Narik

Shadow DPS help requested.

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Looking for some feedback to see if I'm doing something wrong. DPS seems low single target for a ~890 geared toon (~600k best on training dummy, ~400k real world). askmrrobot predicts ~650k, so I'm about 10% off...

https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/hyjal/symoril

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Qwcq7GNyWg1YRpxT

Using icy veins raid talent build, icy veins rotation.

"obvious" questions:

1. I use mind flay always if Void Bolt/Mind Blast are on CD, though I interrupt with the "better" spell as soon as the GCD on the Mind Flay is up. This takes more time than just waiting the <= 1 sec for the CD on the better spells, so I feel I might be losing some time there. Should I stop doing this and instead wait for the other items to come available? Under real world conditions, I suspect I'd be moving and doing other stuff too much to micro-manage to this extent anyway...

2. When entering void form, do I re-apply fresh Vampiric Touch and SW: Pain to get increased dmg/haste benefits, or just let void belt auto-refresh the Pre-voidform applications of said spells? Guide was not clear on this point, as "spend phase" says:

Spend/Maintain Phase (in Voidform Icon Voidform)

  1. Apply and maintain Shadow Word: Pain Icon Shadow Word: Pain and Vampiric Touch Icon Vampiric Touch.

Does this mean apply new ones and maintain those? Or continue to maintain existing (through void bolt hits)?

3. (My) log observations.

a. I do notice in the posted log that SWP had 90% uptime, so I must have let it drop at some point (though with all the void bolts I'm not sure when this would have happened). 

b. I have no SW:Death - I imagine this is a big DPS loss (the training dummy never gets under 50% health during this run).

c. My void bolt % seems low, and my mind flay % seems high, as compared to AskMrRobot. I suspect this is because of my approach #1 above?

Thx for feedback.

 

P.S. here's the amr report:

https://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/simulator/report/28be9fa61ecc45d8ab861ab144c093cd

 

P.P.S The log shows two entries for Mind Flay, and I think one is "splash" damage, accounting for 15% of dps. That would mean I'm pulling less than 500k on training dummy vs. 650k predicted.

Edited by Narik
Added AMR report.

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13 hours ago, Narik said:

Looking for some feedback to see if I'm doing something wrong. DPS seems low single target for a ~890 geared toon (~600k best on training dummy, ~400k real world). askmrrobot predicts ~650k, so I'm about 10% off...

First things first, comparing yourself to sims sucks. You can be higher or lower simply because of RNG on your attempt. Simming takes 10,000+ attempts and compiles a huge mass of RNG procs, crits, everything to get a level playing field. You've done 1 test and you may have been lucky on some spell crits, unlucky on others, either way on trinkets and then completely different on another pull. Simming yourself should only really be a vague guide to DPS (instead use for stat weights/gear comparison), you'll very rarely match it and even rarer still, you'll beat it. 

13 hours ago, Narik said:

1. I use mind flay always if Void Bolt/Mind Blast are on CD, though I interrupt with the "better" spell as soon as the GCD on the Mind Flay is up. This takes more time than just waiting the <= 1 sec for the CD on the better spells, so I feel I might be losing some time there. Should I stop doing this and instead wait for the other items to come available? Under real world conditions, I suspect I'd be moving and doing other stuff too much to micro-manage to this extent anyway...

Cast MF. The damage caused by it in that moment will outweight the missed time on the GCD, especially since you'll hit 2-3 ticks normally, meaning you've got the damage from that as well as 6-9 insanity generated. You can also spawn a Tendril from those ticks.

13 hours ago, Narik said:

2. When entering void form, do I re-apply fresh Vampiric Touch and SW: Pain to get increased dmg/haste benefits, or just let void belt auto-refresh the Pre-voidform applications of said spells? Guide was not clear on this point, as "spend phase" says:

Depending on the amount of time the buff has been present, your SW:P will eventually end up being such a short duration that it'll drop due to only last 5-6 seconds. When you find yourself in a moment of filling with Mind Flay, cast your DoTs to keep them up during VF. Never cast them in place of MB/VT/VB - only in place of Mind Flay in the rotation during VF. Only do this if they are about to/have dropped off, obviously.

b. I have no SW:Death - I imagine this is a big DPS loss (the training dummy never gets under 50% health during this run).

No death phase is a huge issue. That's a major part of your DPS.

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On ‎19‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 2:48 PM, Blainie said:
On ‎19‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 12:52 AM, Narik said:

1. I use mind flay always if Void Bolt/Mind Blast are on CD, though I interrupt with the "better" spell as soon as the GCD on the Mind Flay is up. This takes more time than just waiting the <= 1 sec for the CD on the better spells, so I feel I might be losing some time there. Should I stop doing this and instead wait for the other items to come available? Under real world conditions, I suspect I'd be moving and doing other stuff too much to micro-manage to this extent anyway...

Cast MF. The damage caused by it in that moment will outweight the missed time on the GCD, especially since you'll hit 2-3 ticks normally, meaning you've got the damage from that as well as 6-9 insanity generated. You can also spawn a Tendril from those ticks.

I still have a question about this. As you said, you must cast MF in stead of just waiting, but if VB comes out of CD... should I stop channeling and use VB? or maybe have I to complete the channeling and then use VB?

And let me ask another question, this one about our friend the shadowfiend: should I wait more than 25 stacks if it's possible? I mean, should it be casted when VF is about to expire, or is it better to cast it before, in order to ensure it ends before VF fades?

And what about VT? Should I wait for some stacks, or should it be used on CD, regardless of the stacks I have?

For more info, this is my character: https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/sanguino/cyamiin

I'm currently using Icy-veins rotation and talents, and following icy-veins guide.

WARNING: I'm not a native English-speaker, so I'm sorry for the grammar and spelling mistakes.

Edited by cyamiin
Add information relevant to the post.

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On 14/02/2018 at 5:46 PM, cyamiin said:

I still have a question about this. As you said, you must cast MF in stead of just waiting, but if VB comes out of CD... should I stop channeling and use VB? or maybe have I to complete the channeling and then use VB?

Cast VB as soon as you can, don't wait for MF to finish. You only cast MF because it fills a small gap where you would otherwise do nothing. There's no need to finish the cast.

On 14/02/2018 at 5:46 PM, cyamiin said:

And let me ask another question, this one about our friend the shadowfiend: should I wait more than 25 stacks if it's possible? I mean, should it be casted when VF is about to expire, or is it better to cast it before, in order to ensure it ends before VF fades?

So, ideally, you need to cast Shadowfiend (preferably Mindbender) at the latest possible time. The pet doesn't snapshot your Haste level, instead scaling directly with it. If you are using Mindbender, you will normally cast it at around 25-30 stacks, meaning the pet will expire almost exactly when your Void phase finishes. This is only the case with Mindbender because the extra insanity generation lets you stay in Void phase for far longer.

If you are running Shadowfiend, it's entirely dependant on how far you can take your Void phase. I imagine you will need to use it around 10-15 stacks.

On 14/02/2018 at 5:46 PM, cyamiin said:

And what about VT? Should I wait for some stacks, or should it be used on CD, regardless of the stacks I have?

Ideally, you want to use Void Torrent twice in one Void phase. Even if you can't, you should use VT immediately so that, if you can't achieve 2 in 1 phase, you will have it up for your next phase straight away.

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