brosephmg

What's the best Horde race for raiding as Fire?

15 posts in this topic

Title. I'm about to server/faction transfer (tomorrow, actually) - does anyone know what the best race is for raiding as fire? It must be between Pandaren, Orc, and Troll - I'm just not sure which. Has anyone got the scoop?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Orc - 2257 Spell power for 15 sec, on a 2 min CD

Troll - 20% casting speed for 10 sec, on a 3 min CD

Panda - double food buff = 250-300 int across the fight.

I think Troll >>Orc and Troll > Panda

My reasoning is as follows: First, the Troll activate is better than the Orc one when stacked with other trinkets/procs/etc. It was this way in previous expansions, and I've seen nothing to suggest it has changed. If you want the numbers you can probably find them somewhere.

Troll > Panda was based on the fact a 20% haste boost in combination with your other trinkets/abilities/heroism/etc multiplies to make everything stronger. Obviously the int bonus is nice, but I don't think it will come out ahead over the duration of the fight, especially as you get more and more gear (a flat int bonus vs a % based activate).

Again, I don't have numbers, nor the time to do them by tomorrow, but you could probably find some napkin math and I believe it would agree with what I listed above.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At the moment, the Pandaren double food buff seems slightly better than the Troll racial. But, as midgettoes pointed out, the Troll racial will get more and more valuable as you get more gear.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ Agreed, plus female panda's are cute :D

Edited by Clisis

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even though the benefits of the others are more valuable for dps performance, I would only consider swapping to troll from goblin as it stands.

I love rocket jump (and the 1% haste is convenient) for when I need to be somewhere and blink is on CD. I make good use of it, but troll's racial will be much better later on in raiding as gear progresses.

It all depends on what you prefer and if you are willing to swap now for what is best and later for what would be better. Too expensive for me.

~Sage

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am currently running a simulation for you. I'll post back here in 15 minutes tops.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sim: Fire Mage T14N Avg Ilvl = 494.5

Iterations: 10,000

Orc = 101138 DPS

Troll = 101465 DPS

Pandaren = 101650 DPS

Sim: Fire Mage T14H Avg Ilvl = 507.9

Iterations: 10,000

Orc = 123499 DPS

Troll = 126034 DPS

Pandaren = 124065 DPS

It would appear that Pandarens are better at normal tier ilvl (496ish) but Troll pulls away as you scale in gear. Long-term suggestion: Troll

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sim: Fire Mage T14N Avg Ilvl = 494.5

Iterations: 10,000

Orc = 101138 DPS

Troll = 101465 DPS

Pandaren = 101650 DPS

Sim: Fire Mage T14H Avg Ilvl = 507.9

Iterations: 10,000

Orc = 123499 DPS

Troll = 126034 DPS

Pandaren = 124065 DPS

It would appear that Pandarens are better at normal tier ilvl (496ish) but Troll pulls away as you scale in gear. Long-term suggestion: Troll

You did neglect one thing. The shorter you make your fight (down to 12 mins, and then down to 9 etc) will increase the Troll bonus. Obviously in a 3 minute (or multiple thereof) engagement you get the worst possible bonus from Beserking (since it should have just come off CD). On the other hand, if you had, say, a 13 minute fight, Beserking still has 2 minutes before the CD is up again, so your up-time accross the fight has increased.

EDIT: I'm not sure how long your Sim runs for. But this is something to consider. (I thought it was 15 minutes for some reason in my head).

Edited by midgettoes

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Simulation default time is 450 seconds (7 minutes, 30 seconds) so I think Berserking had a pretty good uptime. No fight lasts 15 minutes or more (let's try to forget the debacle that Madness of Deathwing was during progression)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Simulation default time is 450 seconds (7 minutes, 30 seconds) so I think Berserking had a pretty good uptime. No fight lasts 15 minutes or more (let's try to forget the debacle that Madness of Deathwing was during progression)

Yeah I read your two posts together and when you said 'post back in 15 mins' for some reason that read to me as 'simulations are 15 mins'.

I think 7.5 minutes is a pretty good simulation time from my limited raiding experience thus far, thanks heaps for the numbers provided :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah I read your two posts together and when you said 'post back in 15 mins' for some reason that read to me as 'simulations are 15 mins'.

I think 7.5 minutes is a pretty good simulation time from my limited raiding experience thus far, thanks heaps for the numbers provided Posted Image

I remember when boss kills were 20~ minutes long. I'd say 7.5 is paradise in comparison.

Also, what he said with the thanking and the stuff about numbers.

~Sage

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

gonna go ahead and necro this thread....

currently goblin... looking to go troll for the beserking scaling with high ilvl gear (currently 524) + 5% to beasts (5/12 bosses in ToT are beast)

thoughts?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just changed From Goblin to Troll last week for the following reasons:

5% damage bonus on Beasts, which is a big bonus in ToT (Multiple bosses are beasts)

Berserking = 20% Haste for 10 secs. HOWEVER please consider you should never use berserking alone! It has to be used with Alter time. Both have a 3 min cooldown, which means your Berserking can be from 10-16 seconds, expect 13 seconds as you break your Alter time after 2 Pyros for Fire. As Frost you should run the entire 16 seconds.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah, i went ahead and switched. only got some testing in cm's last night (frost)

ill be interested to see how much better it is for fire come raid night.

i miss being tiny :'(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just changed From Goblin to Troll last week for the following reasons:

5% damage bonus on Beasts, which is a big bonus in ToT (Multiple bosses are beasts)

Berserking = 20% Haste for 10 secs. HOWEVER please consider you should never use berserking alone! It has to be used with Alter time. Both have a 3 min cooldown, which means your Berserking can be from 10-16 seconds, expect 13 seconds as you break your Alter time after 2 Pyros for Fire. As Frost you should run the entire 16 seconds.

Berserking is useful for almost any class. I raid on a Troll Guardian Druid, and I use the Berserking racial with the Shado-Pan Assault trinket proc to get a fast-ticking, hard-hitting Lacerate and Thrash. Plus the CC duration reduction is nice on fights where you get stunned frequently.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By mrlucas
      Hey All!
      So I have not figured out simming yet so I am hoping some nice, experienced mages could help me out? So the trinkets I am using currently are an 885 wriggiling sinew and 855 shock-baton for single target. After reading the new BiS trinkets on this site I am a little confused. I'm still using RoP because of sinew but is sinew bad now? My DPS is not bad but I would still prefer to be utilizing my character to the max.
      I have a 875 urn, 870 spiked tongue, and 880 plaguehive. Would either of those be better on ST?
      Really appreciate any comments / help, thank you!
      Link to armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/area-52/Rogerklotz/simple
       
    • By molodirazz
      All applications will be reviewed and considered however if you are playing a class/spec combination we need then your chances of joining will be higher.
      A little bit of info about us:
      We are a group of friends and serious raiders on EU Twisting Nether looking to recruit skilled like-minded players into our roster for Mythic Legion raids. We will offer a sociable and fun raiding environment while maintaining a strong desire for progression. Our Discord is very active and we encourage all members to chat and play together not only for raids.

      We currently raid Wednesday, Sunday and Tuesday 19:00-22:00 server time. We run social/alt raids during off days in which all ranks of the guild are welcome to come to. Our members also play other games outside raid times together where anyone is also welcome to join(LoL, Dota, HotS, Overwatch etc.).
      Our loot system for Mythic is RC Loot Council.
      What we expect from you:
      - We are a raiding guild with a 3 days a week schedule that you are expected to attend. However we understand things can come up but please let us know.
      - Be able to speak and understand the English language and not be afraid to communicate with other members during raids.
      - Actively doing dungeons and world quests to gear in preparation for raids. This includes improving your artifact weapon.
      - Have a strong understanding of the current raid tier and be able to play your class to it's potential.
      - Always come to raids prepared (i.e. bringing food and potions, etc).
      - Come fully gemmed and enchanted with the correct stats for your class and spec.
      - Access to Discord and a working microphone.
      - Have a computer that can handle 20 man raiding.
      - Exorsus Raid Tools and RC Loot Council addons installed. We may ask you to install others.
      ____________________________________________________
      To join into our current main raids
      - 865 ilvl
      - 25 traits at the very least.
      - Experience on 4 or more bosses in EN Mythic.
      You will receive a response within 3 days but probably within 1. The trial process will last 2 weeks, sometimes longer. During the trial period you will not have loot priority over raiders however you may of course still roll.
      If you have any further questions please contact us at battletags: Vims#21684  or go to our website http://asylum-tn.enjin.com/ .
      __________________________________________________________________________________
      We're currently looking for the classes below but may consider other classes as well.
      All applications will be reviewed and considered however if you are playing a class/spec combination we need then your chances of joining will be higher.
      A little bit of info about us:
      We are a group of friends and serious raiders on EU Twisting Nether looking to recruit skilled like-minded players into our roster for Mythic Legion raids. We will offer a sociable and fun raiding environment while maintaining a strong desire for progression. Our Discord is very active and we encourage all members to chat and play together not only for raids.

      We currently raid Wednesday, Sunday and Tuesday 19:00-22:00 server time. We run social/alt raids during off days in which all ranks of the guild are welcome to come to. Our members also play other games outside raid times together where anyone is also welcome to join(LoL, Dota, HotS, Overwatch etc.).
      Our loot system for Mythic is RC Loot Council.
      What we expect from you:
      - We are a raiding guild with a 3 days a week schedule that you are expected to attend. However we understand things can come up but please let us know.
      - Be able to speak and understand the English language and not be afraid to communicate with other members during raids.
      - Actively doing dungeons and world quests to gear in preparation for raids. This includes improving your artifact weapon.
      - Have a strong understanding of the current raid tier and be able to play your class to it's potential.
      - Always come to raids prepared (i.e. bringing food and potions, etc).
      - Come fully gemmed and enchanted with the correct stats for your class and spec.
      - Access to Discord and a working microphone.
      - Have a computer that can handle 20 man raiding.
      - Exorsus Raid Tools and RC Loot Council addons installed. We may ask you to install others.
      ____________________________________________________
      To join into our current main raids
      - 875 ilvl
      - 35 traits at least.
      - 5 or more Mythic boss kills.
      You will receive a response within 3 days but probably within 1. The trial process will last 2 weeks, sometimes longer. During the trial period you will not have loot priority over raiders however you may of course still roll.
      If you have any further questions please contact us at battletags: Vims#21684 or go to our website http://asylum-tn.enjin.com/ .
      __________________________________________________________________________________
      We're currently looking for the classes below but may consider other classes as well.
      Monk: Healer.
      Druid: Balance and Guardian.
      Priest: Shadow and Holy
      Other dps will also be considered.
    • By Violentravi
      Hello,
      Adelante is currently recruiting DPS & Heals, however, all competent players will be considered.  We are a Horde guild on Arthas and our current progression is 8/10N NH 4/7M EN and 3/3H TOV.  As far as classes go we do not have a Moonkin, Mage, Feral Druid, or any type of Monk. We only raid two nights a week, Tuesday and Wednesday from 7:00 PM until 11:00 PM Eastern.  Thursday is not considered a raid night, but we will often clear Heroic and Normal on this evening for AP and it is not required. We are pushing progression on Il'gynoth, and look forward to finishing off EN then moving on to Nighthold, we will be intermittently working on Mythic TOV.
      From you, we would expect 100% attendance during your trial period; after that, if you cannot make a raid or will be late it is mandatory to keep the raid leader updated.  In order to continue making good progression while raiding only two nights a week, we expect that you know your class inside-out and will research any bosses you are unfamiliar with prior to raids.
       If you are interested, you can either reply to this thread and link your most recent combat logs for review, make a character on our realm and inbox me, or hit me up on real ID (violentravi#1826).  Alternatively, if you are old school, please apply via our website:  http://www.adelante-guild.com
      Thank you for your consideration
      Xoxo
      Violentnacho & the Guild
    • By Fendorn009
      Trying to get myself geared better but seem to be having problems.  Artifact is almost full on fire.  Just having to unlock the 3rd trait is being a pain.
       
      http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/drakthul/Herad/advanced