6.1 Demonology Guide

[Liarparadox 5]

I tried out mythic DUT trinket last night, seemed fine. But wondering about best actions to take when it procs. Is there anything in particular I should be doing? It's a haste proc so maybe not a whole lot to do other than enjoy the quicker shadow bolts/SFs.

 

One thought I had was this: if i'm in meta just burning off fury with Touch of Chaos and it procs, then get back into caster form and spam SB for proc then pop back in meta and keep burning. Any issue with doing this to take advantage of the haste since TC spam while it procs seems like a horrible waste for GCDs?

[Liquidsteel 279]

I tried out mythic DUT trinket last night, seemed fine. But wondering about best actions to take when it procs. Is there anything in particular I should be doing? It's a haste proc so maybe not a whole lot to do other than enjoy the quicker shadow bolts/SFs.

 

One thought I had was this: if i'm in meta just burning off fury with Touch of Chaos and it procs, then get back into caster form and spam SB for proc then pop back in meta and keep burning. Any issue with doing this to take advantage of the haste since TC spam while it procs seems like a horrible waste for GCDs?

The Haste proc is to be used as a Fury generator. Sure, if it procs during a DS dump it helps you burn through your MC stacks quicker, but overall it's main purpose is to increase Fury generation. It's nice if it procs during a HoG stack, too.

 

I did want to address one thing you said though, Liar. 

 

" if i'm in meta just burning off fury with Touch of Chaos and it procs, then get back into caster form and spam SB for proc then pop back in meta and keep burning"

 

In what scenarios do you find yourself doing large Fury dumps with ToC?

 

Between Dark Soul, Archmage's and GSR there's usually plenty of opportunity to dump Soul Fires in Meta. I'm concerned you're wasting MC stacks in caster and ignoring procs during the conserve phase, leading to you reaching max fury with nothing and needing to burn. You should know that if you have 500 Fury and 5 MC stacks with a minute left on Dark Soul that it's fine to hop into Meta when your GSR or Ring proc is active and dump a few Soul Fires.

 

I never find myself do big ToC burns and it should be avoided where possible through careful planning.

[Liarparadox 5]

I always pop into meta and burn off MC procs during GSR, and when DS/Serv is up of course. I didn't know that about the extra use of DS at 1 min with procs, which makes perfect sense to me. But perhaps where I am going wrong is I'm not confident about the exact proc conditions under which to burn off the rest of MCs and TC. I'd love as detailed of a list as possible with procs/combo of procs and what to do. I switched to DUT, but still curious about what to do with BMC.

GSR procs. What do I do? Meta: MC burns

Ring proc? Meta:TC ? Stay in caster?

BMC? Meta:TC? MC? Stay in caster?

BMC+Ring: Meta: MC or TC? Stay in caster?

DUT? Nothing special Fury generator

DUT+ring?

DUT+ring+weapon?

Weapon proc? stay caster? Meta: TC?

Weapon +ring? Caster? Meta: TC?

Weapon + BMC? Caster? Meta: TC or MC?

So many combos and maybe it’s not fair to ask for such a detailed rule set. My guess is it can be simplified to some degree by making the following type of claims: whenever GSR procs, regardless of combo go into Meta and MC dump. Maybe others can be simplified like that so the combos don't matter so much? But my guess is that some lesser combos will tip the scale from "ignore and stay in caster" to "go into Meta and do x"

I've been leaving MC for DS and GSR (though I admit I burn of high MC procs in caster sometimes because I haven’t been paying attention to DS/Serv and I notice it’s up; I know, that’s horrible!)

But maybe my problem-or rather one of them—is I haven't been popping into Meta enough for quick TC spams when lesser procs happen (or maybe some procs other than GSR/DS call for MC burns).

I've read ring proc isn't good enough to do anything with (though maybe that's a reference to 690 ring), read mixed things about weapon proc as well.

Maybe this will help, here's a Gruul kill log. I don't have 4pc yet, and here I was using BMC. I’ll admit I panic with demo in fights. I’ve played aff/destro since TBC and only this tier switched to demo. So any help is greatly appreciated.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/XcfzBDAgNymxHk3n#fight=4

Armory

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/kelthuzad/Liarparadox/advanced

Liquid, I think you're probably correct that I do too big of TC fury dumps and they should probably be broken up more with lesser procs. Just want to make sure which procs are worth doing that with. I'll have to keep an eye out for my caster mc usage as well.

[Mikedawg 4]

What Demo spec are people using for killing (not padding) Beastlord? Cata? 

[Liarparadox 5]

I think people are usually running serv/serv unless for some reason your group has very weak aoe dmg. I ran in a pug group where it was the adds wiping us; no one was switching to them, at all, so I switched to Cata; but that was awhile ago and I suspect it's pretty rare now to be in a group that doesn't have strong aoe. The adds have such low health cata seems like a waste. (I'm talking about heroic, no clue about mythic)

[Liarparadox 5]

GSR and DUT for Serv / Serv imo.

I meant to follow up this up with another question

1. Am I correct in assuming that GSR/BMC combo is better for cleave/aoe fights with Cata/synergy?

[Liarparadox 5]

GSR procs. What do I do? Meta: MC burns

Ring proc? Meta:TC ? Stay in caster?

BMC? Meta:TC? MC? Stay in caster?

BMC+Ring: Meta: MC or TC? Stay in caster?

DUT? Nothing special Fury generator

DUT+ring?

DUT+ring+weapon?

Weapon proc? stay caster? Meta: TC?

Weapon +ring? Caster? Meta: TC?

Weapon + BMC? Caster? Meta: TC or MC?

I should have added synergy procs in there as well. It seems like such a strong proc that meta is worth popping. But then: TC or MC? TBH I think I love some dps on this, cause for some reason I never set up my weakauras to include synergy.

[Liquidsteel 279]

I meant to follow up this up with another question

1. Am I correct in assuming that GSR/BMC combo is better for cleave/aoe fights with Cata/synergy?

Yes. Ultimately all 3 trinkets are close. The one I consider BiS without question is GSR, after that it isn't really a big deal. I'm going to take GSR + BMC as my preferred set up purely because most fights contain cleave / AoE and I love to use Chaos Wave whenever I can.

 

 

I should have added synergy procs in there as well. It seems like such a strong proc that meta is worth popping. But then: TC or MC? TBH I think I love some dps on this, cause for some reason I never set up my weakauras to include synergy.

Here's my mentality for Single Target (Serv/Serv) Demonology:

 

Burn Phase

• Enter each Dark Soul dump with 800+ Fury and preferably 8+ MC stacks. However 6+ is acceptable.
• I go into Meta with HoG - Corruption - Grimoire: Doomguard - HoG
• Pop DS and spam out all my MC stacks. 
• Chaos Wave is used on ST if say Ring and GSR are fading during DS OR if I have run out of MC procs OR if I'm approaching 3 stacks of HoG
• Chaos Wave again used as Dark Soul is fading

Conserve Phase

• The aim is to conserve Fury and MC stacks as much as possible without capping in order to have as many resources as possible for the next Dark Soul burn phase.
• However, the secondary aim is to be as efficient with my resources as possible. I do NOT want to find myself where I'm at 950 Fury and 9 MC stacks and no procs. This results in having to bleed off resources in Meta akin to casting unbuffed Chaos Bolts. You simply do not want to do it.
• Therefore you need to be proactive in bleeding resources. You can easily build up 800 Fury in ~40 seconds, so if you have a GSR proc 30s before Dark Soul comes back up, you know it's ok to jump into Meta and burn 2-3 Soul Fires + refresh Doom unless this will put you at 0 Fury and 0 MC procs.

Worthy Procs

• Dark Soul is hands down the best.
• GSR and 7+ stacks of BMC are also worth bleeding Fury / MC procs.
• 715 ring is 15% Intellect which is also worth burning on but the above is preferred.
• DUT is for Fury generation.

Therefore if you have a ring proc and Dark Soul is way off then absolutely you should burn resources on it. Jump into Meta, fire off a few Soul Fires then jump out. No need to add extra ToC or anything around it. Procs are frequent enough that you can happily dump in small doses to keep yourself from capping.

 

Finally there is no such thing as "the 1 minute Dark Soul". Ideally you want to use both charges during execute. If the execute phase will only last 20-30 seconds then of course you should plan ahead and move your extra Dark Soul to another part of the fight, however a rule that you use it 1 minute later is not a thing!

[Glorn 1]

@Liquidsteel, big thanks for that post, you literally made clear all the minor things with playing demo that were over my head. Funny part is that I used to play much more in MoP, playing in a serious HC progress guild, and now when I'm playing demo I still have many MoP habits, the one I finally got rid of and makes me giggle now is snapshotting HoG(putting 2nd charge of HoG and entering meta immediately for the increased dmg :D) I used to constantly enter meta before the 2nd HoG lands.

[Soulzar 42]

Good post Liquid.  That is one thing I feel I still need to work on, better bleeding in conserve phase.  

 

With Crit/MS proc trinkets and the Ring... I am finding I just don't have enough MC charges coming in to cast SFs for all of them, and float enough charges for my 2 min burns.  I have more than enough fury, even to the point where I need to bleed outside of those procs... but I am forced to do it with ToC or i'll leave myself dry for 2min cycle.

 

Looking at your Proc Prio list, I can probably help mitigate my troubles by holding back SF a bit more on low stack BMC procs

[Liquidsteel 279]

Substitute SF for CW if necessary. High damage and a guaranteed MC proc.

[Liarparadox 5]

Thanks so much for the post Liquid, huge help! Glad others found it helpful as well.

 

My comment about the 1 minute DS I was referring to what you wrote, "You should know that if you have 500 Fury and 5 MC stacks with a minute left on Dark Soul that it's fine to hop into Meta when your GSR or Ring proc is active".

 

Yep, I misunderstood you there; I don't know why I thought you meant: Pop another DS.

 

 

 

[Liarparadox 5]

 You should know that if you have 500 Fury and 5 MC stacks with a minute left on Dark Soul that it's fine to hop into Meta when your GSR or Ring proc is active and dump a few Soul Fires.

 

I never find myself do big ToC burns and it should be avoided where possible through careful planning.

 

 

Question about this since I find myself sometimes being in an awkward position; and maybe the answer to this is that I shouldn't ever really be in this position in the first place.

 

Suppose I have something like 700 fury, 5 stacks of MC, 30seconds left on DS cd and GSR procs. What's the thing to do here? Go into meta and ToC for GSR? Ignore GSR? If it's ignore, then is there any combo of procs that you wouldn't ignore even though DS is coming up?  Ring/GSR? GSR/BMC? 

 

Sorry I know I keep pressing on this combo proc thing. But I think it's knowing what to do with procs that I struggle  with the most.

[Liquidsteel 279]

Question about this since I find myself sometimes being in an awkward position; and maybe the answer to this is that I shouldn't ever really be in this position in the first place.

 

Suppose I have something like 700 fury, 5 stacks of MC, 30seconds left on DS cd and GSR procs. What's the thing to do here? Go into meta and ToC for GSR? Ignore GSR? If it's ignore, then is there any combo of procs that you wouldn't ignore even though DS is coming up?  Ring/GSR? GSR/BMC? 

 

Sorry I know I keep pressing on this combo proc thing. But I think it's knowing what to do with procs that I struggle  with the most.

700 Fury and 5 stacks of MC sounds like a standard scenario.

 

When GSR procs in this case, my thought process is that I clearly need to burn some Fury or I risk capping, however I'm not exactly overburdened with MC procs.

 

I would hop into Meta and fire off 2, possibly 3 Soul Fires then drop out. You should still be able to fit in a 2 stack HoG before DS comes off cooldown, and when it does you'll be dropping another 2 stack before hopping into Meta ready to burn. This should easily put you back at 5+ charges going into the burn and you should expect at the very least 1 more charge during.

 

You can also utilise Chaos Wave during the burn phase to both hit hard and also generate a guaranteed MC proc, allowing one extra Soul Fire. Depening on 4pc and MC procs you could even do it twice.

[Nytemare 2]

We are working on Heroic Blackhand, and I read and saw locks use Demon leap on the fall. I keep trying to do it and sometimes I nail it (as in I hit the right side). Is there a certain facing I want to always hit the right balcony that the first set of adds will spawn on?

[Drafty53 17]

We are working on Heroic Blackhand, and I read and saw locks use Demon leap on the fall. I keep trying to do it and sometimes I nail it (as in I hit the right side). Is there a certain facing I want to always hit the right balcony that the first set of adds will spawn on?

East side of the inner circle facing west. Unglyph Demon Leap if you have it glyphed.  Use demon leap close to the ledge height.  Should work every time.

[Soulzar 42]

I always put my Portal down before pull as a reference point, so I always know which way I need to be for transition.  Its easy to get turned around during phase 1.

[Gruxa 1]

If you put your Demonic portal up at around 10 on the clock, you should have no problem leaping towards the correct place :)

[Soulzar 42]

If you put your Demonic portal up at around 10 on the clock, you should have no problem leaping towards the correct place

 

Thats odd... I put mine around 3oclock... if entrance to room looking in is your reference spot.  I pretty much land where they spawn.  

 

Green is my portal for a reference point, star is where I aim to be for transition.

Second pick shows where they spawn.

 

 

[Gruxa 1]

As far as I can tell you get knocked from one side to the other. So say you wanna end up on the right side (where the first adds spawn), you need to be on the left before he smashes the floor.

 

I'd very surprised if I'm wrong as i just had 2 days of Mythic BH progression (got the kill yesterday btw, Woooh !! :D) and I always had my teleport at  the left side around 10 o clock (we were doing the run-in-a-circle tactic for demolitions)

[Liquidsteel 279]

I don't think it matters too much. I moved to the entrance before the smash and never had problems. Allowed me to use my portal for getting back to the home position after each demolition.

[Soulzar 42]

Ahh I see, you're positioning yourself to get knocked towards your leap location, i get knocked back from it, but thats canceled out when I leap forward.  So sounds like it really doesn't matter much where you are for transition, as long as you leap the correct direction  

 

BTW, since BH is not too far off for me (currently working P2 BF) .. can a single lock Solo that first pack, or do you need more than one person?  I know they easily die solo on Heroic..

Edited April 22, 2015 by Soulzar

[Gruxa 1]

 

Ahh I see, you're positioning yourself to get knocked towards your leap location, i get knocked back from it, but thats canceled out when I leap forward.  So sounds like it really doesn't matter much where you are for transition, as long as you leap the correct direction  

 

BTW, since BH is not too far off for me (currently working P2 BF) .. can a single lock Solo that first pack, or do you need more than one person?  I know they easily die solo on Heroic..

 

Well I honestly never tried it from the other side, I always thought I wouldn't be able to reach it! guess it doesn't matter at all then as long as you can aim, hehe.

 

1 lock can clear a freshly spawned pack (thank you shadowfury!) with Dark Soul. We send 2 locks on 1st transition so we don't have to waste our cd's and on the 3rd smash we send 1 lock to the left side (mini map) to clear a new incoming pack with DS.

Edited April 22, 2015 by Gruxa

[Djargo 4]

But it's so much more fun to have them for yourself :3 I don't feel like cds get wasted that much, as they die in 3 globals and you can then jump down and continue doing damage with DS up.

[Soulzar 42]

But it's so much more fun to have them for yourself :3 I don't feel like cds get wasted that much, as they die in 3 globals and you can then jump down and continue doing damage with DS up.

 

Yes, one advantage to killing them solo is you end up capped on Fury from killing blows in Meta!