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Damien

Heroes of the Storm Malfurion

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This thread is for comments about our Malfurion build guide for Heroes of the Storm.

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I don't agree with the assessment of the talents related to "Innervate", especially since the guide recommends enhancing "Regrowth" at level 1 instead.

"Moonfire" does cost 20 mana to cast, so in order for a net mana return to occur from the level 1 talent, one does need to hit at least 3 targets per cast. It also does only stack to 6, capping the mana return even under the most ideal of circumstances.

"Innervate" does scale up madly with level, while "Moonfire" becomes less and less important (especially concerning the mana return from the level 1 talent).

If you have a lane partner who relies on mana (and most heroes do, even tanks), then "Innervate" is a godsend, and improving it at level 1 can be significant already; it only gets better from there.

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The articles here are all great, the only thing I would add is a clarification that your tips seem to be SPECIFICALLY for team play.

 

The reason I'm saying is I'm currently just learning the game, so I'm just playing AI opponents.  And it's impossible to play Malfurion as a healer:  your AI teammates don't understand what it means to have support.

 

But if you take all the Entangling Roots upgrades, even the ones you very specifically do not recommend, Malfurion can in fact be played like a DPS character.  A single cast of Entangling Roots later in the game (post 7?) will melt an entire wave of attackers.  What isn't caught in the "root ball" will be killed by the Treant.

 

And since people are so unpredictable, I'm sure there's a game somewhere that having a DPS-Malfurion would throw the opposing team off enough to make it viable.  I would agree that would be like 1% of matches, but the fact remains it CAN be done.

 

Keep up the great work!

 

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I like this article because it tells people how to build Mal as a healer, but at the same time, that severely understates his flexibility and usefulness for potential DPS and crowd control.

 

The guide states Twilight Dream as "not recommended" when the description itself proves that it is, at least, a situationally strong tool. Sure, it's hard to position, but blasting 3-4 heroes at the start of a team fight turns the tide very quickly. It is also useful during an attempted gank, and taking out high-damage DPS like Valla, Illidan, Tychus or Falstad by yourself is always a valuable use for Twilight Dream that opposing teams will not expect.

 

In a DPS-build, Mal can easily solo a number of assassins including Falstad, Valla, Jaina, Tychus, and Illidan if played correctly. Combining Full Moonfire with Lunar Shower allows for near endless DPS in the latter half of a match. Complimented by Mal's ability to root and heal, his survivability can be extremely high with a skilled player. Moonfire has the added benefit of having a large cast rage (potentially amplified by Full Moonfire) that allows you to chase a low health hero easily and effectively. However, it is important to let a team know you play Mal this way because, otherwise, they'll be expecting your mediocre heals and Tranquility. Also, do not underestimate the potential for Moonfire to reveal cloaked assassins like Zeratul and Nova.

 

As a healer, Mal should be compared to Lili at all times. Mal's Tranquility heals for less than Lili's Jug of 1,000 Cups and has shorter range; additionally, while Regrowth has the potential to heal for more over an extended period of time, Lili's Healing Brew heals for more health immediately and has 4 seconds less cooldown without any talent upgrades.

 

For these reasons, I strongly believe that if you want a great healer, there is no reason to choose Mal over Lili. If you want flexibility and have good judgment, pick Mal.

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I like this article because it tells people how to build Mal as a healer, but at the same time, that severely understates his flexibility and usefulness for potential DPS and crowd control.

[...]

As a healer, Mal should be compared to Lili at all times.

Malfurion should not be compared to Lili at all (except for the fact that they are both support healers). The mechanics of both heroes are very different; I'd like to add that Malfurion is much stronger, because he does have CC that Lili completely lacks.

I also find it slightly distressing how the guide flip-flops its talent recommendations (Rampant Growth just went from "pick this!" to "avoid! it sucks completely!"). Maybe do the math on the various talents before making recommendations...

Edited by siggboy

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I don't agree with the assessment of the talents related to "Innervate", especially since the guide recommends enhancing "Regrowth" at level 1 instead.

"Moonfire" does cost 20 mana to cast, so in order for a net mana return to occur from the level 1 talent, one does need to hit at least 3 targets per cast. It also does only stack to 6, capping the mana return even under the most ideal of circumstances.

"Innervate" does scale up madly with level, while "Moonfire" becomes less and less important (especially concerning the mana return from the level 1 talent).

If you have a lane partner who relies on mana (and most heroes do, even tanks), then "Innervate" is a godsend, and improving it at level 1 can be significant already; it only gets better from there.

 

Unfortunately, Innervate cannot be self-cast; if it could, that would be an entirely different story.

I'd argue that, in general, players should first and foremost focus on their own Mana management, especially since healers are the archetype that are most dependent on their abilities to impact anything. Innervate is already pretty good as is. I think you overestimate how much Innervate scales; the difference of Mana it grants to a level 1 and a level 20 hero is approximately 30 - that's not exactly stellar in terms of scaling

 

I'd like to point out that Harmony can only stack once per Moonfire, irregardless of how many targets it hits. Moonfire is an important aspect of Malfurion's playstyle; the benefits of the talent is at least tangible, if not a bit underwhelming.

 

 

The articles here are all great, the only thing I would add is a clarification that your tips seem to be SPECIFICALLY for team play.

 

The reason I'm saying is I'm currently just learning the game, so I'm just playing AI opponents.  And it's impossible to play Malfurion as a healer:  your AI teammates don't understand what it means to have support.

 

But if you take all the Entangling Roots upgrades, even the ones you very specifically do not recommend, Malfurion can in fact be played like a DPS character.  A single cast of Entangling Roots later in the game (post 7?) will melt an entire wave of attackers.  What isn't caught in the "root ball" will be killed by the Treant.

 

And since people are so unpredictable, I'm sure there's a game somewhere that having a DPS-Malfurion would throw the opposing team off enough to make it viable.  I would agree that would be like 1% of matches, but the fact remains it CAN be done.

 

Keep up the great work!

 

I've had successful games as a damage-dealing Malfurion myself. Those games are extremely rare, however, to the point where I couldn't explain the circumstances that allowed them to be in the first place.

 

The reason we don't typically gear guides around A.I. games is because we deem them to not be the core of Heroes of the Storm's game play. I'd like to go on record here and say that I mean this with the utmost respect to players who do enjoy the stress-free environment of bot games. However, they tend require players to play much less optimally for to be successful; they're there to let you try stuff out without fear of resentment from your fellow players! In general, I feel that most, if not all talents can work in such an environment.

Thank you for the feedback and kind words.

 

 

I like this article because it tells people how to build Mal as a healer, but at the same time, that severely understates his flexibility and usefulness for potential DPS and crowd control.
 
The guide states Twilight Dream as "not recommended" when the description itself proves that it is, at least, a situationally strong tool. Sure, it's hard to position, but blasting 3-4 heroes at the start of a team fight turns the tide very quickly. It is also useful during an attempted gank, and taking out high-damage DPS like Valla, Illidan, Tychus or Falstad by yourself is always a valuable use for Twilight Dream that opposing teams will not expect.
 
In a DPS-build, Mal can easily solo a number of assassins including Falstad, Valla, Jaina, Tychus, and Illidan if played correctly. Combining Full Moonfire with Lunar Shower allows for near endless DPS in the latter half of a match. Complimented by Mal's ability to root and heal, his survivability can be extremely high with a skilled player. Moonfire has the added benefit of having a large cast rage (potentially amplified by Full Moonfire) that allows you to chase a low health hero easily and effectively. However, it is important to let a team know you play Mal this way because, otherwise, they'll be expecting your mediocre heals and Tranquility. Also, do not underestimate the potential for Moonfire to reveal cloaked assassins like Zeratul and Nova.
 
As a healer, Mal should be compared to Lili at all times. Mal's Tranquility heals for less than Lili's Jug of 1,000 Cups and has shorter range; additionally, while Regrowth has the potential to heal for more over an extended period of time, Lili's Healing Brew heals for more health immediately and has 4 seconds less cooldown without any talent upgrades.
 
For these reasons, I strongly believe that if you want a great healer, there is no reason to choose Mal over Lili. If you want flexibility and have good judgment, pick Mal.

 

 

Although I'm a fan myself of always experimenting with as many builds as possible, I tend to write guides from a meta-gaming-reflective perspective; in other words, what people expect from you. In the overwhelming majority of the time, when a player sees a Malfurion pick in a ranked game (or otherwise), they expect to be healed. If you're running with 4 of your friends, and wish to try different things (which I do all the time, at the dismay of said friends), that is not our domain. I often misquote that consistency usually trumps potential.

 

 

 

I also find it slightly distressing how the guide flip-flops its talent recommendations (Rampant Growth just went from "pick this!" to "avoid! it sucks completely!"). Maybe do the math on the various talents before making recommendations...

 

 

We regularly update our talent choices to reflect meta-gaming trends and personal experiences. I'd look like quite the fool if I tried to convince you or anyone else that I'm right 100% of the time when, in reality, it's more like 98-99%.

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Hey, nice guide.

You mentioned that Rampant Growth is the weakest talent atm., but you also mentioned that Malfurion is the hero who really lacks in the department of instant healing and that his abilities already have a decent range. Picking the range talent is beneficial against default teams.

 

But I think that makes the Rampant Growth a situational talent against enemy team compositions with more healers.

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Hey, nice guide.

You mentioned that Rampant Growth is the weakest talent atm., but you also mentioned that Malfurion is the hero who really lacks in the department of instant healing and that his abilities already have a decent range. Picking the range talent is beneficial against default teams.

 

But I think that makes the Rampant Growth a situational talent against enemy team compositions with more healers.

Hi Psojed,

Rampant Growth is really, really weak, only adding between 45 and 150 healing to Regrowth (at level 4 and 20, respectively). That's less than one basic attack for most heroes, to put things into perspective. Even if Malf' does lack instant healing, landing a good Entangling Root, thanks to Elune's Grace, will outperform any extra healing done by Regrowth tenfold.

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Just thought it would be worth mentioning. I paired up with Cho'Gall quite a bit tonight, and he seems to do really well with Malfurion. Has a huge health pool that can really take advantage of Malf's hots.

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Just thought it would be worth mentioning. I paired up with Cho'Gall quite a bit tonight, and he seems to do really well with Malfurion. Has a huge health pool that can really take advantage of Malf's hots.

 

Yep, I came to the same conclusion as well. I think our Cho'gall pre-guide has such a mention.

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Just thought that I would mention that you are missing (because this was written before it) a Towers of Doom specific advice page. Hope this helped. smile.png

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Just thought that I would mention that you are missing (because this was written before it) a Towers of Doom specific advice page. Hope this helped. smile.png

 

It's... it's coming... :(

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I'm not speaking from experience, but wouldn't Hindering Moonfire combo really well with heroes with Executioner, which benefits from slowed enemies? And even without Executioner, applying a reliable 2 sec slow every 3 seconds seems like a good alternative to a missable 2 sec root, no?

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8 hours ago, Guest ProPlayerKim said:

I'm not speaking from experience, but wouldn't Hindering Moonfire combo really well with heroes with Executioner, which benefits from slowed enemies? And even without Executioner, applying a reliable 2 sec slow every 3 seconds seems like a good alternative to a missable 2 sec root, no?

Certainly an interesting thought. The idea behind Tenacious Roots, however, is that it makes Entangling Roots that much easier to land; remember that rooting effects also trigger Executioner, and that, as such, Tenacious Roots also fulfils the triggering purpose, albeit less frequently. I'm still of the opinion that Entangling Roots is what truly defines a good Malf player, so I'm a big fan of that talent. I'll think it through and find specific examples of when to use Hindering Moonfire.

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it should be noted that the drone for T1 is OPAF against stealthies! 

 

This is actually a weak build for him even for a 5m team! 

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9 hours ago, Guest Shiboo said:

it should be noted that the drone for T1 is OPAF against stealthies! 

You can spam MoonfireMoonfire to reveal stealthed heroes. Besides, Scouting Drone Icon Scouting Drone can be seen and destroyed by enemy heroes, which significantly reduces its usefulness.

9 hours ago, Guest Shiboo said:

This is actually a weak build for him even for a 5m team! 

Could you please specify why?

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