Armless

Arms Warrior DPS Help.

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Hi Guys, 

first off I will post the requested information. 

My Armory : https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/nordrassil/armless

My current rotation is to keep In For The Kill up as long as possible, Whilst refreshing Rend when it,s under 2 seconds left and trying to collect the green orbs from the trinket to keep the Strength buff up. 

 

Typical Rotation : 

Opener = > Colossus Smash  -> Mortal Strike -> Ravager- > Apply Rend -> Spam slam to fish for Tacticians Procs - >Refresh Colossus Smash.

Then I would look to try to keep rend and colossus smash rolling as much as possible, using Ravager on Cooldown and Battle Cry. (Note I have looked at some Logs and seen that some warriors line up using Battle Cry and Ravager at the same time, Which I have not been doing) 

 

Warcraft Logs :

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/compare/4LDKfm96j7dFqyXz/MPRWTwKZxnDNrHYF#fight=9,12&source=14,Mylvxd&type=summary

 

I am not sure why I am simming at 1.3-1.4M DPS but can barely reach 1M, If anyone is able to give any helpful pointers it would be muchly appreciated. 

NOTE : I do have 4 set t20 but am unsure if it,s worth keeping due to the replacements in my bags.

(In bag replacements are bracketed) 

895 RF Warforged Chest  < = > (930 Crit Versa Non Tier)

900 Normal Cloak             < = > (915 Mastery Haste Non Tier)

915 Heroic Legs                 < = > (930 Mastery Haste Non Tier) 

915 Heroic Gloves -           < = >(945 Mastery Haste Non Tier) 

 

As you can see im losing a lot of Strength due to the loss of ilvl items but am not sure if the 4 set is worth keeping over the ilvl

I

Available Legendaries 

The Great Storm Eye

Rethu Incessant Courage

Najentus Vertabrae

Aggramars Stride

 

If any further information is required to see what I am doing wrong please post and I will reply with any info I can to try and help. 

 

Many Thanks!

 

 

 

 

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18 hours ago, Armless said:

If any further information is required to see what I am doing wrong please post and I will reply with any info I can to try and help. 

Is there any chance you can grab a log from Goroth? I'm not sure if it's due to not knowing tactics, or if it's an actual issue (others will be able to tell), but it seems like you are just doing nothing for a large portion of the fight. It might be that you're being made to soak the wrong things on fights, but just seems like huge gaps in your gameplay. 15-20% downtime on KJ makes sense, but 50%? Something's not right.

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Good morning, Armless.

Before I take a look into your Goroth Logs, I notice your talent choices on each of them is off. In the first log (11/2), you have Sweeping Strikes (which should be Dauntless) and in the second log (11/16) you have Fervor of Battle (which should be Titanic Might). When you go into a raid, be aware of the encounters you'll face and the appropriate talent choices for each encounter. Before you pull a boss it's always a good idea to double check to make sure your talents are squared away along with anything else that may need to be changed.

======================

The first thing I looked at, after reading the thread, is your activity time on both encounters. For Goroth, there is no reason not to have 99.xx% activity time and, on both encounters, you were below this. In short, you're not using abilities when you could be. In the log that I specifically reviewed, you had quite a bit of downtime to where you simply weren't casting anything when you could have been.

For the remaining of this post, I'll be referring to your first log on 11/2: Heroic Goroth

======================

  • I noticed you used Prolonged Power and, while that's great for an AoE / cleave encounter you will want to use Old War for single target fights. The rest of your consumables were on point, though, so good job there.
  • Your casts of Mortal Strike needs to come up. Out of 40 possible casts (including your Tactician procs) you only cast it 26 times. This is a common problem with most Arms Warriors (including myself at times) so just be more aware of your resets and your priority on abilities.
  • During your Execute phase, I noticed 3 times where you cast Mortal Strike at the wrong time. During Execute, you should prioritize Mortal Strike when you have two stacks of Executioner's Precision and your Shattered Defenses buff. Twice you cast it without Shattered Defenses and the last time you didn't have any buff to it at all.

At this point, the two major things I would work on is

  1. Make sure you keep attacking with your abilities when you're able to. In a fight like Goroth there is no excuse for not having 99% uptime and a better cast efficiency for your spells.
  2. Take note of your priority and when you have important abilities ready to use (Mortal Strike). Wasting opportunities, in combination with #1, is going to dramatically drop your overall performance.

I hope this helps get you started in the right direction. If you should have any other questions, don't hesitate to ask.

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Hi, 

Thanks for the replies!

Should I only cast MS when CS debuff is active or if i get a free reset cast it anyway regardless of the state of CS? 

Also I have noticed that on a lot of logs for some reason some warriors with nearly identical stats are hitting a lot harder like for example my avg is 2M when i see others avg around 3 and 4M with Mortal Strikes?

Also with regards to talent choices, I was trying out different talents

(Saw a warrior on world boss doing 1.6M sustained, So thought I would try there talents lol, They were using Whirlwind in place of Slam) 

Which is better as far as "fillers" go, Slam or Whirlwind (I would be inclined to say whirlwind more rage spent = more chance of tacticians proc i guess)?

Also with regards to the items should i stick with 4 set or dump it and use the "upgrades?" 

Should you use Mortal Strike ONLY with CS Debuff on your target? 

Example : Sometimes I find that I run out of rage to cast things and CS Debuff falls off but then i,ll get a random free MS cast become available, Do i wait to refresh CS then use it or use it anyway? I was told to always cast it on cooldown. 

Many Thanks!

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No problem. I'm glad I can help. Let's get to your questions. . .

=============================

1. Should I only cast MS when CS debuff is active or if i get a free reset cast it anyway regardless of the state of CS?

  • If you have the proper talent selected (Titanic MightTitanic Might) then there will be little, if no downtime on the CS debuff anyway. (Titanic Might is the recommended talent regardless of encounter so you should have this selected.)

    1(a): Should you use Mortal Strike ONLY with CS Debuff on your target?

    If, for whatever reason, you do not have Titanic Might, then yes - you would want to prioritize MS during your CS debuff window if you can but you would not want to hold the CD of MS for more than 1 GCD. (If you were to wait for the CS debuff to be applied and MS sat unused for 2 GCDs then that is wrong; you should cast MS even without the debuff and hope it comes around the next time MS is available.)

2. I have noticed . . . some warriors . . . are hitting a lot harder . . . with Mortal Strikes?

  • This is most likely due to the fact that they're buffing MS before they cast it / have the buffs available. I'm specifically talking about having the CS debuff applied and your Shattered DefensesShattered Defenses available as well. This also ties into the execute rotation I explained above by making sure you have two stacks of Executioner's PrecisionExecutioner's Precision in addition to Shattered Defenses. If you're casting unbuffed Mortal Strikes throughout the encounter and during the Execute phase then, yes, your Mortal Strikes will be a lot weaker.

    Outside of the Execute phase, I'm not telling you to hold off MS until SD is available. With procs and proper management you should be able to have a SD buff available 8/10 times without holding off MS for 1 GCD. There will be times, obviously, that you don't have SD available but they should be few and far between.

    With the properly buffed damage in Execute phase as well (which you missed in your logs) the average damage of MS will also be higher.

3. Which is better as far as "fillers" go, Slam or Whirlwind

  • This depends on the legendaries you have equipped and your specific talent setup. With single target and a two-target cleave encounter, Slam is your filler. If you have a build and gear centered around Fervor of Battle then Whirlwind will be your filler.

    If you're looking for the maximum output, however, you will not use Fervor of Battle in place of Titanic Might (at least for this tier / Tomb of Sargeras. It may very well change in Antorus but I doubt it.)

4. Also with regards to the items should i stick with 4 set or dump it and use the "upgrades?"

  • Your 4PC is worth keeping. I doubt you will come across a situation where a piece of gear is so much of an upgrade that it's worth breaking your 4PC set bonus.

5. Sometimes I find that I run out of rage to cast things and CS debuff falls off but then I'll get a random free MS cast become available, Do I wait to refresh CS then use it or use it anyway?

  • If you get a free MS reset (through TacticianTactician) then you will also have CS available to cast. In this instance, pending any other situations, you would first cast CS (which would give you the CS debuff on the target and your SD buff to MS) and then cast MS.

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Wow thanks for all the replies!!! 

I really appreciate the information and the time taken to answer each question individually, I will read them and re-read the answers so i fully understand the advice : )

 

Many thanks ! 

 

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One minor note on something you said.  If you are using the 4-piece tier bonus, it is very important that you ensure that the Shattered Defenses debuff is on your target (either from CS for single target or Warbreaker for multiple target) before you use Battle Cry and Bladestorm/Ravager.  This ensures that the damage from Bladestorm/Ravager is maximized, but, more importantly, it also maximizes the free bonus Mortal Strikes.  This burst rotation will be a HUGE portion of your dps on AOE fights and will still generate plenty of dps on single target fights.  

I actually do not use the Rend rotation at all.  I found Rend very difficult to keep up, so I use Trauma and Slam as my filler for single target encounters.  I also switch from Ravager to Opportunity Strikes.  This means that your Execute phase becomes VITAL and will generate the majority of your dps, but even with Rend taken, once you reach 20% you will drop Rend from your rotation.  The whole point of the Execute phase is to generate as many fully-buffed Mortal Strikes as possible.  That means you need 2 Executes, and CS or Warbreaker, and then a Mortal Strike, in that order.  If after your 2 Executes, CS and Warbreaker are still on cooldown, I will typically do a 3rd Execute to try to proc Tactician and then just do a less buffed Mortal Strike and start over.  

On AOE fights, since you will be taking Sweeping Strikes, you can also push a lot of dps out of cleaving on adds.  Your goal should always be to use Warbreaker/Battle Cry/Ravager first, then a Cleave/Whirlwind, and then I typically try to tab target onto a low health add and sneak in some cleaved Executes before they die.  This is especially viable for Harjatan (the murloc adds), Mistress (both the abyss stalkers and murlocs), Desolate Host (I am typically in Spirit and I get LOTS of cleaved Executes on the Priestesses), and KJ himself on the reflections.  

Other than all that, you need to work hard to always stay in melee range.  Anticipate where the boss will move and learn your tanks' normal positioning.  Try to always stay behind the boss to prevent parry (especially for buffed Mortal Strikes, boss parry can really hurt your dps), and plan your movement around the filler space in your rotations.  Use leap and charge creatively to generate rage (especially when using Whirlwind as the filler as it can be more rage-starved) and keep your uptime high.  Also consider shifting around your keybinds to make sections of the rotation you struggle with easier.  For example, I have CS keybound to 1 and MS keybound to 2, so I am always hitting 1 then 2 and I'm just used to that so I am always taking advantage of the buff.  It may also be worthwhile to create or find some helpful macros.  I have my victory rush macro'd in with my charge so I can hit it mid-combat easily.  I also have an opener macro that combines Battle Cry, my racial bonus, on-use trinkets, Avatar (back when I took it).  So I open with prepot, a charge in, then CS, then my opener macro, then bladestorm or ravager.  I also have a macro to cancel bladestorm that has saved me a few times.  

Let's see, I'm on a roll so I can keep going.  For Harjatan, Mistress, and KJ (heroic only), I open with a prolonged power pre-pot, but hold off on all my cooldowns (even Warbreaker), so I can wait for the adds to spawn and then I bring it all down.  For demonic inquisition and desolate host, the multiple targets are up from the start, so I go all out right away.  For Goroth, save your leap to get behind pillars so you can maintain higher uptime, then charge back in.  If you can be in a pillar and still in melee range, you can keep attacking.  For Sisters and Fallen Avatar, I prefer a single target approach, even though they are occasional multiple targets.  The owl on sisters dies fast and if I cleave onto the Maiden in the Fallen Avatar encounter she dies before the 4th shield, so I just go single target and blow it up on the bottom phase.  

Sims and training dummies just don't do arms justice.  For multiple targets (especially 4 or higher) the burst is crazy and for single target encounters, we get so much from the Execute phase which is not adequately represented in these.  Play smart, good uptime, good decision-making, and you will kick butt!

Here is a link to my guild's logs if you want to check it out: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/guilds/116257

Edited by Slamhammer

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