Odinn

Warsong Commander Nerf

Sign in to follow this  

14 posts in this topic

13813-warsong-commander-nerf.jpg

 

Blizzard has finally moved towards making a much-anticipated change to deal with the Patron Warrior deck - by nerfing Warsong Commander in an upcoming patch.

 

Here are the details:

 

Blizzard Icon Upcoming Balance Change to Warsong Commander

 

The following balance change will be made in an upcoming patch: 

Warsong Commander now reads: Your Charge minions have +1 Attack. 

Over the course of the short but impactful history of Hearthstone, we’ve taken a strong stance that we’d like to make changes to cards only when they are completely necessary. The direction of gameplay and the metagame should be defined by our players, and as the meta is evolving, many different types of decks can emerge. Cards that were once impactful in the meta can be less so once new strategies emerge, and that change is brought on by the constant need and drive for innovation by our players. 

Innovation is just one way a game can evolve, and the best way to shake up the meta and innovate in Hearthstone is by introducing new cards into the game. Introducing new cards to Hearthstone is our preferred method of changing the current state of the game. It’s exciting to discover a deck that may have an advantage over a popular deck out there, and new cards lead to the discovery of new combinations, and new conversations. Hearthstone thrives off of stories about enjoying a fast-paced, fun game with friends that’s full of delightful surprises. 
 

Going forward, we will continue to stand by our stance that we will only make adjustments to cards when we feel it is completely necessary and allow the injection of new cards into the game help our players define what the meta evolves into. In the case of Warsong Commander, we felt this change was necessary to help expand both future design space and to stand by our overarching game philosophy that battles between minions and fighting for board control is what makes Hearthstone fun and compelling.

 

Is this the right change? Are you happy to finally see an amendment to this playstyle?

 

UPDATE: This change will go live next week (mid-October):

 

 

UPDATE 2: Here is Ben Brode's "Developer Insights" video on the change:

 

 

Everyone can't get in here any more!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't like this nerf. I personally do not play patron, but I like facing patrons as it is an interesting match-up (I'm sure a lot of players disagree with me). Patron has definitelly changed the meta to contain patron counters, such as Zoos playing Shadowflame/Hellfire or Tempo mages running Flamestrike. 

 

I think a "softer" nerf should have been done instead. For example, I like the idea of Warsong aura - "Your minions with 3 or less attack have charge". This would prevent Frothing OTK but Patron would still be a good deck. It would make it a tier 2 deck. Now it is a tier 4 deck, if even that. 

 

RIP Patron Warrior, 2015-2015

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think we are at the verge of a new Hearthstone age.

Whether Golden or Dark - I wouldn't dare to predict.

Patron was so dominant anywhere - ladder, legend tier, tournaments.

It's sheer power was enough to warp the entire meta.

Having a deck that could win any game of Hearthstone played regarsless of matchup and draws was insane.

Unfair and unbalanced, by common means.

But it took real skill. Like real, real game knowledge, math abilities, etc.

Only a few decks are operating in the same style of Combo-Control - namely Freeze Mage - and they take a lot off effort to be piloted properly.

Evertything else we play in Hearthstone is basically about pointing those arrows from your dudes to enemy's face.

Question is only "When?"

Patron was not about it.

Patron was, in fact, an all-combo deck of Hearthstone. An archetype that is really uncommon for this game.

My really biggest worry, though, is Blizzard's words about their game philosophy. "Battles betwen minions and fighting for board control is what makes Hearthstone fun and compelling," they say.

If it was proper working of "high skill - high reward" principle that made them kill Patron - then it is somewhat just.

Big daddys of Hearthstone are now not this far from mortal beings, and blessed/damned RNG will make everyone equal, just like Colonel Colt.

If it was all about "being able to kill your opponent instantly from the empty board" - then it's wrong.

They've did absolutely the same with Miracle Rogue back in the days. And it wasn't good.

Yet there is a Force of Nature + Savage Roar. Double Power Overwhelming plus Doomguard. Name it yourself - there is a ton of other decks and cards who boast a lot of aforementioned non-interactive tons-of-damage burst.

And if Patron death is about "this game is minions fighting for board control" idea, then Hearthstone is having some problems.

Real, hardcore problems not with math or power creep or metagame, but with the very concept-development itself.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First post! Personally I loved playing Patron, however I have not advanced past rank 15 on the ladder. Still a noobie. Anyway, it's for the best. The integrity and longevity of the game is what matters.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Patron wasn't really that dominant, at the very least not after TGT where Secret Paladin emerged. Aggro decks are arguably dominant in current meta. Even Hearthstats show that patron is 7.8%. Secret Pally is at 12% and Hunter dominating with 16%. Patron is 1 in 13, not enough to really make a difference in your winrate.

 

You are saying that Patron is able to win regardless of draw and match-ups. I think you have never played patron warrior and gotten into matchups like Handlock or Druid. Also, having patrons or commanders at the bottom of your library is another way you lose. Any deck can lose from bad draws and Patron isn't any different. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seeing something like this bring tears to my eyes. This was the only deck that I can actually afford to play without spamming packs for dust, since I can't buy packs. Heck, I just started 3 weeks ago using this deck and they are gonna nerf it? :'( 

This deck maybe powerful, but it required skills too(which I still lack), and this deck is fun to play with. Now I'll have to use a deck composed of random cards to play rank/casual. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Patron wasn't really that dominant, at the very least not after TGT where Secret Paladin emerged. Aggro decks are arguably dominant in current meta. Even Hearthstats show that patron is 7.8%. Secret Pally is at 12% and Hunter dominating with 16%. Patron is 1 in 13, not enough to really make a difference in your winrate.

 

You are saying that Patron is able to win regardless of draw and match-ups. I think you have never played patron warrior and gotten into matchups like Handlock or Druid. Also, having patrons or commanders at the bottom of your library is another way you lose. Any deck can lose from bad draws and Patron isn't any different.

Hearthstats are good for sure, but they always count lower ranks, where the main portion of players are. Higher ranks = more Patron.

I've played 75 games on rank 10-5 back in Sept and 37 decks were Patron Warriors. It's not like I've got unlucky. 75 games is enough to take that randomness out of equation.

I believe that either I've misspoke or you've got my point about draws and matchups a bit wrong.

My point is that Patron employs an incredible amount of card draw which is sufficient to sculpt your hand from zero to lethal, like any other good combo deck.

But you are totally right in your other point - any game of Hearthstone can be lost. Patron is not an exception.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hearthstats are good for sure, but they always count lower ranks, where the main portion of players are. Higher ranks = more Patron.

I've played 75 games on rank 10-5 back in Sept and 37 decks were Patron Warriors. It's not like I've got unlucky. 75 games is enough to take that randomness out of equation.

I believe that either I've misspoke or you've got my point about draws and matchups a bit wrong.

My point is that Patron employs an incredible amount of card draw which is sufficient to sculpt your hand from zero to lethal, like any other good combo deck.

But you are totally right in your other point - any game of Hearthstone can be lost. Patron is not an exception.

 

 

While watching "legend streams", the amount of Patrons wasn't that high, one in 6 or less, which is still often, but in my opinion not often enough to make that of a huge impact on your winrate. I think you still might have been unlucky - different times of month bring different decks. The beginning of a new season is full of aggro decks, the middle is nice and playable, the end brings patrons. 

 

Yes, sorry, I misunderstood you. I fully agree with your view on its draw options. It is still important that you draw into your cards and if patrons are two last cards in your deck, it is devastating even with huge draw (I have seen it more than once) - but of course, it is rare not to draw into your cards within 20 or 25 cards of your deck.

 

 

Seeing something like this bring tears to my eyes. This was the only deck that I can actually afford to play without spamming packs for dust, since I can't buy packs. Heck, I just started 3 weeks ago using this deck and they are gonna nerf it? :'( 

This deck maybe powerful, but it required skills too(which I still lack), and this deck is fun to play with. Now I'll have to use a deck composed of random cards to play rank/casual. 

 

You can get dust quickly by playing arena. 3 wins are often enough to get you the invested value. 

 

You still can use budget version of decks or aggressive decks. There are multiple decks on this site made for this purpose and I recommend all of them (maybe except for Cheap mage, it felt weird to play).

Edited by positiv2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm absolute garbage with the arena. The problem is that I can't play a deck well if I nvr tried it a few times before, and by that few

times I lost 3 rounds already. My highest was a 5-3 arena,  averaging at 1-3 arena rounds. I have had very good cards in the arena before, but it is still the average of 1-3.  Not only that, it keeps giving my tgt & Gvg packs, which I do not want at the moment. 

I don't even have enough dust for any low budget decks since I invested most of my resources into training and building my patron deck+ patron deck using skills.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Patron wasn't really that dominant, at the very least not after TGT where Secret Paladin emerged. Aggro decks are arguably dominant in current meta. Even Hearthstats show that patron is 7.8%. Secret Pally is at 12% and Hunter dominating with 16%. Patron is 1 in 13, not enough to really make a difference in your winrate.

 

You are saying that Patron is able to win regardless of draw and match-ups. I think you have never played patron warrior and gotten into matchups like Handlock or Druid. Also, having patrons or commanders at the bottom of your library is another way you lose. Any deck can lose from bad draws and Patron isn't any different. 

Patron is by far the best deck in the game right now. Secret paladin is only popular because it is decent, very easy to play correctly,cheap to craft(at least some builds are) and games end much faster than with patron. Any decent player using patron will still get a higher rank with it than with any other deck in the game.

 

 

Popularity=/=quality.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

RIP Warsong Commander. This is your second trip to the nerf hammer chopping block. The powers that be have received so many complaints against you, they're making sure the next chop cleanly severs your ties to the game. May Blizzard have mercy on your Patron Warrior deck...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Patron is by far the best deck in the game right now. Secret paladin is only popular because it is decent, very easy to play correctly,cheap to craft(at least some builds are) and games end much faster than with patron. Any decent player using patron will still get a higher rank with it than with any other deck in the game.

 

 

Popularity=/=quality.

 

I wasn't talking about the quality of the deck. I was talking about it affecting your winrate and your way to better ranks. Also, Patron is actually cheaper than Secret. Aggro decks aren't easy to play corretly, Control decks are (except for freeze and echo). Aggro and Midrange Hunter, Aggro Paladin (secretless) and Mech Mage finish the game even faster, yet Secret Paladin is very popular. Meta isn't fully adapted to Secret Pally yet and that makes it a strong deck. However, meta has adapted to Patron becauseTempo nad Mech mages run Flamestrike, Zoo runs Shadowflame etc. In this moment, Patron isn't that strong to be hard nerfed like this.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As someone who started out with Patron deck for its competitiveness and low dust price, I ma disappointed twice. The deck was very difficult to play, some games I won by topdecking with one, two health points. Thats what made it thrilling.

I never like nerfs, evenmore when they are done to something, that si not extremely broken (which this was not, IMHO).

Well, I guess it is time to reroll to Worgen OTK deck ><

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Aleco

      Click on the gift tab in Battle.net to claim one free Hearthstone: Classic pack!
      Blizzard is giving away one free Hearthstone: Classic pack as a way to show off the "Gift" tab, a brand new feature in the Battle.net client. To claim your pack, simply click on the gift notification in the upper-right corner of the client then click on the big blue "Claim" button which pops up.

      Hearthstone fans from outside of North America may need to update to the beta version of the Battle.net client before being able to view the gift notification. To do this, click on the Blizzard logo in the upper-left corner of the Battle.net client to bring up the main menu, then click on Settings. Here you should see a "Beta" tab at the very bottom of the Settings list where you should be able to switch to the Beta version of the client.
      Thanks to the new Gifts tab Battle.net users are now able to buy items from the Shop (such as Hearthstone packs) as gifts for their friends. You can view the Gifts tab even if you don't have a current gift notification by clicking on your name and following the drop down menu to "View Gifts".
    • By Aleco

      Ike's surprising Freeze Mage deck played a huge role in his perfect tournament run.
      Hot off of a top 8 finish at the HCT Americas Summer Championships, Mark "Ike" Eichner blew through the competition at DreamHack Denver to finish the tournament with a perfect 13-0 record. He capped off the tournament by defeating DrJikininki, the DreamHack Atlanta 2017 champion, 3-2 in the finals. An incredibly impressive accomplishment for his first ever DreamHack, Ike will be taking home $7500 and 15 HCT points for his victory.
      Ike's powerful tournament lineup featured the three unquestioned kings of the current tournament meta, Highlander Priest, Jade Druid, and Tempo Rogue. However, his unique Freeze Mage deck was the all-star of the tournament. Ike called the deck his top performer on Twitter and noted that it received the most bans in the top 16.
      You can check out his deck lists for the tournament (including his Freeze Mage list) here on Twitter.
    • By Aleco

      In episode number four of "What's the Move?" a fun OTK deck finds a creative way to handle a threat.
      I've been having way too much fun with a Stonetusk Boar OTK (One Turn Kill) deck on the ladder these past few days. It's been performing surprisingly well against both of the two most popular decks in the current metagame, Highlander Priest and Tempo Rogue, but the real reason to play it is because of how much variety it has to offer from game to game. It's incredibly difficult to pilot and never fails to create interesting situations - just like the one we'll be discussing today!
      Once again, I took some of the feedback from the previous episode to heart and did my best to incorporate it into this one. As this series is still young and in the process of honing on it's ideal set of parameters (such as the length of the video, the amount of depth it should go into, and the kinds of situations it analyzes), please feel free to let us know in the comment section how this episode compares its predecessors.
      - Aleco
    • By Zadina

      The Ukrainian player is now part of G2.
      Lifecoach's spot had been empty for a while and someone had to fill in the gap, in order for the Fantastic Four of the Hearthstone division of G2 Esports to be remade. This person turned out to be Neirea, formerly of Team Liquid, who will join RDU, Thijs and Lothar. In fact, Neirea is already competing with his new team in the second week of the Trinity Series.
      Eugene "Neira" Shumilin has consistently ranked high in various major competitions since 2014. His breakout performance happened this year with team Ukraine placing 2nd in the Hearthstone Global Games and Neirea qualifying for the World Championship during the Spring Championship.
      We wish him the very best of luck!
    • By Zadina

      Shadowreaper Anduin can machinegun his enemies down at a proper speed.
      Patch 9.2, which went live yesterday, broke poor Shadowreaper Anduin, causing a huge delay when refreshing his Hero Power. This bug was quickly fixed today with a hotfix that can be donwloaded to your Hearthstone client:
      mdonais
      We are currently deploying a Hotfix to fix the speed of Shadowreaper Anduin's hero power.
      It slowed down in the patch yesterday. I don't know exactly why since I am not one of the engineers that fixed it but it sounds like it is a side effects of the unity upgrade we did. We have to rebuild a some things when we do a unity upgrade.
      Thanks!
      Mike. (source)