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Starym

Class Tuning (Buffs) for October 2nd

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There's more class tuning coming next week, as Unholy DKs, Feral Druids, Fire Mages, Shadow Priests, Ele and Enh Shamans and Demo Warlocks get some flat % as well as a few skill-specific buffs. It's tricky to decide who got the most out of it, but Shamans at least got 2 specs buffed.

Blizzard LogoOctober 2 (source)

We're working on some targeted spec tuning, which will go live with maintenance in each region starting on October 2. Here's where we currently are with that:
 

As always, we'll have final values for you in a public hotfixes update when the changes go live next week.
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Most of these damage buffs, while welcome, aren't going to help those specs. A lot of the specs on the list (Fire Mage, Shadow Priest, Elemental Shaman) are simply broken in BFA due to the lack of secondary stats (which let's face it just walled papered over the issues they had in Legion) and/or removal of abilities from the artefact weapon.

They aren't Demo Lock, which is a fun engaging spec, that just lack raw output, they are instead clunky and unfun. I say this as someone who desperately wants to play Fire again as I loved it in Legion, but we lost so much with our weapon and the secondary stats just aren't there to make up for it, even if you stack everything, to make it fun again.

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2 hours ago, tkioz said:

Most of these damage buffs, while welcome, aren't going to help those specs. A lot of the specs on the list (Fire Mage, Shadow Priest, Elemental Shaman) are simply broken in BFA due to the lack of secondary stats (which let's face it just walled papered over the issues they had in Legion) and/or removal of abilities from the artefact weapon.

They aren't Demo Lock, which is a fun engaging spec, that just lack raw output, they are instead clunky and unfun. I say this as someone who desperately wants to play Fire again as I loved it in Legion, but we lost so much with our weapon and the secondary stats just aren't there to make up for it, even if you stack everything, to make it fun again.

There was a fire mage on Limit's G'huun kill. What are you even saying?

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1 hour ago, Prophet001 said:

There was a fire mage on Limit's G'huun kill. What are you even saying?

Yea, but that's Limit. How many fire mages do you see that is very well equipped as Limit's Fire Mage? I'm not trying to argue. But he is not wrong, Fire and many other specs are suffering majorly.

Honestly, I am just glad Demo is getting the buffs it deserves. 

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1 hour ago, Prophet001 said:

There was a fire mage on Limit's G'huun kill. What are you even saying?

What the hell does that have to do with what he said,    hes not saying they don't do damage,   hes saying They arnt fun to play anymore.    You can give them a 100% buff to all ability damage, it wont change the fact that the specs are fundamentally broken,  Fire mages are about stringing together long chains of critical strikes,  And Shadow is about every increasing haste and being more and more hectic.    Wether or not Method has one on the team, doesn't answer if its fun or not

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2 hours ago, Prophet001 said:

There was a fire mage on Limit's G'huun kill. What are you even saying?

Just because there are people that can make a broken spec work at the very top end of the game doesn't make the spec any less broken or unfun to play compared to Legion. Limit was also running a Resto Shaman for some of their world firsts in Uldir and even Blizzard admit that spec is the weakest of the healers and needs work.

The raw numbers don't personally matter to me so long as the difference between the top and bottom isn't too large, what does matter is how fun it is to play, and right now playing Fire feels terrible.

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I think this is new territory for them as well as for us. Any changes are going to be small initially, I guess they'll want to see how the proposed changes affect overall balance before trying anything else.

 

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2 hours ago, tkioz said:

 

The raw numbers don't personally matter to me so long as the difference between the top and bottom isn't too large, what does matter is how fun it is to play, and right now playing Fire feels terrible.

I was going to lvl my mage next and I always liked blowing stuff up 🙂 when you say feels terrible - is it a lack of crit and therefore just not enough Heating Ups? Which would translate into fireball spam... that would indeed be awful...

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7 hours ago, Prophet001 said:

There was a fire mage on Limit's G'huun kill. What are you even saying?

He played fire cause of his mobility if i remember right.

 

Currently with the stacked uldir buff im at ~45% crit, with buffs up in fight im able to reach ~53% crit (overall my pyro had a crit rate of ~60% and my fireball >50% in uldir).  At the beginning of the addon fire wasnt really fun to play cause the lack of crit really hits hard, while i gain more and more crit now i finally have fun playing my mage again seeing those sweet crit chains. I appreciate that 5% dmg increase.

 

Edited by ResoWho

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2 hours ago, Pregrowth said:

buffing feral, do they even play the game?

I've just started WoW, was Frost mage, but eventually decided for Feral and I do enjoy it, as well as all 7 others I saw 😛 

We might be stubborn, but isn't it about playing for fun? 

 

EDIT: just realized your post can be taken other way, are you saying Ferals are good after recent buff or if Ferals even exist in game? 

Edited by Xhopeon

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5 hours ago, Evincare said:

I was going to lvl my mage next and I always liked blowing stuff up 🙂 when you say feels terrible - is it a lack of crit and therefore just not enough Heating Ups? Which would translate into fireball spam... that would indeed be awful...

Pretty much, you can either stack haste and get your fireballs down to a smooth rotation, or you stack crit to get enough heating up procs to actually do damage, but not both, and even then you're lacking a few tools and passives that made things a lot more interesting.

Throw in the GCD changes, the lack of Phoenix Flames (same row as Flame On... Really Blizzard? Really?), and some other stuff it's just not fun. Even hitting an enemy in the face with an empowered Pryoblast doesn't feel fun, hell you can do that more often with Frost and Glacial Spike anyway.

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16 hours ago, Starym said:

Druid

  • Feral
    • All damage increased by 4%.

This is, what, the sixth time they’ve done this? The spec has had about a 30% increase in damage from all these hotfixes so far and it’s still bad. How did the spec make it to live when even such huge % buffs aren’t making it viable?

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6 hours ago, Brutalis said:

This is, what, the sixth time they’ve done this? The spec has had about a 30% increase in damage from all these hotfixes so far and it’s still bad. How did the spec make it to live when even such huge % buffs aren’t making it viable?

bad, when, how? have you played arena? lul

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20 hours ago, Prophet001 said:

There was a fire mage on Limit's G'huun kill. What are you even saying?

Should probably see how the G'huun encounter is done before saying stuff like this trying to invalidate someone's legitimate post...

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5 hours ago, Pregrowth said:

bad, when, how? have you played arena? lul

I've recently leveled up a feral druid after playing my other two characters, a Tank warrior and an Elemental Shaman (Cries in weak classes) .

What I could see, the problem of feral druids is in PVE. The reason, I think, it's that it's too reliable on crits to make it work and with a 20% crit chance it's almost impossible to make it work. Without any crits having to spend: 

Rake - 35 energy
Moonfire - 30 energy
Thrash - 40 energy
Shred - 40 energy
Shred - 40 energy
Savage Roar - 30 energy

Total: 215 energy to ramp up.

Just to start our actual DPS on a boss is insanely bad as you still have to waste energy to maintain those debuffs and if you're out of luck, you can barely maintain Rip + Savage Roar if you count energy regeneration + gcd. If you don't want to go with savage roar for single target, too bad, the alternative is to go full Ferocious bite which is the biggest energy spender for feral.

 

Just to be clear, I'm not whining about this but only showing what the complain is probably about. 

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12 hours ago, Pregrowth said:

bad, when, how? have you played arena? lul

Bad. Now. In every aspect of PvE. It’s a real shame they cannot balance the two endgame paths against one another, honour talents were meant to enable seperate balancing, but as it stands even if the spec is decent in PvP (which even then is debateable because their niche off-heals got nerfed to the ground) Feral is doing terribly in PvE and is in dire need of attention - which is why they are constantly buffing it’s numbers even when it’s clearly not enough.

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1 hour ago, Brutalis said:

Bad. Now. In every aspect of PvE. 

Now, I'm gonna be completely honest, I haven't played feral since raids opened (my guild has too many melees already) but strictly going by sims, my feral is neck and neck with my balance, and that is without the upcoming 4%. Also, looking at the few feral logs that are out here, in terms of DPS, the spec delivers. It is far from non-viable.

The true issue lies in that it's still awkward to play, due to overreliance on RNG with crits and freecasts, as well as Bloodtalons being mandatory but very punishing when not played correctly.

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On 9/29/2018 at 5:03 AM, Evincare said:

I was going to lvl my mage next and I always liked blowing stuff up 🙂 when you say feels terrible - is it a lack of crit and therefore just not enough Heating Ups? Which would translate into fireball spam... that would indeed be awful...

I love it personally.

It's the same as it was in Legion. I personally liked WoD fire where you built up huge ignites then combusted but that play style is gone.

One random person saying they don't "feel" like fire is "fun" is about the last thing you should listen to. Try it and if you like it then it's fun and if you don't then you don't but don't let other people drive you around and make that decision for you.

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On 9/29/2018 at 6:10 AM, Prophet001 said:

There was a fire mage on Limit's G'huun kill. What are you even saying?

Look if you don't know why they had one don't make uninformed comments like that.
Method also had a fire mage, but not for the overall dmg.

The real dps race on G'huun starts after 30%. As a fire mage you have an execute ability Scorch (if talented). Se the logic in having a fire mage now? Not to mention BL. Since no shaman spec was up to the task it was the best tactic for them at that time.

Edited by Giftless
typo

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On 9/28/2018 at 8:35 PM, tkioz said:

Most of these damage buffs, while welcome, aren't going to help those specs. A lot of the specs on the list (Fire Mage, Shadow Priest, Elemental Shaman) are simply broken in BFA due to the lack of secondary stats (which let's face it just walled papered over the issues they had in Legion) and/or removal of abilities from the artefact weapon.

They aren't Demo Lock, which is a fun engaging spec, that just lack raw output, they are instead clunky and unfun. I say this as someone who desperately wants to play Fire again as I loved it in Legion, but we lost so much with our weapon and the secondary stats just aren't there to make up for it, even if you stack everything, to make it fun again.

This is about the dumbest comment about Fire Mages that I have seen since the start of BFA - 358 Fire Mage here and even without this incoming damage buff, have been in the top 3-5 in dps on most Uldir Heroic bosses.  This persons comments are a prime example of people that make wild statements with ZERO experience.  Intellect - Mastery - Versatility are the top three stats for a fire mage - then haste-crit.  So, my question to this person - Since you know so much - What number is a Fire Mage suppose to have?  What is a good number Mr. Expert?  Secondly, I've taken out several Frost Mages in our charts, while using all of my movement skills to soak during Vectis, or run the ball in G'hunn.

Edited by Kozzie

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1 hour ago, Giftless said:

Look if you don't know why they had one don't make uninformed comments like that.
Method also had a fire mage, but not for the overall dmg.

The real dps race on G'huun starts after 30%. As a fire mage you have an execute ability Scorch (if talented). Se the logic in having a fire mage now? Not to mention BL. Since no shaman spec was up to the task it was the best tactic for them at that time.

I know that.

What's the point you're trying to make. They had arms stacked too for the same reason.

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1 hour ago, Prophet001 said:

I love it personally.

It's the same as it was in Legion. I personally liked WoD fire where you built up huge ignites then combusted but that play style is gone.

One random person saying they don't "feel" like fire is "fun" is about the last thing you should listen to. Try it and if you like it then it's fun and if you don't then you don't but don't let other people drive you around and make that decision for you.

I'm thinking ol' Tkioz tried playing a Fire Mage and failed or didn't understand it and couldn't keep up with the demands of the rotation.  Probably a 1-2 button masher.

Edited by Kozzie

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      Classes
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      Worldvein Resonance Major rank 1, when used, now additionally causes you to gain +50% bonus to stats from Lifeblood Shards for 10 seconds. Vision of Perfection Proc rate increased by 12%. Unbound Force Major rank 1 damage increased by 40%. Minor rank 1 duration increased to 4 seconds (was 3 seconds). Minor rank 3 increase of duration increased to 2 seconds (was 1 second). Purification Protocol Major rank 1 damage increased by 15%. Major rank 2 now has the potential work on targets that are part of raid and dungeon encounters. Vitality Conduit We’ve rebuilt the way this Essences works, and it should be visually more impactful, as you will now see healing on your targets. As always, changes like these are a work in progress. We are likely to make further adjustments for testing throughout the PTR.
      Thank you very much for your testing and feedback!
    • By Stan
      Patch 8.3 comes with a new Essence which allows you to borrow the currently slotted Essence of your target, even if it's not available to your current role. It doesn't work with passive Essences and requires coordination to ensure the cooldown incurred doesn’t interfere with whatever you're doing next.
      The Essence can be obtained from Ny'alotha, the Waking City. Blizzard explained how the targeting works and shared more information about the Essence. The Formless Void is a general Essence, meaning it's available to all specializations. Tanks, for instance, will be able to borrow Healer Essences, and so on.
      The Formless Void
      Rank 1
      Major Power: Replica of Knowledge - Replicate the energy in your target's Heart of Azeroth, gaining access to rank 1 of their currently slotted Major Essence for the next 15 sec. The Formless Void will go on cooldown for 50% longer than the base cooldown of the Essence you replicated. Does not work on passive Essences. Minor Power: Symbiotic Presence - Each time any ally within 40 yds uses an Azerite Essence, gain 89 pri for 20 sec. Unique: Corruption reduced by 10. Rank 2
      Major Power: Replica of Knowledge - Replica of Knowledge can now copy up to rank 2 of your target's current Major Essence, and the increased cooldown is lowered by 10%. Minor Power: Symbiotic Presence - pri bonus increased by 25%. Rank 3
      Major Power: Replica of Knowledge - Replica of Knowledge can now copy up to rank 3 of your target's current Major Essence, and the increased cooldown is lowered by 10%. Minor Power: Symbiotic Presence - When an ally within 40 yds uses an Azerite Essence, you and that ally gain 0 Haste for 20 sec. Check out our Patch 8.3 Content Hub to learn more about Visions of N'Zoth.
      Blizzard (Source)
      So, I guess the question is, what type of scenarios might unfold that would be appropriate for this essence?
      What would you consider the use case for it, and how will you react when its obviously either too strong or too weak for that use case?
      The Formless Void mostly exists for the purposes of flexibility, which is why all roles can use it. It requires a lot of planning, it requires you to coordinate and know who you plan on borrowing what Essence from, and for what situation, and make sure that the cooldown incurred doesn’t interfere with whatever the next situation you have to manage is.
      As a note, you can also borrow something from a player of the enemy faction. The targeting is very unrestricted other than the obvious - it has to be a player, they need to have an Essence currently slotted that is valid to copy (fully passives Major Essences are ineligible).
      Does the “Formless Void” essence require the correct role to copy an essence. For example, could you copy the tank Azshara raid essence as a dps to gain access to a defensive cooldown for a particularly nasty damage taken check, or could you copy a dps essence as a tank or a healer in order to push a particularly challenging dps check.
      You can borrow any eligible Essence, even if it is not normally available to your current role. For example, a Protection Paladin player can borrow a healer specific thing such as the new Spirit of Preservation, or a DPS specific thing such as Essence of the Focusing Iris.
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