Gnar

H Paragons

Sign in to follow this  

15 posts in this topic

Got H Siegecrafter down last night with me on the belt! Great fight, did both spots and loved it.  Now, naturally, we are working on paragons and I have a very simple question.  I'm rolling Destro and multidotting Immolate when my 4pc procs.  The ember regen is nuts, especially when I use havoc, but would it be more efficient to target each between CD's of havoc or FnB if they are stacked in its range since damage is irrelevant?

 

I'm obviously capable of trying both out, but if anyone who has killed it week after week has known data between doing this, let me know.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't FnB to apply immolate, just stick with manually applying it and keeping the 4pc buffed the whole time.

 

If you struggle with mechanics you can even cut it down to just multi dotting one off target to help focus on the fight more.

 

Also don't forget to keep Rain of Fire down.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I found the regen to not be needed, the impact on eDPS was small enough that it wasn't worth it to me. Now that people are doing progression on it in 10-20ilvl more then I had, I can't see the DPS gain to be needed in any form.

 

If you want to min/max it, go for it. But make sure you're not sacrificing mechanics to it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The ONLY time I have F&B is when we are on the second Paragon and he has more than 3 parasites around him giving 5+ targets... and even then I'm not convinced it was worth it.  Your Immolate on Kill target will do less DMG due to the F&B modifier and you will require 10 crits to make up the ember you spent on it before you are in the positive.

 

Havoc with 4p for sure.

 

Also, IMO avoid the Glyph Havoc "I need 2 CB on Rik'kal to bait slimes off Skeer" opener.  Its not required and I found better results using the first havoc to get the embers for an extra CB during procs on Kill target.  

 

My personal opener on this fight is:   Focus Rik'kal for Havoc Macro

RoF before they become active, pop CD's and Immo the first one that flies down(Rik'kal), double conflag him (that's the bait dmg for slimes), Immo Hisek, Immo Skeer, Havoc + 1 incin, then chain my CB's till out of embers, use last two havoc charges, drop another RoF on Hisek/Rik'kal/Slimes/Parasites cluster in mid, then CB's again.

 

Interested in hearing how others open, even if they go against my suggestion to not glyph.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interested in hearing how others open, even if they go against my suggestion to not glyph.

 

Basically do the same thing to bait Rik'kal, but with a mouseover and boss frames.  RoF>Havoc,DS>Conflag*2>Immolate>CoE>Rotation

 

So, seems like the FnB is a no go so won't waste pulls trying it.

 

Havoc is an obvious yes with 4pc which was a given.  I also wouldn't consider using the glyph here since there is no reason as its generally used for burst nuke with SB spam or burst ember regen which is not what I need.

 

And multidotting isn't required especially if I have to sacrifice mechanics (which I never do on progression).

 

Thanks for the input, I will take it to raid next week trying to Immolate different amounts of targets each time.

Edited by Gnar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It´s nice to see so much variations  for such a small time frame, will try something of your approaches next id, especially the preRoF of Soulzar looks interesting.
My variation so far looks like this: Pop CDs, Immolate(it´s baked into one of my CD macros) Rikkal, double conflagrate and 1 incinerate, Havoc Skeer and 3 incinerates on Rikkal(so that I´m below 3 Stacks of Backdraft). Now targeting Skeer, CB, Immolate, CB, Doomguard. While walking with Skeer,  RoF on Rikkal and Hisek in the middle and so on. Normal destro proc-reactive playstyle.

 

Maybe I will hold back the Doomguard for using it on Xaril, the higher iLvl  will definitely put my guilds fight length under 10 minutes, making it impossible to use it 2 times.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Maybe I will hold back the Doomguard for using it on Xaril, the higher iLvl  will definitely put my guilds fight length under 10 minutes, making it impossible to use it 2 times.

 

I personally use my DG and second pot on Kaz'tik, as I feel it has the highest potential to wipe our raid.  (mesmerize is hard)

 

Due to hero, Skeer dies so fast I don't bother with it there.  Due to Ilvls we'd probably be best saving Hero for Xaril/Kaz'tik now as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Due to hero, Skeer dies so fast I don't bother with it there.  Due to Ilvls we'd probably be best saving Hero for Xaril/Kaz'tik now as well.

You want to delay Bloodlust/Heroism/Timewarp for Xaril or Kaz'tik.  Using it on Skeer is overkill.  If you can't kill Skeer without Bloodlust, you're going to run into some DPS issues with other mechanics that will complicate the fight further.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if you're attacking the parasites at all, even with RoF, you're making it more difficult on your raid and should feel guilty EVERY single time someone gets killed by feed, especially if it results in a wipe.  That wipe was your fault.

 

Focus on the mechanics on paragons, it's just a mechanics fight, anything to try and cheese higher dps will result in wipes, your guild not killing it, and you not getting a chance to get loot because of it.

 

Use shadowfury regularly on parasites, and howl of terror every time it's off cd if you want to actually help your raid win.  Carry on and don't do that if you just want to win the damage meters.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if you're attacking the parasites at all, even with RoF, you're making it more difficult on your raid and should feel guilty EVERY single time someone gets killed by feed, especially if it results in a wipe.  That wipe was your fault.

 

 

The parasites heal up to 100% every 10 seconds imo, so a RoF shouldn´t be a problem, especially if it helps you to generate more Ember faster. It is just the same principle for which you use Havoc most of the time. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if you're attacking the parasites at all, even with RoF, you're making it more difficult on your raid and should feel guilty EVERY single time someone gets killed by feed, especially if it results in a wipe.  That wipe was your fault.

 

Focus on the mechanics on paragons, it's just a mechanics fight, anything to try and cheese higher dps will result in wipes, your guild not killing it, and you not getting a chance to get loot because of it.

 

Use shadowfury regularly on parasites, and howl of terror every time it's off cd if you want to actually help your raid win.  Carry on and don't do that if you just want to win the damage meters.

 

 

 

RoF on the adds isn't just about padding, the amount of pad you would get from it is VERY little. The true value comes from the ember bit gain from having RoF on them, esp with high haste or crit RoF snap shotting.

 

Same idea with havoc, I use it on CD for paragons for the embers. Six well timed Incinerates = a lot of freaking embers. 

 

 

RoF has nothing to do with people getting killed by feed, and feed alone should NEVER kill someone. If it does, then healers need to be smacked. Feed + something kills people, 99% of the time the "something" is what killed them. Last week I had a bug on me and stood in the Aim line to soak (my job is to soak the aim line) it killed me. Why? Because one of our other raiders didn't stand in the line with me, the Aim alone would not have killed me. The bug alone would not have killed me. Both killed me. Fault? the other raider that didn't stand in the aim line. Nothing I could have done to stop that from happening, nothing I did caused it.

 

I almost never pad for the sake of padding, ranks meaning nothing to me since I know they mean nothing. But there is a difference between not padding and ignore eDPS gains. RoF on the bugs or even RoF on the bosses on paragons if they are stacked isn't padding, it's using fight mechanics to boost eDPS. eDPS is all that matters to me. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ranks are fun and all, but killing things is what matters with me. For 10m on my high pop PVE server, I'm top 30 for overall DPS and 1st for most fights for locks. Doesn't mean I don't put my ass on the belt for the sake of the team and get in the nice 2%ile for that fight.  Most people who play at the Heroic level know how to get the most out of their abilities.  Havoc, RoF, and criting Immolate on multiple targets will always end in more Chaos Bolts.  If you do it correctly you don't lose anything single target on this fight because of it.

 

Now, just because I know how to use it doesn't mean I don't have a little fun with it.  Mouseover Havoc on an add sub 20% on Nazgrim never hurt anyone, accept that dirty arcane mage on my server.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Now, just because I know how to use it doesn't mean I don't have a little fun with it.  Mouseover Havoc on an add sub 20% on Nazgrim never hurt anyone, accept that dirty arcane mage on my server.

Just don't make the same mistake some Warlock in my guild did where he soul swapped his fully buffed DoT's to everything on Paragons, and proceeded to kill all the parasites and eventually get mutated and have nothing to eat...

 

That warlock was not me. Nope.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I could imagine your.. ehm...i mean that warlocks dps graph looked really funny, first stellar and then *beeep*, nothing^^

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if you're attacking the parasites at all, even with RoF, you're making it more difficult on your raid and should feel guilty EVERY single time someone gets killed by feed, especially if it results in a wipe.  That wipe was your fault.

 

Focus on the mechanics on paragons, it's just a mechanics fight, anything to try and cheese higher dps will result in wipes, your guild not killing it, and you not getting a chance to get loot because of it.

 

Use shadowfury regularly on parasites, and howl of terror every time it's off cd if you want to actually help your raid win.  Carry on and don't do that if you just want to win the damage meters.

 

I understand your angle, DPS on the Parasites can break the CC that is keeping them off players.... but your logic above would also say that all ranged should take off their Legendaries, so that the capes don't AoE DMG the adds .. which can break CC and lead to a wipe if X, Y, Z, and -Z all line up.

 

Players who are scorpioned should be focused on picking off the parasites that are in somebodies face.  The only CC I ever do on them is a Howl for anything near me after my PBoI procs drops.  If I see somebody looking like they are in trouble, they get a shadow fury.  Outside of that they are completely ignored for the 2 minutes they are part of the fight.  I rarely waste time on Single target fears.

 

If I get dick punched by RNG and turned into a scorpion, i'll eat the closest one so that I can eat a second before leaving, and I always look to take one that bugging a healer, since DPS just ignore them and PEW PEW to get the boss that brings this mechanic to the fight, out of it.

Edited by Soulzar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Babblet
      Location: Horde, US Connected Realms: Aegwynn, Bonechewer, Daggerspine, Gurubashi, Hakkar. 
      Raiding Times: Mon/Tue 8:00 PM EST - 12:00 PM EST
       
      About us:
      We are former nolife raiders who now enjoy spending time outside our basements in the real world. Our total play time has decreased slightly but we still strive to meaningfully progress our characters through end game raiding. Currently we are recruiting new members to help us progress in the upcoming expansion. Join us and lets slay Dragons together!
      Apply if you are:
      interested in end game content; M+ Dungeons and Heroic/Mythic Raiding capable of critical thought and willing to contribute when discussing strategy a self-starter who plays to improve and keeps up to date with latest theorycraft always on time and reliable  
      Recruitment Status: currently recruiting Ranged DPS.
       
      Contacts/Battle Tags:
      Shig#1825 (Guild Master)
      Silvadine#1273 (Officer)
      Discord:
      Shig#8835
      Silvadine#1277
    • By Narii625
      SERVER: Illidan
      RAID TIMES: Fridays & Sundays 10pm - 1am Server Time.
      LEGION PROGRESSION: 2/11M at the end, started Mythic on every other raid tier.
       
      CURRENTLY RECRUITING
      Tank ABOUT US
      Now recruiting for BfA!
      Currently looking for a skilled and laid back Tank for the upcoming expansion.
      We're semi-casual in terms of the time we spend raiding, but are serious about progression, attendance, and performance.
      Booty Pirates is a close-knit late night guild that hangs out in Discord frequently. We enjoy joking around, playing alts, doing Mythic+, playing other games, or just hanging out. 
      Fun guild events are scheduled often!
      Overall, we're very social with guild members that actually talk to each other.
      (18+ required, we talk like pirates!)
      GOALS FOR BfA
      In Battle for Azeroth we plan to push Mythic more than we did previously in Legion, and not spend nearly as much time on Heroic. 
      This means we will jump into Mythic/Heroic weekends as soon as the majority of the Heroic gear is done. (Mythic Friday and Heroic Sunday, for example, until we phase Heroic out completely.) 
      SCHEDULE UNTIL FIRST TIER*
      Below are our events the beginning weeks of BfA! All events start at 10pm CT.
      Week 1
      August 13th (Mon) - BfA Weekday Leveling Party! August 17th (Fri) - Leveling up in BfA Drinking Party August 19th (Sun) - Leveling up in BfA Non-Drinking Party Week 2
      August 24th & 26th (Fri/Sun) - Mandatory Mythic 0 to prep for Tier 1 *Schedule subject to changes.
      JOINING THE BOOTY PIRATES CREW
      Make sure to add me on Battle.net and/or fill out our app to join us. We look forward to speaking with you!
      Start the app here! 
      Battle.net ID: LadyPluu#1299
    • By Spaceghoul
      <Maniacal Degree> is looking to boost its raid forces (Mythic and Heroic) for the upcoming expansion. We are looking for talented players that can contribute to the success of raid teams of multiple skill levels - particularly those interested in Horde Mythic progression.
      Mythic progression raid team: Tue/Wed/Thurs 6:30-9:00 PM server (Pacific Standard Time)
      Heroic progression raid team: Sun/Mon 6:30-9:00 PM server (Pacific Standard Time)
      MD is a mature, inclusive Horde guild on the Proudmoore-US server, with both social and raiding components to meet all your guild needs! We are always looking for active adult players that want to enjoy a community guild based on the ideal of all-inclusiveness. No matter where you come from and what your opinions are, we hope you find a safe place in game through Maniacal Degree. We have a few rules that we ask guild members follow in order to succeed in the community environment, but other than that, we want you to come in, have fun, and act maniacal!
      We are always looking for skilled players that want to get into raiding at a competent level. Our leadership has set expectations to clear mythic-level content for our more hardcore players as Battle for Azeroth releases, while also cultivating raid teams in a more relaxed environment. 
      What we are looking for specifically in a raid member that is interested in progression:
      •    Players who have raided at a competitive level in current and previous expansions;
      •    Players that are new to raiding but are willing to work hard inside and outside of raid times to “catch up”;
      •    Players with experience should have logs to prove that they have raided previously and can perform in their roles well;
      •    People who would like to get back into raiding, but may not have relevant Legion experience to get into a current raiding guild;
      •    Players that know how to optimize their characters for raiding (stats, upgrades, raid roles, encounter research, consumables, etc.);
      •    Players that can perform multiple roles within the specializations of their character, as needed by raid demands and leadership requests;
      •    Players that are self-starters and can take an active approach in helping raid and guild leadership as needed.
      What we are looking for specifically in a guild member:
      •    Players who are active outside of raid times;
      •    Players who engage with raiding and non-raiding guildmates alike;
      •    Players who understand that Proudmoore-US is the game’s most diverse and inclusive server. The LGBTQ+ community is very active and established here, and guild members must respect and embrace the reputation and environment we cultivate both on the server and within the guild.
      Send me a message (Spaceghoul on Proudmoore-US, IsaacTx#1736) if you are interested in talking about joining our guild and/or our raid teams! Come browse our Discord as well: https://discord.gg/Eps7b2g
    • By Sephyra
      Guild Information:
      Guild name: Training Grounds
      Faction: Horde
      Realm: Draenor (EU)
      Realm Type: Normal - PVE
      Current progress: -
      Raid days: Daily
      Raid times: 20.30-23.00 CET
      Website: http://training-grounds.eu/
      (Full application details on website)

      Recruiting for BFA Raiding:

      Currently all specs are considered for the arrival of BFA!

      About us:

      Training Ground is a 30-man laid back heroic oriented raiding guild that consists of experienced raiders with some of them having raiding experience as far back as Vanilla.

      We are a friendly group who enjoys World of Warcraft and loves raiding. We have fun and joke around but when bosses need to go down then all is serious! We wish for all our members to enjoy the game as much as we do and we expect raiders to maintain a 90% attendance per month.

      We also enjoy a variety of other activities such as running a lot of Mythic+ dungeons doing alt-runs, achievement runs etc.

      There are a few things we hold in high value but above else we value friendliness and politeness towards guildies and other players and skillfulness when it comes to the more serious parts of the game.

      Currently :

      Raiding days are being rotated and raiding times are from 20:30 till 23:00 server time.
      If you're interested in joining Training Grounds, please fill in our application form, located at https://training-grounds.eu/apply/, alternatively please whisper one of our officers:

      On Bnet:
      Leleko - Leleko#2235
      Narweena - Sephyra#2517

      On Discord:
      Leleko#7934
      Narweena#7029

      We're always open to group applications.
      We are also open and welcome social applications.
    • By Narii625
      VISIT OUR WEBSITE!
       
      SERVER: Illidan
      RAID TIMES: Fridays & Sundays 10pm - 1am Server Time.
      PROGRESSION: 2/11M, 11/11H
      LOOT STYLE: EPGP DKP Reloaded (What is EPGP?)
      CURRENTLY ACCEPTING (950+ ilvl)
      All DPS! (Healer offspec preferred but not required) Possibly accepting other roles! ABOUT US
      950+ ilvl to trial immediately, but we accept others. AotC required.
      We are looking for skilled and laid back DPS for Mythic Antorus.
      We're semi-casual in terms of time we spend raiding, but are serious about progression, attendance, and performance.
      We're a close-knit guild that hangs out in Discord a lot, joking, playing alts, Mythic+, other games or just hanging out. Fun guild events happen monthly!
      Overall, we're very social with guild members that actually talk to each other. (18+ required, we talk like pirates!)
       
      Fill out our Application form & add me on Battle.net and/or Discord! 
      Battle.net ID: LadyPluu#1299
      Discord ID: LadyPluu#4473
      Recruitment Officer
      Booty Pirates Website