Jump to content
FORUMS
Stan

Changes to Block in Battle for Azeroth

Recommended Posts

pmiXnAw.jpg

A blue post explaining changes to tank's Block in Battle for Azeroth.

Game Designer Sigma posted a blue post dealing with tank mitigation yesterday and today he's back clarifying how Block will work in Battle for Azeroth.

Blizzard LogoBlizzard (Source)

The value of block now passively increases as you get more and more gear, most notably from shield. Block as a mechanic still scales somewhat linearly throughout the expansion, instead of double dipping with the increased survivability from having higher armor contribution on top of it.

This is the right idea. Since there have been a lot of questions about this--

Block seeming to decrease when you gain armor is mostly an artifact of how we're currently presenting it on the character sheet (which might be worth revisiting). I'll keep using Shield of the RighteousShield of the Righteous as the example since it's a large temporary armor change.

Block now uses similar scaling to armor itself, for the reasons mentioned in my other post (briefly--it's more gear-driven and makes upgrades matter, and allows content to be tuned around higher block values as you proceed further into the game). When you gain a massive amount of armor from Shield of the RighteousShield of the Righteous, you're now at a higher point on the armor DR curve. So adding a fixed amount of armor, which is essentially what block is doing, translates to a lower %.

This is no different from how gaining a buff for X armor would appear to add less mitigation (as a %) if you had Shield of the RighteousShield of the Righteous up--i.e. the way armor as worked for the whole history of WoW. Block just happens to be called out as its own % on the character sheet, so this is more visible. In all cases, gaining more armor will further reduce damage from both blocked and unblocked hits.

We of course could make abilities like Shield of the RighteousShield of the Righteous increase block value as well as armor, so the "block %" stayed similar. But I'm not sure that's what you'd actually want from a gameplay or balance perspective. That's basically saying we'd give block more value during the time when you're already protected by Shield of the RighteousShield of the Righteous. That's the opposite of the usual desire (it would increase damage variance). Letting armor DR work using its natural mechanics, causing an effect like block to have more % value when you have lower armor, seems better.

Summing up, I hope that clarifies a bit more what's going on, and so far I think the biggest outstanding question is whether there's a clearer way to present the block information on the character sheet.

--------

The first direction we're likely exploring for Brewmaster is to make StaggerStagger the mechanic that is driven by Agility, and ultimately make sure it has similar scaling to the armor-based mechanics on the other tanks. This would not necessitate any large player-facing changes to how StaggerStagger works or how you use it.

--------

Also, an upcoming alpha build will have a reduced % on all the effects that translate primary stat to armor. They're too high right now because a recent change reduced armor values across the game and didn't change those abilities to conform. It's just a math fix, when it happens.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting, I didn't even know SotR changed from a total % damage reduction (~50-60%) to only increase armor. This severely hits SotR as a mechanic. Where I'd previously use SotR just when a big baddy is about to finish a large damage magic ability cast (To both "soak" the damage from the ability and auto attacks it does later), this is just no longer the case.

 

I wonder if other tank classes keep their total/magic damage mitigation or if they'll also be slammed similar to Protadins.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Yridaa said:

Interesting, I didn't even know SotR changed from a total % damage reduction (~50-60%) to only increase armor. This severely hits SotR as a mechanic. Where I'd previously use SotR just when a big baddy is about to finish a large damage magic ability cast (To both "soak" the damage from the ability and auto attacks it does later), this is just no longer the case.

 

I wonder if other tank classes keep their total/magic damage mitigation or if they'll also be slammed similar to Protadins.

Well, Ignore Pain was removed from Prot Warriors the other day. Stagger for Monks was nerfed so it's only "partially effective" vs Magic dmg. Whatever that means. Marrowrend for DK's only works against Physical dmg now.

Edit: Don't know about DH's or druids.

Edit2: Seems like Stagger only reduce magic damage taken by 20% now, from the previous 40%

Edited by Weltenfeind
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've read the other post just now (I must have missed it somehow) that was linked in the article. So the plan is to make magic mitigation for tanks a lot lower with the intent of "This ability pierces your active mitigations". This is very similar to how it used to be in Vanilla and TBC (Although in those times, there weren't really any active mitigations other than big CD's).

 

This does mean however that recovery will be even more useful now that it will be harder to mitigate those abilities. Abilities like Death Strike and Frenzied Regeneration will likely be saved (without wasting them) to recover quickly after those hard hits. Of course, this is already the case right now and previously, but some classes might not have these powerful recoveries (Warriors and Monks).

 

We'll probably enter an "expansion era" wherein certain tanks thrive in certain encounters and struggle in others unless these recovery mechanics are also changed to fit the "Healers will just have to heal you up after this happens, regardless of what you do."

 

 

I wouldn't mind it either way, aside from the fact that this would imply there's less for tanks to do. And right now, I already feel I have an easy time compared to DPS roles that have to put in 110% effort to meet the demand for DPS required in progression content (Which right now, is of course non-existent for established guilds)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So does this means Protection Paladin and Protection Warrior will be viable for PvP again? I remember some insane damage output Protection Warriors could deal in WotLK.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Yridaa said:

I've read the other post just now (I must have missed it somehow) that was linked in the article. So the plan is to make magic mitigation for tanks a lot lower with the intent of "This ability pierces your active mitigations". This is very similar to how it used to be in Vanilla and TBC (Although in those times, there weren't really any active mitigations other than big CD's).

I can just tell about Protwarrior, but there has been shieldblock as active mitigation. I remember i had to tank Illidan due to 100% block of his hit. It could be there hasn't been any mitigation on other tanks.

1 hour ago, Yridaa said:

This does mean however that recovery will be even more useful now that it will be harder to mitigate those abilities. Abilities like Death Strike and Frenzied Regeneration will likely be saved (without wasting them) to recover quickly after those hard hits. Of course, this is already the case right now and previously, but some classes might not have these powerful recoveries (Warriors and Monks).

We'll probably enter an "expansion era" wherein certain tanks thrive in certain encounters and struggle in others unless these recovery mechanics are also changed to fit the "Healers will just have to heal you up after this happens, regardless of what you do."

As soon as Blizzard decreases the mitigation, selfhealing gets stronger. I think this is trivial. If you mitigate all dmg, then selfhealing is a nonsense. Other way around - if you mitigate just a small amount, selfhealing is rather strong. This is a bit a misery, all "selfhealing"-tank have to mitigate less then mitigation-tanks. This can lead to a problem on hard-hitter bosses. As long as tanks have different tools to stay alive, there will always be bosses where some tanks are struggeling. Is this a problem? I say yes and also no. It depends on difficulty (normal, heroic, mythic) we're talking about.

2 hours ago, Yridaa said:

I wouldn't mind it either way, aside from the fact that this would imply there's less for tanks to do. And right now, I already feel I have an easy time compared to DPS roles that have to put in 110% effort to meet the demand for DPS required in progression content (Which right now, is of course non-existent for established guilds)

Yes please, give us tanks something relevant to do. But this should more encounter-based than skill-based. Ok, give me a button to press against magic dmg and another against physical...i think this does not change much. But i absolutely agree: atm, DPS is the most difficult part. As long as they dont bring back aggro-management and keep us DPS-racing, this won't change (my opinion).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Allseye said:

Yes please, give us tanks something relevant to do.

See...  I just dont get this.

Other than fights like Varimathras, I generally felt like I had something to do.  

If you're bored on Coven you're doing it wrong. 

Even old EN you're dragging Ursoc around the room, keeping him far enough away from the shit that your group doesn't die but not so far that the room fills up... And he was a generally 'boring' fight.

There are countless other examples but I dont feel the need to point out that we're doing something in the fight.  We're keeping people alive in our own way.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, PatrickHenry said:

See...  I just dont get this.

Other than fights like Varimathras, I generally felt like I had something to do.  

If you're bored on Coven you're doing it wrong. 

Even old EN you're dragging Ursoc around the room, keeping him far enough away from the shit that your group doesn't die but not so far that the room fills up... And he was a generally 'boring' fight.

There are countless other examples but I dont feel the need to point out that we're doing something in the fight.  We're keeping people alive in our own way.  

 

Of course we do. And in mythic there is often more to do as tank. Due to my lack of time, i rarely raid mythic...so it could be my problem i think tanking isnt challenging anymore.

Evtl. is it just me, but i liked tanking much more as i had to play mechanics AND do as much aggro as possible. Tooday it is: taunt, move and press a CD...and do as much as possible dmg. If i want do deal dmg, i play a dd and not a tank. Its just...meh. If you dont get this, its fine. Its not a general statement, its just my feelings about :-) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Stan
      The latest Mage class changes from Shadowlands Beta revolve around Venthyr Covenant Ability and Legendary Power tuning.
      Mage
      Mirrors of Torment has been updated to grant you Brain Freeze, Fire Blast cooldown reduction, or Mana when a mirror is consumed, based on your current specialization. It can now proc from auto-attacks, but can only occur once every 6 seconds.
      Mirrors of Torment (Venthyr Covenant Ability) Arcane: Conjures 3 mirrors to torment the enemy for 20 25 seconds. Whenever the target attacks, casts a spell or ability, a mirror is consumed to inflict (75% 60% of Spell Power) Shadow damage and their movement and cast speed are slowed by 15%. The final mirror will instead inflict (198% 151% of Spell Power) Shadow damage to the enemy, Rooting and Silencing them for 4 seconds. Whenever a mirror is consumed, you gain 4% mana. Fire: Arcane: Conjures 3 mirrors to torment the enemy for 20 25 seconds. Whenever the target attacks, casts a spell or ability, a mirror is consumed to inflict (75% 60% of Spell Power) Shadow damage and their movement and cast speed are slowed by 15%. The final mirror will instead inflict (198% 151% of Spell Power) Shadow damage to the enemy, Rooting and Silencing them for 4 seconds. Whenever a mirror is consumed your Fire Blast cooldown is reduced by 4 seconds. Frost: Arcane: Conjures 3 mirrors to torment the enemy for 20 25 seconds. Whenever the target attacks, casts a spell or ability, a mirror is consumed to inflict (75% 60% of Spell Power) Shadow damage and their movement and cast speed are slowed by 15%. The final mirror will instead inflict (198% 151% of Spell Power) Shadow damage to the enemy, Rooting and Silencing them for 4 seconds. Whenever a mirror is consumed you gain Brain Freeze. Fire
      Fevered Incantation (Legendary Power) - Each consecutive Critical Strike you deal increases Critical Strike damage you deal by 2% up to 10%.
    • By Starym
      He's at it again... This time around it's a ridiculous amount of healing, but only outside of Kul Tiras and Zandalar, and only for Alliance players. The main ingredient for this particular crazy stunt is the Gently Squeezed Toad, which you can summon every few seconds, then attack for over a million damage due to the damage aura that makes you deal more damage to low level mobs. And that's it, you just need some amount of leech to get crazy healing very often, with 500K individual heals and around 50-60K HPS with about 30% leech in Rextroy's specific example! The only problem is, this only works for Alliance, as the toy is only sold by Old Loola in the WoD Ally garrison and is BoP, so Horde need not apply.

      Check out the full video for the details, especially focusing on the World PvP uses:
      Here are more details on the technique, including a useful macro!
    • By Stan
      Redditor EternalDawnbt has recreated the Tomb of Sargeras in Minecraft.
      The author also released the map for download on Planet Minecraft, so you can explore it in single-player mode!
      Source: Reddit
    • By Stan
      Reddit user Granny_knows_best spotted that using Rime of the Time-Lost Mariner gives you a hat in Flight Form. Another Redditor found out it also works in flapping Moonkin Form.
      Rime of the Time-Lost Mariner is a toy that has a chance to drop from Dread Ship Vazuvius on Timeless Isle. When used, you get transformed into a skeleton, but Druids will receive a hat in Flight Form.

      Druid in Flight Form receives a hat from Rime of the Time-Lost Mariner.
      Furthermore, Redditor DonSerrot confirmed this also works with Legion's Archdruid's Lunarwing Form and flapping Moonkin Form.


      Source: Reddit
    • By Stan
      It's time to look at the Hunter class changes and all their Covenant Abilities underwent some changes in the latest Shadowlands Beta build. Blizzard also reduced the Focus cost of Cobra Shot.
      Hunter
      Resonating Arrow radius increased. When a mob leaves the area, you can ignore LoS towards them for 4 more seconds. Flayed Shot's bonus Kill Shot no longer costs Focus. The design of Wild Spirits has been simplified, and there's no longer a difference in behavior when using single target versus area damage with this ability. Blizzard has also reduced the Focus cost of Cobra Shot.
      Death Chakram (Necrolord Covenant Ability) has been fixed to no longer chain the targets under crowd control effects that break upon taking damage. Flayed Shot (Venthyr Covenant Ability) - Fire a shot at your enemy, causing them to bleed for (250% of Attack power) Shadow damage over 20 seconds. Each time Flayed Shot deals damage, you have a 15% chance to gain Flayer's Mark, causing your next Kill Shot to be free and usable on any target, regardless of their current health. Resonating Arrow (Kyrian Covenant Ability) - Fire a resonating arrow to the target location that fills deals (20% of Attack Power) Arcane damage to any enemy in the area, and fill the area with echoing anima for 10 seconds. The effect causes your attacks to ignore line of sight to enemies in the area, and you have 30% increased critical strike chance against them. Leaving the area of echoing anima will still allow the hunter to ignore line of sight towards the enemy for 4 seconds. Wild Spirits (Night Fae Covenant Ability) - Evoke the energy of Wild Spirits at the target location, applying Wild dealing (25% of Attack Power) Nature damage and apply Hunter's Mark to all enemy targets within the area for 15 seconds, increasing the damage you deal to them by 5%. While the Wild Spirits are active, each damaging ability you use against a target affected by the Wild Mark strikes the target or your pet use against a target in the area will strike up to 5 nearby targets for (45% of Attack Power) Nature damage. Beast Mastery
      Cobra Shot now costs 35 Focus (was 45).
×
×
  • Create New...