Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
RyanStanley

Icicles vs. Haste

7 posts in this topic

On my server, we don't do heroic content.  So I thought I'd give ToT a try with my new build.  I am using a soft buffed haste cap of 37.52% which yields the 2 ticks of living bomb so I can stack mastery.  This seems to be much better than my last build, which was going for 50% buffed haste.  I'm at the soft cap for crit too it would appear.  What are you guys doing with the new mastery?

 

 

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/xfqljgw9awly3ge7/

 

I realize these aren't the best logs, as it was new content for me (notice the failure on my part to realize the hunters didn't have the right pet for heroism), but the mastery actually helped me in this regard... most of my damage was from ice lance and living bomb (because i was scared to stand in place too long haha)  

 

What's the best build you guys have found for frost in 5.4?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is very important to track temporary stat gains (trinket procs, meta gem, etc..) so that you can refresh bombs at the proper times.  

Haste affects:

  • Frostbolt
  • Mage Bomb
  • Brain Freeze procs
  • Fingers of Frost procs (a sub benefit from extra Brain Freeze procs)
  • Waterbolt (Pet)

Mastery affects:

  • Frostbolt
  • Frostfire Bolt (from Brain Freeze procs)
  • Waterbolt (Pet)

I would highly recommend Hit (15%) > Haste > Mastery > Crit

If you are going to cap Haste go to at least 48%

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You got me confused. The frost mage guide has the stat priority:

  1. Intellect;
  2. Hit Rating (until 15%);
  3. Haste Rating;
  4. Critical Strike Rating;
  5. Mastery Rating.

Crit before mastery.

Edited by Beer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can you tell me more about bomb refreshing for temp procs?  Currently I refresh only if it's going to expire or will prior to an evocation.  Just need to refresh on any proc?  Jade spirit count?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You got me confused. The frost mage guide has the stat priority:

  • Intellect;
  • Hit Rating (until 15%);
  • Haste Rating;
  • Critical Strike Rating;
  • Mastery Rating.
Crit before mastery.

I finally found someone who plays a Frost Mage exclusively to review the guide. I'll update it tomorrow and the stat priority will be closer to what you suggest.

Can you tell me more about bomb refreshing for temp procs?  Currently I refresh only if it's going to expire or will prior to an evocation.  Just need to refresh on any proc?  Jade spirit count?

Jade Spirit and trinket procs, mostly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is very important to track temporary stat gains (trinket procs, meta gem, etc..) so that you can refresh bombs at the proper times.  

Haste affects:

  • Frostbolt
  • Mage Bomb
  • Brain Freeze procs
  • Fingers of Frost procs (a sub benefit from extra Brain Freeze procs)
  • Waterbolt (Pet)
Mastery affects:
  • Frostbolt
  • Frostfire Bolt (from Brain Freeze procs)
  • Waterbolt (Pet)
I would highly recommend Hit (15%) > Haste > Mastery > Crit

If you are going to cap Haste go to at least 48%

In simC, on patchwerk, the difference between a frost haste build and a frost mastery build is about 5k. So, taking that into account, what you build should probably be more based on what your gear already is correct? If your gear has excessive mastery, you'll probably get more out of a mastery base build then a haste because you'll have less haste available than someone with more haste on their items.

Idea being this, Overall, you have 6k Mastery from items with about 2k from items (unreforged/enchanted/gemmed). Now, just guessing here, but let's say you can take away 1.5k of that mastery and turn it into haste. You then have 4.5k Mastery and 3.5k haste. Now, there is still 1k haste rating difference there that you'll need to make up before your haste will surpass your mastery.

Now, if we take the same percentage away from haste, 500, we have 6.5k mastery and 1.5k haste. 500 haste really doesn't feel like it helps us that much (maybe .1 second off your frostbolt cast? not sure on it's influence)

Saying this though, if you're going for an arcane OS, may as well build mastery since the difference in dps is minimal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • SimC is virtually useless for mages (it's simply not setup correctly for mages) sad.png  We (the mage community) primarily rely on seeing what heroic raiders/benchmark setters are doing and copying them.

Stacking mastery over haste (for Frost) will not be horribly behind but you won't set records doing that either.  Haste improves our mage bomb performance, Mastery does not - and mage bomb is a large % of our damage as frost (for almost every fight).

If you don't have a high amount of Haste gear, then I would not play Frost and instead stick with Arcane.

All of what I have said is for absolutely maximizing dps.  If you aren't in a Heroic progression group then simply play the spec you enjoy most!  These differences are not game breaking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Sappora
      Methodical is in search of dedicated players that are looking to push content in a semi-hardcore environment. All of our raiders try to be on a first-name basis with each other. Our raids are very fun when it comes to farm and carries, however, we do clean up when it's time for progression. When it comes to raiding we do provide benefits, paid for by selling carries. 
      All-in-all we are looking for players willing to: consistently improve their performance, take responsibility, and synergize with a group of players. If this interests you, all of our info is below.
      Information:
      Guild: Methodical
      Creation: 2013
      Server: Bleeding Hollow
      Faction: Horde
      VoIP: Discord
      Raids:
      Raid Progression: 7/7 M EN, 3/3 H ToV, 5/10 H NH
      Raid Dates: Monday, Tuesday, Thursday.
      Raid Times: 9:30P-12:30A EST (Be online by 9:15P)
      Benefits:
      Spirit Cauldrons
      Potion Program
      Extensive Raid Repairs
      Recruitment:
      The below are just current needs, we are accepting all exceptional players.
      druid (balance) high hunter medium mage medium monk (healer) medium priest (dd) high rogue medium shaman (restoration) high warlock high If interested please contact one of the players listed below we can give information about: Bleeding Hollow, Methodical, and our raids. 
      Contact Info:
      Merkshow#1993 (GM)
      Sappora#1724 (Recruitment)
      Franny#1457 (Officer)
      Borlax#1380 (Officer)
    • By Ohta
      The Odyssey [Alliance - Sargeras] is currently recruiting members for our roster update heading into mythic raiding in Nighthold! We are a heroic raiding guild (formed in MoP) that has always had the capacity and intent for mythic raiding, but due to not having 20 consistent raiders, never had the chance to. We currently raid Sunday from 5:00pm CST to 9:30 CST, and Monday from 8:000PM CST to 9:30 PM CST, using the time efficiently to down bosses and clear content. We keep a friendly atmosphere in the guild through an active discord channel and by running other content in WoW (mythic +'s/kharazan(nightbane)/emissaries/etc.). Raids are ran with a positive attitude and the intent of having a pleasant time, while focusing for boss encounters to efficiently clear content in a timely manner (We have always aimed to at least get AOTC for every raid tier). We expect players to come in prepared for raid time in order to make the best use of it; this means logging on 10-15 minutes before raid, having flasks,food,and pots ready, and knowing the fights and your class. We have a core group of 13 raiders that has been raiding together since WoD, and are looking for players for all roles to expand our team for eventual mythic progression in Nighthold. If you are interested please message me with your class/spec/ilvl and raiding experience, and any other questions you may have. We would prefer players with some experience and at least 865ilvl, but any promising and motivated players will be considered!
    • By Slamminshama
      I have three trinkets to choose from, Two from Mythic EN, Heightened Senses @ 880, Vial of Nightmare Fog @ 880, and finally from Nightbane Kara i have the Ethereal Urn @875. If any other experienced resto shamans could weigh in and help me make a decision it would be appreciated. 
    • By maviebris
      So I was fortunate enough to get mantle of command last night, and ran some quick sims. Based on my sims, it would seem that crit has over taken haste in the stat priority when using mantle of command. So stat priority is as follows:
      agi > mast > crit > haste > vers
       
      I haven't calculated weights, but the difference in simulations was significant. I'll leave the weight calculating to others. The idea is that with mantle of command and the changing function of dire beast, it is more advantageous to get more dire beasts from crit, than reducing the CD through haste. Maybe someone else can confirm this also.
    • By jagodziarz
      Hello there: )
       
      Guyz i've got a question, i've been reading on icyveins forum , that in the new rotation/talents we need atleast 17% of haste just to have a proper DPS on it. It's that true?