Marksmanship Hunter 7.3

[AartS 14]

On 7-8-2017 at 4:39 AM, Guest Pupperdoggo said:

Interestingly enough, I'm getting haste as a recommended stat above crit. This sort of defies logic in my head (and judging by what other hunters are doing, it would defy theirs too). As mentioned in the guide, there's a haste softcap that CAN be chased but doesn't really bring much benefit. Having too much also throws my timings with AiS and the vuln window. My only assumption is that haste is being weighed more heavily due to lock n loads value with the T20 set bonuses. The weights I'm getting are below.

( Pawn: v1: "pupperdoggo - Marksmanship (Raidbots)": Class=Hunter, Spec=Marksmanship, Agility=20.43, CritRating=27.92, HasteRating=30.17, MasteryRating=31.15, Versatility=26.04 )

To what extent should I pay attention to this? I know what the sims are telling me to do, but everything else in me Is telling me that crit is simply more important than haste, period.

https://www.wowprogress.com/character/eu/argent-dawn/Pupperdoggo

https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/argent-dawn/pupperdoggo

Secondly, to what extent is Ullr's worth running without CoF or the NH 2-set? And what's the best way to itemize without these?

Thanks in advance

I have the same issue when simming my character on ST spec and gear. Even to an extend that it now tells me to start using haste food over crit/mastery.... 

Latest sim resulted in:
Hast 36.38
Crit 33.14
Mastery 32.82
Versality 27.12
Agility 23.28

My armor is consisted mostly of raiding gear and I try to follow the BiS list as far as reasonbly possible. https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/kazzak/aarts
Would anyone be able to shed some light on this?

 

Edited August 10, 2017 by AartS

[Guest Ttdb]

Hi I am,  pretty confused by the guide and especially on the constant mention of using arcane and multishot to spread marks. I just started playing legion this week (wow in general really) for the first time in about 14 months. Anyways, I don't have either of those skills and they are presumably replaced by sidewinder which I find almost no mention of. Lastly I have huge questions on sidewinder and whether or not it is essentially just a combo of the two skills it replaces.

 

 

Thanks

[Valks 2,373]

On 8/7/2017 at 3:39 AM, Guest Pupperdoggo said:

To what extent should I pay attention to this? I know what the sims are telling me to do, but everything else in me Is telling me that crit is simply more important than haste, period.

Your personal sims will be more accurate than the ones Azor posts, at least for your character. What Raidbots tells you will likely be true most of the time. You have to keep in mind that it might just be weighting stats high to then completely devalue them after you add some. Follow the weights, keep resimming.

[Valks 2,373]

On 8/9/2017 at 9:55 AM, AartS said:

Would anyone be able to shed some light on this?

See my comment above if you are still wondering.

[Valks 2,373]

On 8/22/2017 at 9:49 PM, Guest Ttdb said:

Hi I am,  pretty confused by the guide and especially on the constant mention of using arcane and multishot to spread marks. I just started playing legion this week (wow in general really) for the first time in about 14 months. Anyways, I don't have either of those skills and they are presumably replaced by sidewinder which I find almost no mention of. Lastly I have huge questions on sidewinder and whether or not it is essentially just a combo of the two skills it replaces.

Sidewinders replaces both. If you decide to take Sidewinders, simply replace both of them in the rotation and it functions the same.

[Valks 2,373]

We are currently in the process of updating all guides as required for the 7.3 release. Please be patient as we make the necessary changes. You can keep an eye on the changelog to know if the guide has been updated or not. 

[Valks 2,373]

This guide has now been updated for the 7.3 patch. If you have any questions or comments, you can always ask them here. If you find any errors in the new changes to the guide, let me know and I'll get the writers to update it ASAP.

Good luck in the Shadows of Argus!

[Guest Alex]

Hey guys!

 

I saw that, in theory, Troll gives the highest DPS in terms of racial bonus. At least all of methods hunters, except Gingi who is currently specced BM, are Blood Elf though. My question is: Has that any reason besides maybe utility for progressing? Or is it that in most fights b11 ends up being top dmg?

 

Thanks!

 

[Luthixx 138]

Mostly due to the focus gen from Arcane Torrent I believe. Could also be personal preference - at that level it's not the biggest increase in terms of dps.

[Valks 2,373]

3 hours ago, Guest Alex said:

Hey guys!

 

I saw that, in theory, Troll gives the highest DPS in terms of racial bonus. At least all of methods hunters, except Gingi who is currently specced BM, are Blood Elf though. My question is: Has that any reason besides maybe utility for progressing? Or is it that in most fights b11 ends up being top dmg?

 

Thanks!

 

Very possible Roger has gone Blood Elf for fun. He was Orc during progression, so I don't think he cares about the DPS difference of racials. Nnoggah is Troll and was during progression. Gingi was always a BElf I think. Now that progression is over, they might be pushing for M+ clears, so looking at the usefulness of the AoE silence perhaps.

[AartS 14]

Thanks for the updates!

In the crucible section, I miss the value of Quick Shot. Any idea on its position in the ranking?  Its up against Deadly Aim and Precision for one of my relics.

[Guest Mikra]

I see now that you added Quick Shot for the Crucible Relics since it wasn't there before, however there is an asterix after it's value but there is nothing on the page that explains what the asterix means. Is there any meaning for it?

[AartS 14]

3 hours ago, Guest Mikra said:

I see now that you added Quick Shot for the Crucible Relics since it wasn't there before, however there is an asterix after it's value but there is nothing on the page that explains what the asterix means. Is there any meaning for it?

Very nice that it was added so quickly!

The asterix there is similar to the astrix at the 'normal' artifact/trait page. I think it refers to that remark which sais that due to the nature of the trair (time based advantage) the benefit can be either large (extra true shot) or zero (no extra true shot). Stating that the increased ilvl shown is a value somewhat in the middle of this.

[Valks 2,373]

3 hours ago, Guest Mikra said:

I see now that you added Quick Shot for the Crucible Relics since it wasn't there before, however there is an asterix after it's value but there is nothing on the page that explains what the asterix means. Is there any meaning for it?

As above, it's exactly that. Essentially, Quick Shot can be insanely valuable or completely useless as a trait, since it has a chance to change absolutely nothing in your DPS. You have to check the times of your kills to see if it's actually worth you using it. If your guild does below average DPS, you're likely to see more benefit from it, since there is more leeway with time. If your guild has a very rigid, extremely fast killtime, you might never see it benefiting you at all.

[Valks 2,373]

14 minutes ago, AartS said:

Very nice that it was added so quickly!

The asterix there is similar to the astrix at the 'normal' artifact/trait page. I think it refers to that remark which sais that due to the nature of the trair (time based advantage) the benefit can be either large (extra true shot) or zero (no extra true shot). Stating that the increased ilvl shown is a value somewhat in the middle of this.

Thanks for helping with that! :) Glad that Azor updated things so quickly.

[Guest Lapella]

I'm only at 10% haste and I'm struggling to keep Vulnerable up while always casting AiS in pairs because my AiS cast times are high and focus regen is so low. I'm tempted to gem and enchant haste to make this more manageable. While in sims it will show a decrease in dps, in real time I feel it will increase it due to being able to manage it better. My current AiS cast times with no haste buffs are 1.8 and 1.7 with precision. What do you think?

I'm getting these stat weights from Raidbots btw

Crit 28.82

Mastery 27.02

Haste 23.49

[Valks 2,373]

1 hour ago, Guest Lapella said:

What do you think?

I believe you will still push according to your weights.

[Guest johan]

Would it ever be worth to use Mark of the claw as an enchant vs Trained soldier? I believe the 600 static buff would be more beneficial than a random proc but both haste and crit are better than mastery (for me personally) right now, so I am not really sure right now, any thoughts? Thanks

[Valks 2,373]

4 hours ago, Guest johan said:

Would it ever be worth to use Mark of the claw as an enchant vs Trained soldier? I believe the 600 static buff would be more beneficial than a random proc but both haste and crit are better than mastery (for me personally) right now, so I am not really sure right now, any thoughts? Thanks

You can check using this: https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/gear

It will give the most accurate answer.

[Guest Varonel]

About the bullet point about having tier 20 - 4 set bonus and 18-19% haste:

I have 21.14 haste which means gcd is 1.238 and aimed shot cast with set bonus is 1.519

For 2 arcane and 2 aimed I would need 2.476 + 3.038 = 5.514 seconds

Aimed shot has a travel time of max 0.5 seconds so will need to add 0.5 for the last aimed to hit before debuff ends, which leads to 6.014

Debuff starts at 7 seconds, marked shot has about 0.2 maximum travel time, so remaining gcd when Vulnerable debuff is applied is around 1.038. Then debuff will be at 5.962 seconds.

The result is that last aimed will hit after vulnerable ends.

Testing this from on top of the dummy to reduce aimed shot travel time, but still was unable to hit aimed before vuln ended consistently.

 

[mygard 1]

I was looking for some info on what if anything is gonna happen to marks stat priority come 7.3.2 since I have notice on wowheros they have it changed already

 

[Valks 2,373]

On 10/16/2017 at 4:14 AM, Guest Varonel said:

Testing this from on top of the dummy to reduce aimed shot travel time, but still was unable to hit aimed before vuln ended consistently.

Asking Azor. Will let you know.

[Valks 2,373]

22 hours ago, mygard said:

I was looking for some info on what if anything is gonna happen to marks stat priority come 7.3.2 since I have notice on wowheros they have it changed already

As soon as the patch goes live with any changes, the guides will be updated if necessary - there's not much point having guides for PTR patches. 

[Guest Alex]

Hey everyone,

I have a question concerning Trinkets:

I have the Unstable Arcanocrystal on 890 and the Tarnished Sentinel Medallion on 920.

Is there ANY fight in ToS (for example on heroic) that I would use Convergence 890 over any of these two?

My available legendaries are: boots, belt, AimedShot-Ring and other useless ones. I do not own the hands.

 

Thanks for your advice.

[Azortharion 60]

On 10/16/2017 at 5:14 AM, Guest Varonel said:

About the bullet point about having tier 20 - 4 set bonus and 18-19% haste:

I have 21.14 haste which means gcd is 1.238 and aimed shot cast with set bonus is 1.519

For 2 arcane and 2 aimed I would need 2.476 + 3.038 = 5.514 seconds

Aimed shot has a travel time of max 0.5 seconds so will need to add 0.5 for the last aimed to hit before debuff ends, which leads to 6.014

Debuff starts at 7 seconds, marked shot has about 0.2 maximum travel time, so remaining gcd when Vulnerable debuff is applied is around 1.038. Then debuff will be at 5.962 seconds.

The result is that last aimed will hit after vulnerable ends.

Testing this from on top of the dummy to reduce aimed shot travel time, but still was unable to hit aimed before vuln ended consistently.

 

Aimed Shot doesn't need to hit before Vulnerable ends, that is the main misconception that leads to this confusion. The cast needs to reach its finishing point before Vulnerable expires, it does not need to land in time.

Also, Marked Shot applies Vulnerable on cast - not on hit. Windburst applies on it hit, however.