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More Fury Warrior, Marksmanship Hunter Changes

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The class feedback dev replies return as we get an even clearer view of the future for Fury Warriors in BfA. Another huge piece of the puzzle has arrived after last week's major changes, this time focusing on the level 45+ talents with detailed info on some new ones and many changes to old ones.

We also got a much shorter look at plans for Marksmanship Hunters, with Lone Wolf, Aimed Shot, Rapid Fire and Sniper Training getting some attention.

Blizzard LogoFury (source)

We’ve been iterating on Fury Warrior since last week, and the next Beta build will again be a slightly out-of-date version of Fury compared to we have internally at this moment.

To give an update: everything on the baseline spec described last week hasn’t changed. However, many talents have been adjusted, moved, or replaced to better fit together with the updates to the Fury spec.

Level 15, 30, 60 rows: No changes since last week/last Beta build.

Level 45 row: Inner Rage, Sudden Death, Furious Slash – this row speed up/adds to the rotation

Inner RageInner Rage is now -1 sec off the base cooldown of Raging BlowRaging Blow (which is now 8 sec base cooldown) and increases its damage. Simple and direct, and does the job of slightly speeding up/adding to the rotation.

Sudden DeathSudden Death is the same talent many know, adjusted for Fury – “Your attacks have a chance to reset the cooldown of ExecuteExecute and make it usable on any target, regardless of their health.” It replaces Wrecking BallWrecking Ball in the talent tree, and fills the role of “occasionally inserts an ability into your rotation” better than Wrecking BallWrecking Ball does, because WhirlwindWhirlwind is now already used often as part of your single-target rotation. Additionally, now that ExecuteExecute generates 20 Rage for Fury, this proc will also serve to slightly speed up the rotation, which is desirable on this talent row.

Furious SlashFurious Slash is the Furious Slash attack (from live) combined with FrenzyFrenzy (the talent from live), as described last week, granting Haste per stack, stacking up to 3. It serves as the higher-complexity talent that add a brand new button to your rotation. The Haste granted has been reduced to a more appropriate level (2% per stack, pending playtesting/feedback/tuning) considering the spec now has 25% Haste baseline from EnrageEnrage, and with another talent (Frothing BerserkerFrothing Berserker) also providing 10% Haste occasionally.

Level 75 row: Carnage, Massacre, Frothing Berserker

MassacreMassacre has been redesigned into “ExecuteExecute is now usable on targets below 35% health”. Now that ExecuteExecute has a cooldown and generates Rage, the live Legion version doesn’t make much sense anymore – it would've just amounted to a Rage proc on ExecuteExecute. Additionally, ExecuteExecute adds a significant amount to the rotation already when it's available – any redesign that made that ExecuteExecute window even more impacted by adding more resources or buttons to press didn’t seem to overall improve the ExecuteExecute rotation. Instead, widening the window during which you can use ExecuteExecute, made more sense.

On ExecuteExecute’s cooldown, which is currently 6 sec (reduced by Haste, ending up at ~4.2 sec with EnrageEnrage up): Currently, there are no lack of buttons to press during ExecuteExecute windows, with ExecuteExecute being available on every 4th ability use (at a high priority), and pushing some other buttons out to make room for itself. We think ExecuteExecute being any lower cooldown makes the Fury rotation more cramped during ExecuteExecute, and not any better overall.

CarnageCarnage and Frothing BerserkerFrothing Berserker are unchanged since last week.

Level 90 row: Meat Cleaver, Dragon Roar, Bladestorm – this row is primarily AOE

WhirlwindWhirlwind still has its baseline mechanic of making your next 2 attacks strike up to 4 additional targets for 40% damage (this mechanic/buff is called Meat CleaverMeat Cleaver on live). That proc/buff has been renamed to simply “Whirlwind” because if anyone referred to Meat Cleaver when talking about Fury, it wasn’t possible to find those words anywhere in the spellbook, which made it harder to learn about the mechanic. Meat Cleaver, the new talent, uses that name, and gives WhirlwindWhirlwind a 10% chance to EnrageEnrage you and causes it to generate an additional 1 Rage per target hit (up to 3 additional Rage), pending tuning.

Dragon RoarDragon Roar’s cooldown has been increased to 40 sec (up from 25 sec), radius has been increased to 12 yds (up from 8 yds), damage increased significantly, and it now generates 10 Rage. The goal is to put it much closer to Odyn's FuryOdyn's Fury in usage and damage impact (high cooldown, more one-hit damage). Generating a respectable amount of Rage allows it to be used during RecklessnessRecklessness without you feeling like you’re missing out on its potential Rage generation increase.

BladestormBladestorm’s duration has been reduced to 3 sec (down from 6 sec), cooldown reduced to 1 min (down from 1.5 min), and now generates 20 Rage over the duration. Shortening the duration allows BladestormBladestorm to fit into an EnrageEnrage window (without requiring extreme amounts of Haste) if used right after after gaining EnrageEnrage, and a shorter duration/cooldown BladestormBladestorm feels more like Fury anyways.

Level 100 row: Reckless Abandon, Anger Management, Siegebreaker – this row modifies or adds damage bonuses

Reckless AbandonReckless Abandon is a fine talent, no changes.

Anger ManagementAnger Management has been added to Fury, reducing the cooldown of Recklessness by 1 sec for every 25 Rage you spend. RecklessnessRecklessness is cool, so why not have it more often?

When looking at the third talent slot on this row, we tried various version of BloodbathBloodbath or AvatarAvatar at different cooldowns, or with different mechanics, or with up-front damage, and even a version where the talent literally just cast both AvatarAvatar and RecklessnessRecklessness for 15 sec with a 1.5-2 min CD. In the end we concluded:

  • Any version that was a separate self-buff damage cooldown button didn’t feel great to press consecutively with RecklessnessRecklessness, because you’re pressing two straight abilities which both feel more like self-buffs than attacks
  • Any version that made RecklessnessRecklessness stronger (high damage/amplitude) or replaced RecklessnessRecklessness with an ability with a 1.5 min cooldown, felt too similar to Reckless AbandonReckless Abandon
  • Any version that made RecklessnessRecklessness shorter cooldown was Anger ManagementAnger Management
  • Any version that made RecklessnessRecklessness a longer cooldown or replaced it with a new spell with a longer cooldown, didn’t feel great because you were taking a talent that made RecklessnessRecklessness available less often

In the end, we’re going to try a cooldown attack that debuffs the target, increasing your damage done to them for a duration. This synergizes with RecklessnessRecklessness in a way that feels better – RecklessnessRecklessness first to buff yourself, then a heavy attack against the enemy. The intended gameplay is: Build up Rage -> Siegebreaker -> RampageRampage -> Rebuild Rage -> RampageRampage before Siegebreaker ends. Correct tuning on the duration will allow 2 RampageRampages to be doable during one Siegebreaker, but not trivial to do mindlessly. During RecklessnessRecklessness you should be able to get off three RampageRampages in the Siegebreaker window.

Siegebreaker (30 sec cooldown, Generates 15 Rage): Break the enemy’s defenses, dealing [120% AP] Physical damage, and increasing your damage done to the target by 20% for 10 sec.


  • OutburstOutburst, BloodbathBloodbath, and AvatarAvatar have been removed from Fury.
  • Auto attack damage, as a portion of your overall damage, has been reduced. This came from increasing the damage of most abilities on the spec. Our target for auto attack damage on Fury is currently much closer to 25% of your overall damage than 50%.

Thanks for the continued feedback here and everywhere else.


Blizzard LogoMarsmanship (source)

Hey everyone,

I wanted to post a few things about Marksmanship, including a few things in the works.

Lone WolfLone Wolf's damage at 10% may not be the final number. I changed it from 18% to 10% a while back so it being at 18% and such a big DPS swing between pet and no pet would stop dominating the conversation about Lone WolfLone Wolf. Tuning will happen.

Aimed ShotAimed Shot's charge recovery time will be reduced by haste in a future build.

Rapid FireRapid Fire's visual effects are not final.
Rapid FireRapid Fire will bounce to 1 additional target when Trick Shots is active in a future build.

Mastery: Sniper TrainingMastery: Sniper Training will be changed to affect all of your shots instead of only Focus spending shots in a future build so things like Rapid FireRapid Fire are not left behind as gear progresses.

RNG - there's a lot of talents with randomness in them. We hear the feedback that you feel things are too random. Some things will probably change to be less random in general, others will have some adjustments made to how they proc to prevent the really bad luck streaks from being a thing.

As always, thanks for the feedback both in this thread and others created.

And here are some more beta feedback posts by the devs:

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12 hours ago, Starym said:

Our target for auto attack damage on Fury is currently much closer to 25% of your overall damage than 50%.

holy cow 50% white damage

Edited by PatrickHenry

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18 hours ago, Yridaa said:

WTB> level 110 and level 120 row.

Blizz is confused with the existing rows as is don't make it harder for them 🙂


Edited by Ohmybadness

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On 5/31/2018 at 1:23 PM, Yridaa said:

WTB> level 110 and level 120 row.

I hear that. I really don't see why they didn't bump the lvl100 row up to 105 and add a new tier row at 120 which basically mimicked abilities from our artifact weapons. was it really that hard to do?

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