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BfA Class Feedback, May 8: Rogue and DK

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As the beta marches on Blizzard get more and more class feedback and every once in a while reply to some relevant points made by players. Today we get blue comments on Subtlety Rogue class fantasy, its snares and getting Symbols of Death back off the GCD, as well as a new Valkyr appearance for Summon Gargoyle, Corpse Explosion getting removed, a few talent changes and more for Unholy DKs (and, in case you missed it, here are some earlier comments on the spec).

Blizzard LogoSubtlety Rogue (source)

    Posted by Nahj
--- Using symbols of death and shadow blades before a dance feels really clunky investing 2 globals and neither of symbols or shadow blades scream iconic/exciting. Could maybe just combine both of them into 1 major offensive CD.

We took Symbols of DeathSymbols of Death off the GCD. It's a button designed to very often be used during Shadow DanceShadow Dance's short window, and adding it to the GCD removed that interaction almost entirely.

    Posted by Nahj
    Utility vs class fantasy:
--- The whole Assassination =poison, sub = shadow fantasy, outlaw/combat = more toe to toe fantasy really makes all 3 specs feel incomplete and not well rounded. There should be a fine line between strengths and weaknesses, but most other classes don't have this missing backbone ultimatum.

It's all about having balance between fantasy and function. Class fantasy is important, and specs and classes having more distinct fantasies is in general a positive thing. That said, that shouldn't necessarily mean removing (without replacing) desired, necessary, and appropriate functionality from a spec for the sake of fantasy uniqueness. For example, early Legion class design toed the line on this a bit more, and tried things like only giving Hunter traps to one spec, and that change was later reverted.

To your point, Subtlety's snare capabilities becoming more convoluted in Legion with Crippling PoisonCrippling Poison going to Assassination-only wasn't exactly the functional intention of that change, but it was a byproduct. A fair complaint is that Subtlety's only baseline snare comes from a finishing move and the spec has no AOE snare.

    Posted by Nahj
For, Sub could have the old talented waylay slow on Backstab / Shadowstrike and have Nightblade be our mortal strike effect.

Largely due to continued good feedback like this post, we re-opened the discussion of Subtlety's snare kit, which we haven't been happy with either. We're going to make the following changes:


Overall, thanks for the great feedback.

 

Blizzard LogoUnholy Death Knight (source)

    Posted by Seph
Maybe option for a glyph to come in here, Glyph of the Val'kyr: Your Gargoyle takes the form of a Val'kyr/Dark Arbiter. Keep abilities the same but the aesthetics changes.

We're adding a dialog option at a class trainer in Ebon Hold to change your Summon GargoyleSummon Gargoyle talent to take on the appearance of a Val'kyr. No functional changes.

    Posted by Maxweii
It's certainly possible to line up the explosions, but it does require a good sense of your groups damage, add spawns of a fight and positioning of the ghouls. A bit finicky, and overly complicated at times especially as people become more geared.

Corpse ExplosionCorpse Explosion was a really cool fantasy that we wanted to try as a talent, but had various mechanical problem as many have pointed out. It's being replaced in an upcoming build.

    Posted by Maxweii
All Will Serve really needs something done to it. The common suggestion of a lot of players is to have it scale with Mastery by doing Shadow damage, but with the rewording/reworking of the Mastery this might be unable to be done?

This talent slot is being worked on. Agree All Will ServeAll Will Serve is currently pretty lackluster.

    Posted by Leviatharan
Knocking 2 minutes off the cooldown of Army really isn't significant, since we will still only be able to cast the ability once per encounter - and with its high cost and deployment time, that time will continue to be "before the fighting starts."

New talent reduces the cooldown of Army of the DeadArmy of the Dead by 5 sec (and Apoc by 1 sec) on Death CoilDeath Coil casts. Currently cuts the cooldown of Army by about half during sustained combat. Generally gives a much greater feeling of having an army of the damned.

    Posted by Adlian
    [Debilitating Infestation] is another talent that i never picked during the whole expansion.

Going to try replacing this in the tree with a talent we like better, which we added to Blood recently. Grip of the Dead: Death and Decay reduces the movement speed of enemies in the area by 90%, decaying by 10% every sec. (pending further tuning) Brings a uniquely powerful initial snare, which quickly decays in strength. Remains to be seen how the magnitude plays out.

    Posted by Malchior
Resource generation needs to be looked at. Even when running IC/PP theres times where I am sitting on my hands doing nothing for up to 5secs. The proc rate for wounds from IC also needs to be upped as we no longer generate energy for the Ghoul with DC so overall Claw usage is down over legion.

We'll be continuing to tune resources, including Runic CorruptionRunic Corruption chance as needed. Worth noting is we just added some proc normalization to Runic CorruptionRunic Corruption - generally not a bad idea to rein in periods of resource droughts and floods.

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All right guys, usually I don't really comment on these kind of posts and all, but I'm so excited for the Dk changes !!!! Getting back Val'kyr, summning multiples armys in a fight, better ressource generation, getting rid of corpse explosion and reworking archer????? Really looking forwards to all that =)

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8 hours ago, Hokdhan said:

All right guys, usually I don't really comment on these kind of posts and all, but I'm so excited for the Dk changes !!!! Getting back Val'kyr, summning multiples armys in a fight, better ressource generation, getting rid of corpse explosion and reworking archer????? Really looking forwards to all that =)

Seems like they're finally getting a nice overhaul to fix some of the clunky mechanics!

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I wonder what Blizz will do about runic power (not up to date about the changes)... right now spamming Deathcoil feels really boring without it having any interaction with other resources or mechanics.

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On 08/05/2018 at 10:11 PM, Pauly02 said:

I wonder what Blizz will do about runic power (not up to date about the changes)... right now spamming Deathcoil feels really boring without it having any interaction with other resources or mechanics.

They could follow in a similar vein to Frost and make it have a chance to give a free cast of something else, but that kind of destroys any sort of wounds mechanic.

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