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New BM huntard looking for advice

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Hey, so I've recently decided to main a BM hunter for the rest of legion and was just curious if there was some helpful tips out there (I've been reading up on the guides/forum posts but trying to see if I'm doing ok).


this is me. https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/nagrand/greenmidget


sorry, I haven't done this before so I don't have any data to link or know how to use stuff like Warcraft logs or sims. I've also haven't done many runs of tombs yet so don't have any tier pieces.


looking at the icy veins guides I've talented for dire frenzy but didn't realise how much mastery I ended up with. Have I gone too crazy with mastery, should I be adjusting my stat prio better? Thinking I should probably gem for more haste. Most of my enchants/ gems I'm using are just ones I had the highest rank for and cheapest to make so my necklace is probably enchanted wrong.


i probably specced for mostly single target and think I've been doing fairly poorly for AoE damage compared to other people around my ilvl. Although I know to use multi-shot to refresh beast cleave I probably spam multi-shot more than the 4 secs needed, don't really use dire frenzy effectively, use titan's thunder basically whenever it's off cooldown, don't really know when I'm meant to be using aspect of the wild or whether I should be using beastial wrath in AoE fights. Should I be using murder of crows in AoE fights as well or is it just a waste of focus?


For single target I think I'm doing alright so far (only recently got the legendary boots so not sure how much the kill command cooldown should affect my rotation). Still don't really know when the best time is to be using aspect of the wild but I was basically doing the same as the icy veins guide. My opening sequence is usually something like Murder of crows, beastial wrath, titans thunder, then just kill command, cobra shot, kill command cobra shot etc.


Looking at icy veins guide I think I'm meant to be doing murder of the crows, beastial wrath, dire frenzy, titans thunder, then another dire frenzy straight away, aspect of the wild then normal rotation. After that it's just kill command/cobra shot I guess. While beastiality wrath is in effect should I only be spamming kill command/cobra shot for the quick cooldowns or should I still be using dire frenzy during this time? I use titan thunder when it's off cooldown and dire frenzy whenever it has 2 stacks. I usually just used murder of the crows when it was off cooldown but the guide seems to indicate that I should wait the extra 30 seconds and time it with my next bestial wrath. As for aspect of the wild I usually forget I even have this move and don't use it effectively, do I wait and combined it with bestial wrath? Wait and use it when I'm low on focus? Or use it as soon as it's off cooldown?


Thanks for listening to my rambling and hopefully thanks for your reply.


P.S. It's probably more of a personally choice or situational choice I guess but should I be talenting myself more for AoE for mythics. Example, one with the pack, volley, aspect of the beast?






Edited by cruizerdog
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41 minutes ago, cruizerdog said:

this is actually taking ages for a moderator to approve. I'll be back in a few days

Approved, sorry about the delay :)

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Hello Cruizer. I will do my best to help address your concerns. You have picked DF so i assume that is the build you want to play and will only be addressing it. For the record i play stomp so some of this may be off. You need a ton of mastery for DF build. the more the better usually. HOWEVER, you really need to sim yourself to get accurate stat weights as they are very individual. This is as simple as getting the simcraft addon, ingame type  /simc, and past that data into the statweights section of raidbots.com. Im sure there is a sweetspot balance between mastery and haste and constantly simming yourself to get stat weights is the best way to see what stat you are after the most. 

Next you ask about spec and i notice you have dire stable and not way of the cobra. be sure to decide which way you are going to spec. you obviously have the DF/BF but like you have said, other talents are very geared for single or AoE and you must pick accordingly for the sims to work right. use WoTC for single, dire stable for AoE. 

A concept you MUST learn for the DF/BF build to work is how to use your DF. It is probably best to set up a TellMeWhen or weakaura for help. This is key to your damage both single target and AoE. What this buff does is make your pet attack fast. you want it going as fast as possible (multi stacks) for as long as possible (maintaining at least 1 stack).

For best AoE (aside from talent changes) , here are some tricks. Use multi to maintain Bestial Cleave. If there are ton of adds  or you are near capped on focus, you can use and extra one or two, but you dont want to cast so many that you cannot KC on CD. Titans thunder you are just going to use on CD, not issues there. Aspect of the wild does cleave and will do more damage when hasted with BF and buffed with BW. ideally for high burst AoE you want to maintain cleave via multi shot, have your pet at 2-3 stacks of BF, and us BW and AotW. If you are AoEing almost the whole fight, it may be better to take Volley. However, if you can time your crows well so that the add it is on dies just in time to reset the CD so you can maintain high uptimes on crows, it can be played just as well. 

Boots are good but do mess with the rotation a little. The best time to use AotW is when you will be able to keep DF up at 2-3 stacks and BW is off CD so it can be combined. For your opener, follow the icyveins guide.

After your opener, other than watching your Crows, BW, AotW, Titans thunder CDs, your goals should be maintaining your DF and KC on CD, you only really Cobra(outside of BW) when you are near focus capped. During BW your base rotation is spamming KC CS KC CS while maintaining DF. obviously stack in AotW when you can. As far as i know, TT is not effected by haste so you use it regardless of how many DF stacks you have BUT it does get buffed by BW so try to overlap it with that. AMoC- i dont think i would wait 30 seconds to use it with BW; maybe 5 seconds. AotW- Use on CD, preferably with BW and high DF stacks. when you see that Wild is about to be available, sit on your DF a little more so that you dont have to delay. cast a DF, wait until it has less than 4.5 seconds cast second stack, pop BW and Wild, the KC CS spam until DF has 4.5s or less left and DF again. 

Happy to help. In order to make the most dps out of the DF build you must master the DF buff (stacks and uptime).

Specing for AoE or single target is very much situational based. Obviously a more AoE build can be used to produce better numbers if you are doing trash heavy Mythic+ or a raid boss where you are on add duty like Tichondrius. Single target buildss are better for most raid bosses though. 

Let me know if you have any questions.


Sidenote: Because you have highish crit and are new to BM, you may want to consider the stomp build. youll need just a little more crit but it is incredibly fun, removes having to manage DF stacks, removes having to line up AotW with high DF stacks, and has some built in AoE. It may make BM hunter more enjoyable if you are getting frustrated with or having trouble getting the most out of the DF build. 



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Hmmmm, too much rant... there's too many details to adress.


Let's start with legendaries. Because you have everything mumbled up. You're wearing the legendary boots and belt. The belt is good all-around so no issue there, but the boots are a legendary that vastly affects how you run your rotation, which talents you take, and stat weights. So you might not even want to use them, but let me explain first.

Qa'pla build requires high crit above all else. You talent Way of the Cobra, Stomp, One With the Pack and Aspect of the Beast. This makes WIld Call proc more so more Dire Beasts leading to more Kill Command reduction. It completely overshadows Killer Cobra if you have high enough crit like me (I'm at 49%).

So if you want to use Dire Frenzy and Bestial Fury with high Mastery, you should drop Qa'pla.


Gear: You have no tier, so get that. You have empty sockets, and 150 enchants instead of 200 enchants. I don't want to be mean but fix your stuff before asking for advice. You shouldn't even be simming anything before grabbing gems and proper enchants.


Always use Murder of Crows, Aspect of the Wild and Titan's Thunder during Bestial Wrath. There is no exception. Since you're using Bestial Fury, your Bestial Wrath is particularly strong, so more the reason to couple the cooldowns together.


You say you're doing alright for single target, but I can't take your word for it, give me numbers. At 917 ilvl a good parse is over a million dps. But since you have no tier I would be surprised if you do over 850k.


With your stats for mythic+ I recommend using Dire Frenzy, Blink Strikes, Volley and Dire Stable. Blink Strikes doubles the power of Beast Cleave, so it's particularly strong when hitting more than 3 targets.

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cheers for replies khallid and sisco


i'm in a hurry atm and won't be back for 2 days now so just skimming it. yeah i just started gearing for new patch etc so didn't have tier. my enchants/gems were just spares that i had. i gemmed gear about 15/20 hours ago but armory doesnt seem to want to update it. just ran through all ToS LFR and up to maiden on normal with a bunch of seals so i got 2 pieces of tier now so have lost more mastery.  


only just recently got boots, wasn't sure how they go but i figured 2 legendaries are better than 1 for now so i equipped them. i've tried prioritizing mastery as i started out playing with dire frenzy but from what you are saying the boots are more for a crit build. i seem to just be getting more and more crit gear so i can test out stomp and see which is better to play.


as for dps numbers i know i'm not doing the best and properly relying on ilvl just is why i wanted to get my rotation down better. I hadn't been using an runes, potions and food etc as i havent built up a stockpile of money and mats yet (hoping for new rep rune soon) but i was about 750k/800k. 


i'll start looking into stuff like simcraft, raidbots. theres a bunch of guides out there but everything still just looks like a bunch of random graphs and numbers :P 


haven't really got a solid dps average yet considering last weeks tombs run i was doing about 500k dps

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and yeah boots were really an adjustment with the quick kill command cooldown. dunno who much it was affecting my dps with or without them but i was running out of focus every now and then to keep up with the kill command cooldown


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