Damien

Shadow Priest 7.3

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This thread is for comments about our Shadow Priest guide for Legion.

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Rotation, Cooldowns and Abilitys:

5.5.2 States that VT has a 24 second duration. Its duration is 18 seconds.

Additionaly, to avoid misinterpretation, i would suggest to call the " high AoE damage " in the introduction something like "high sustained multidot (<4 targets) damage", since spriest is nowhere near any burst aoe class. That is somehow misleading for a beginner.

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39 minutes ago, Guest N1gh7h4wk said:

Rotation, Cooldowns and Abilitys:

5.5.2 States that VT has a 24 second duration. Its duration is 18 seconds.

Additionaly, to avoid misinterpretation, i would suggest to call the " high AoE damage " in the introduction something like "high sustained multidot (<4 targets) damage", since spriest is nowhere near any burst aoe class. That is somehow misleading for a beginner.

Thank you for pointing these out. Not sure when VT changed to 18 but it must have been pretty recent. I'm fixing it now, and I'm also going to incorporate your suggestion for the introduction page.

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The VT lasting 24sec error was my mistake. I brainfarted back to earlier in beta when VT was 24sec and SWP was 18sec (@ 3 sec period) before both got changed. Apologies!

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Spellpower merged into intellect, but showing as a stat req.  :)  Might want to tweak that. 

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Thanks for the great job on the Shadowpriest.

In the talents Tier 6 (level 90), it states that Mindbender has replaced Shadowfiend, but on the page with the rotations, there are several references to Shadowfiend, in the single and multiple target rotations; against 4 or more targets, and in several sections dealing with cooldowns.

 

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On July 21, 2016 at 4:35 PM, Guest 7.0.3 has no SP said:

Spellpower merged into intellect, but showing as a stat req.  :)  Might want to tweak that. 

I'll let Twintop take that one. Thanks for the comment.

21 hours ago, FreddyJ said:

Thanks for the great job on the Shadowpriest.

In the talents Tier 6 (level 90), it states that Mindbender has replaced Shadowfiend, but on the page with the rotations, there are several references to Shadowfiend, in the single and multiple target rotations; against 4 or more targets, and in several sections dealing with cooldowns.

 

I'm glad you like the guide.

Mindbender only replaces Shadowfiend if you actually choose the talent, which isn't always the case. So, unless you do choose it, Shadowfiend does still exist as a spell, which is why the rotation page refers to it. Hope that clears it up.

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Thanks for the reply.  When I read the line in Level 90 talent, "Mindbender replaces Shadowfiend," I took that as the gospel lol.

 

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On 7/21/2016 at 6:35 AM, Guest 7.0.3 has no SP said:

Spellpower merged into intellect, but showing as a stat req.  :)  Might want to tweak that. 

There still may be effects that increase your Intellect's effect (multiplicatively) and others that merely increase your raw Spell Power. In this event, Int > SP. While they are effectively identical in the vast majority of cases it is worth calling it out.

Edited by Twintop

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The tier 7 talents leave a bit to be wanted. Surrender to Madness is awesome for what it does, but the other choices are kinda lackluster. I take Mind Spike, because activating Void Form earlier just means a shorter Void Form. But you guys say Mind Spike isn't worth taking... so, here's to hoping they take another look at this row. Mind Spike having the relationship with Mind Blast that it used to have, with it's current mechanic, that'd bring it back up to max-level-talent status. Essentially giving us Void Form Easy Mode, Void Form Hardcore Mode, and alternative-to-Void-Form haste mode.

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I find this guide quite confusing, could someone please explain. Under the Single Target Rotation, Build Phase, it says "1. Cast Void Eruption", but that isn't possible without 100 Insanity so how can that be step1?  How is one supposed to generate that insanity?

Edited by Clin
Typo

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1 hour ago, Clin said:

I find this guide quite confusing, could someone please explain. Under the Single Target Rotation, Build Phase, it says "1. Cast Void Eruption", but that isn't possible without 100 Insanity so how can that be step1?  How is one supposed to generate that insanity?

That's not step 1 per say, but rather your number 1 priority thing to do.  The rotations given are more priority lists than they are step-by-step rotations.  

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19 hours ago, Clin said:

I find this guide quite confusing, could someone please explain. Under the Single Target Rotation, Build Phase, it says "1. Cast Void Eruption", but that isn't possible without 100 Insanity so how can that be step1?  How is one supposed to generate that insanity?

As Orthios says (and as the guide states), the rotation is a priority. So yeah, if you are in the build phase, your top priority is to enter Voidform. If you can't do that (because you don't have the required Insanity), you move on to #2 and so on.

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What was mentioned earlier about how the rotation is confusing, as a new player, I can attest to that. 
I understood there was a skill that was not ready to use, Void Eruption, to enter Voidform.
If you cannot use Void Eruption as #1, it should not be the first step in the build phase. 
Build means you are building up to be able to use Void Eruption to enter Voidform.

The way I see it, the Build Phase is actually :

Build Phase (not in Voidform)
1. Apply and maintain Shadow Word: Pain and Vampiric Touch.
2. Cast Mind Blast. (cast when available - when appoaching 100% insanity save to use after entering Voidform)
3. Cast Mind Flay as your filler spell. (when Mind Blast is not available)

To me, this is the easiest most logical representation of how the rotation should begin. 
When I saw Void Eruption as #1, I thought my skill was bugged ha

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The point you're missing here is that the rotation is NOT A STEP-BY-STEP guide.  Using Void Eruption is not step 1, it is your #1 Priority.  

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On 24/07/2016 at 7:58 AM, Guest dscutt said:

I take Mind Spike, because activating Void Form earlier just means a shorter Void Form. 

Not quite, just means you can enter voidform faster but as the insanity drain is low at the begining, you will continue to gain more insanity once you enter voidform. I like this talent because it means larger uptime of voidform and it doesnt require you to die. great for leveling and mobing in general, not useless at all in raiding conditions. Under perfect conditions, StM is better for sure for raiding unless maybe for very long fights?

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On 7/27/2016 at 0:27 PM, Orthios said:

The point you're missing here is that the rotation is NOT A STEP-BY-STEP guide.  Using Void Eruption is not step 1, it is your #1 Priority.  

That makes sense that it is priority #1, but doesn't make it any less confusing putting a #1 in front of it as a "building phase".  You don't begin a building phase with the one thing you are building up to get to.  It should be at the end #5 .. or not even be a part of the build phase at all.

I'm just saying it could be phrased different so there is less confusion.

Just read it to yourself and you might think the same way. Think if you were new to these set of skills, which most are who are reading these guides..

Build Phase (not in Voidform Icon Voidform)

  1. Cast Void Eruption Icon Void Eruption (to enter Voidform).
Edited by tir

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Since Mastery is boosting Vamp Touch, Shadow word Pain, and Mind Blast.. and since every recount stat ive seen from my own priest, shows me that Vamp Touch is by far the suprior damage from the shadowpriest, followed up by shadow word pain, and then mind blast, and then void bolt..

Wouldnt it be wiser to actually build towards Mastery, instead of Crit?

I mean.. the Crit litterally only helps if you choose Shadowry Apprition.. and even if you rely on those to deal damage, shadowry appritiation is still far down on the damage scale, and is nothing compared to the above spells mentioned..

Have anyone tried building a Mastery, Haste, Versatility/Crit or Crit/Versatility and compared if the damage output was higher, then the current recommendations of this guide?

Just wondering.. cuz i see more potential in the Mastery and Haste, rather then the Crit/haste.. im currently using Crit/haste myself.. but.. u know.. seems obvious somehow that the damage will increase with the mastery.. somehow..

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Could someone help me with the new Shadow Priest rotation for PVP? Additionally, I always seem to get locked down by melee, also my survivability is horrible. Any tips would be greatly appreciated!

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Mastery doesn't boost Mind Blast, it boosts Void Bolt (in addition to Shadow Word: Pain and Vampiric Touch). Once we have Mass Hysteria (major artifact trait) your overall damage sources will even out a bit in regard to stats, but right now the biggest DPS gains come from: 1) staying in Voidform as long as possible (haste primarily, crit secondary via Auspicious Spirits), and 2) multidotting (haste for faster DoT ticks, then Mastery). Looking at HFC in the prepatch there aren't many encounters where you'll get full duration on your DoTs on secondary targets, with that largely only being on Council, Tyrant, and Archimonde. In general Mastery is poor for us in the prepatch.

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Hi, I didn't see anything about an opener, but your priority list would lead me to believe you would open with Mind blast and not dots. Is this the case?

And maybe this is going too far into the weeds here, but there are going to be situations where your priority list changes that aren't reflected. For example: at a certain number of enemies, mind blast becomes less effective than mind sear. This would be further compounded I would think by voidform and lingering insanity haste. This would also make mind sear more effective than mind blast at a certain point.

Any thoughts on this?

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In my eyes the optimal opener would be

Pot -> MB at 1sec -> MindBender-> VT -> SW:P -> MF -> MB -> Void Eruption ->MF until VB is ready -> VB -> MF -> normal voidform rotation

The normal voidform rotation is a real rotation if you can stand still:  VB -> MB -> Filler -> VB -> 2GCD filler -> repeat

 

What I think is of note here: I start with VT, then SW:P even though I have SW:P talented. I feel that it allows me to guarantee an extension of SW:P with the first Void Bolt - when sometimes it's really close if you go SW:P into VT at the low levels of haste you have before your very first voidform.

Also, at least with 4t18, I don't think you can afford to delay Mindbender at all.

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