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Cowabunga

WW monk - beginner questions

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Hi, Thanks very much for the guide and useful info to get folks started.  Having read through it I have a few questions about turning the priority queue into a practical ability sequence (I won't say rotation) particularly at the opening of a fight.  I'm assuming Hit Combo, Power Strikes and Whiring Dragon Punch (WDP) and a purely single target fight, starting with 100 energy and 0 Chi (and no meaningful legendaries).

Leaving aside Touch of Death (ToD) and Storm, Earth and Fire (SEF) for the moment and based on the need to generate chi and maintain hit combo the sequence looks like: 1) TP (2 Chi), 2) RSK (0 Chi), 3) TP (2 Chi), 4) BK (1 Chi), 5) TP (3 Chi), 6) FoF (0 Chi), 7) TP (2 Chi), 8) SotW (0 Chi), 9) WDP (0 Chi) (Chi in brackets being the # available after the preceding ability is cast).

1) Is this right?  Leaving high priority abilities like SotW and WDP to step 8/9 feels a little slow

2) Is it better to take Energising elixir, chug it on the pull (which wastes the energy regen component completely) and open hard with 1) RSK (3 Chi), 2) FoF (0 Chi), 3) TP (2 Chi), 4) SotW (0 Chi), 5) WDP (0 Chi)?  Or does this lead to a net dps loss by wasting 50% of energising elixir's worth in return for a faster but ultimately weaker opener

3) Somewhat embarrassing question but what is the GCD for ww monks and is this affected by haste at all (or does haste purely affect energy regen and attack speed (auto attacks))?  I'm wondering if we are ever in the position where, looking at the 9 steps in the second para above, RSK is cast at step 2 but is available again at step 8/9 due to the number of GCDs and the 4 sec channel of FoF in between so we would fit a second RSK and another TP in before or between SotW & WDP (which would become steps 8 or 10 (SotW) and 11 (WDP) respectively).

4) Does the 24 CD on FoF start when the ability is pressed or when the channel completes / is interrupted and is the channel time decreased by haste?

5) ToD is not listed in the ST priority queue - i assume it is #1 (allowing for target living > 8 seconds) but does it fall behind any of the major abilities?

Working in ToD (use on CD) and SEF (use before major abilities) it looks like: 1) ToD (0 Chi), 2) TP (2 Chi), 3) SEF (2 Chi), 4) RSK (0 Chi), 5) TP (2 Chi), 6) BK (1 Chi), 7) TP (3 Chi), 8) FoF (0 Chi), 9) TP (2 Chi), 10) SotW (0 Chi), 11) WDP (0 Chi)

Any insights on this (and how badly wrong I got it) would be appreciated!

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On 29/01/2018 at 4:54 PM, Cowabunga said:

1) Is this right?  Leaving high priority abilities like SotW and WDP to step 8/9 feels a little slow

So, EE is technically the better choice for DPS output. Your opener while using WDP and EE should look like this:

  1. Tiger Palm
  2. Touch of Death
  3. Storm, Earth, Fire
  4. Rising Sun Kick
  5. Energising Elixir
  6. Fists of Fury
  7. Strike of the Windlord
  8. Tiger Palm
  9. Whirling Dragon Punch
  10. Continue ST rotation
On 29/01/2018 at 4:54 PM, Cowabunga said:

3) Somewhat embarrassing question but what is the GCD for ww monks and is this affected by haste at all (or does haste purely affect energy regen and attack speed (auto attacks))?  I'm wondering if we are ever in the position where, looking at the 9 steps in the second para above, RSK is cast at step 2 but is available again at step 8/9 due to the number of GCDs and the 4 sec channel of FoF in between so we would fit a second RSK and another TP in before or between SotW & WDP (which would become steps 8 or 10 (SotW) and 11 (WDP) respectively).

Monks have a 1 second GCD, similar to other agility melee DPS. It's unaffected by Haste, but cooldowns of abilities are. Problem is, Haste is still terrible for WW. As for the rest of your question, yeah, RSK is cast early so it's up again ASAP. See above for the ideal opener use.

On 29/01/2018 at 4:54 PM, Cowabunga said:

4) Does the 24 CD on FoF start when the ability is pressed or when the channel completes / is interrupted and is the channel time decreased by haste?

When you press it and yes, Haste does affect it, but you need massive amounts to make any real difference.

On 29/01/2018 at 4:54 PM, Cowabunga said:

5) ToD is not listed in the ST priority queue - i assume it is #1 (allowing for target living > 8 seconds) but does it fall behind any of the major abilities?

It's your top priority on ST and AoE in the normal rotation.

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3 hours ago, Blainie said:

So, EE is technically the better choice for DPS output. Your opener while using WDP and EE should look like this:

  1. Tiger Palm
  2. Touch of Death
  3. Storm, Earth, Fire
  4. Rising Sun Kick
  5. Energising Elixir
  6. Fists of Fury
  7. Strike of the Windlord
  8. Tiger Palm
  9. Whirling Dragon Punch
  10. Continue ST rotation

Monks have a 1 second GCD, similar to other agility melee DPS. It's unaffected by Haste, but cooldowns of abilities are. Problem is, Haste is still terrible for WW. As for the rest of your question, yeah, RSK is cast early so it's up again ASAP. See above for the ideal opener use.

When you press it and yes, Haste does affect it, but you need massive amounts to make any real difference.

It's your top priority on ST and AoE in the normal rotation.

Thanks, that's very helpful.

I played around with EE but I never found I could use both the chi and energy refills effectively - either I delayed using it while I attempted (rather unsuccessfully) to deplete both resources or I used it to replenish chi and wasted a lot of the energy refill.  Looking at your opener, where you are >50 energy when you use it, is it best to view it as a chi replenisher with any energy refill a nice bonus?

It's maybe a bit late in the expac with BfA pre-order up but an opener section covering what you have shown and explaining the use of EE and SEF to buff as many abilities as possible would have been a nice addition, particularly as novices need to track both chi and energy and, assuming hit combo and WDP, follow a quite strict ability sequence to avoid capping resources, delaying abilities or losing the buff.  It's all there in the guide separately but I found I had to (inexpertly) write down a practical sequence to imagine what it looked like. 

It might also help to include the GCD (as this varies between expacs and sometimes between classes iirc), and clarify the impact of haste on ability cds (some or all?) because of any practical impact on the cast sequence.  This is all stuff that the reader might be expected to know or understand but I found myself wondering, which is kind of the acid test for dummies.  Apologies if any of this was covered and I managed to overlook it!

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4 hours ago, Cowabunga said:

Thanks, that's very helpful.

I played around with EE but I never found I could use both the chi and energy refills effectively - either I delayed using it while I attempted (rather unsuccessfully) to deplete both resources or I used it to replenish chi and wasted a lot of the energy refill.  Looking at your opener, where you are >50 energy when you use it, is it best to view it as a chi replenisher with any energy refill a nice bonus?

Pretty much. The Chi portion is the most important. While it's always best to use it at low energy when you can, there are times when using it to just get the Chi replenishment is better, since it gets the cooldown rolling sooner, meaning more uses in a fight.

I'll ask for some additions to be made to the guide to clarify some of the stuff you asked.

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18 hours ago, Blainie said:

Pretty much. The Chi portion is the most important. While it's always best to use it at low energy when you can, there are times when using it to just get the Chi replenishment is better, since it gets the cooldown rolling sooner, meaning more uses in a fight.

I'll ask for some additions to be made to the guide to clarify some of the stuff you asked.

Thanks again.  Knowledge Is Power :P

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4 hours ago, Cowabunga said:

Thanks again.  Knowledge Is Power :P

Exactly! Monks are just punching stuff randomly! They need to know what to punch and how!

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On 2/1/2018 at 11:04 AM, Blainie said:

Exactly! Monks are just punching stuff randomly! They need to know what to punch 

Everything

On 2/1/2018 at 11:04 AM, Blainie said:

and how!

Repeatedly

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7 hours ago, MrEdren said:

Everything

Repeatedly

Keep in mind the dates of the last post on a thread, while this isn't necessarily a long-dead thread, the last post was nearly 2 months ago.

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18 hours ago, Orthios said:

Keep in mind the dates of the last post on a thread, while this isn't necessarily a long-dead thread, the last post was nearly 2 months ago.

Think I've had enough of the IV moderation staff.  How do I pull the plug on my account?

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17 hours ago, MrEdren said:

Think I've had enough of the IV moderation staff.  How do I pull the plug on my account?

I'm not sure I understand - because of Orthios saying not to comment on an older thread? You're welcome to PM me if you feel you've been mistreated by our staff in the past and we can discuss.

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