyse your performance. I just did it for myself and realised for the fights I'm parsing 98%+ I still have quite a few areas to improve on. If you're getting 270k dps on Xavius as BM at your ilvl and with such good trinkets, I don't know what else I can tell you other than to check it out yourself. I can analyse the results for you if you want but I'm sure you'd get a lot out of doing it yourself after each raid night.

I get over 350k on that fight and I'm 869 and it's by far one of my least favourite fights with all the add swapping, and I use the same opener and burst rotation. Only difference is I have almost 4k more mastery and a little less crit and about 2k less agi. I do have the Apex Predator ring but that isn't going to equate for an extra 80k dps.

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i'll try it out, im running out of things to try and figure out wtf is going on lol...its looking like its just because i have low mastery, which i know about, and i'm watching for relics on world quests to replace my 1 bad one...:/

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Banard, one of the other hunters commenting earlier, was saying he had quite sustainable and good dps with only 75% mastery, so that may not be the only contributing factor. But my best bet is you'll find a lot of things helpful on checkmywow.com.

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