Marksmanship Hunter 7.3

[Azortharion 60]

I'd seriously love to hear what you mean by "simming the game, and not the spreadsheet" in great detail. Additionally I'd love some more detailed, empirical evidence on the specifics of your critvers/hastemastery predicament, with a focus on Pawn supposedly recommending something that is objectively a dps loss.

 

and no, dummy testing does not count.

[Guest dude]

so is bloodthirtys instinct still good for marksman i have to convince my guild or myself that it isnt a melee trinket 

[Zombales 0]

Rather than posting opinions that contradict Azors always impeccable work I would just like to ask for a small bit of advice instead.

 

We managed to kill Ursoc mythic last night (only just might I add i think it was a 5:09 kill)

We Hero at a strange time to try and push dps as much as possible before the enrage but that's beside the point.

 

My CD is up for this phase but my question is the following.

 

Should I use Trueshot and 2nd pot with Hero (boss is around 40% ish at this point) or shall I hold onto both until boss is sub 20% for bulls-eye and then blow everything into the boss for the additional crit damage?

 

I don't have the legendary boots and my trueshot CD is 2.5mins so I'm only ever going to be able to use true shot twice on this encounter ( I could have 10 seconds of trueshot after enrage if I used it on CD but roar killed me at 4:50 anyway)

 

Its not a major issue but was just trying to figure it out for next weeks kill

Edited October 19, 2016 by Zombales

[Guest Kinao]

Good Day dear Azortharion,

I'm a hunter "en devenir" (level 95) and I really (REALLY) appreciate all the work and info you give to the community.

I'm not yet in the process of weighting precisely my stat, but i'm about to start Legion and I would have a question. In your hunter guides, you recommand to have the first golden trait of BM for Mythic dungeans (AoE orientation). On the other side, it is advised to do the lvl100-110 as a MM hunter because of the Artifact hability.

My question is : would you advise to level from 100 to 110 as a MM (and thus get the hability it provides) but use your artifact power rewards on your BM weap ? (I assume putting all the leveling AP into the BM weapon will lead in having the 13points by the time you hit 110 or so)

Or would you advise to use and level your MM weap from 100 to 110, and wait for lvl110 to start leveling your BM weapon ?

 

I hope I made myself clear... English is not my mother tongue, so please apologize.

 

Kinao

[Azortharion 60]

At this point in the expansion cycle I'd level as MM and put artifact power in MM as well, speed through Mythic+ to get basic gear and then try and get into raiding pugs etc.

[Guest Kinao]

2 hours ago, Azortharion said:

At this point in the expansion cycle I'd level as MM and put artifact power in MM as well, speed through Mythic+ to get basic gear and then try and get into raiding pugs etc.

That's awesome, thank you very much for the (very) quick answer.

In addition, I love the fact to have a pet, but I can't stand the gun (I know I can transmo...) :) MM I'm in !

Kinao

[Guest Zeppojuice]

On 10/18/2016 at 2:38 PM, Azortharion said:

I'd seriously love to hear what you mean by "simming the game, and not the spreadsheet" in great detail. Additionally I'd love some more detailed, empirical evidence on the specifics of your critvers/hastemastery predicament, with a focus on Pawn supposedly recommending something that is objectively a dps loss.

 

and no, dummy testing does not count.

 

Right... I am only referring to logs and raid logs/Dps logs and watching overall on fights, etc.. I was not trying to "dis" your methods, just do not trust a sim as much as real time logs and in game numbers with multiple situations. I will find the gear I was referring to and get back on it. It was really just an opinion and observation that even though more crit and higher Ilevel was showing as a +5%, the loss in mastery was not worth the crit gain. I wasn't trying to imply that PAWN was flawed, just that it it's always correct.

[Azortharion 60]

Sure, it's not a problem at all.

I am just seriously interested in seeing how you found out that what Pawn recommended was a DPS loss. The specifics of the testing you did, the raid logs, dps logs, whatever. Of course I am asking because i know for a fact that the only way to objectively test such a thing is with simulations, a point I was going to get around to when you presented whatever "evidence" you had, which would be flawed almost by sheer nature of it not being a simulation, because you cannot reliably test/compare individual gearpieces in a better way.

You say that you observed the iLvl + crit gain to not be worth the mastery loss. How did you figure this out?

[Eagleeye1975 0]

In your enchants recommendations, you put for the neck enchant, the Hidden Satyr one.

In my parses, I am seeing this giving me about 2% to 2.5% of my total damage.

I feel that perhaps the +300 mastery one is far better, due to the raw damage output bonuses.  350 mastery gives you 1%, which results in a 4% bonus to damage from focus-spending abilities.  300 mastery thus results in about a .85% bonus to mastery, translating into about a 3.43% bonus to damage from those focus-spending abilities.

Those focus-spenders account for about 78% of my total damage, so a 3.43% bonus to just those amounts to about a 2.67% total in bonus damage... better than the hidden satyr enchant.

Plus, hidden satyr only hits the current target, and does not impact AOE damage like mastery would, especially in terms of sidewinders, AOE marked shots, and barrage.

 

Thoughts?

[Guest Lyshima]

Hey folks,

 

I am new here and like this kind of brainstorming about how to reach the most potential.

 

Well,

I also think given the fact that mastery results in a percent damage buff - increases your dmg overall in all situations.

As you mentioned it turns out that your calculation applies to every target possible.

Satyr just to one --> single target.

In addition it is RNG based meaning it varies.

Flat mastery will apply - always.

 

When you even more dive into the math you can see that your mastery will go up as well as your agility as far as legion goes.

I am not sure how Satyr scales but I am sure that it will not scale with mastery.

So think about a coordinate system. You have 2 curves. One is your total dmg and the other is your Satyr dmg.  As far as your total dmg will increase by time with increased agility and mastery your Saty dmg will either be always 100.000 or it might increase but just with agility not with your mastery.

Meaning that as far as legion goes your Satyr dmg will become less and less when you compare it as a percentage digit of your total dmg on your timeline because every dmg you make will increase more than the dmg made by Satyr.

 

If I am right the dmg percentage of Satyr is about ~2,5% now.

With every gear upgrade Satyr will become less and less effective and there will be a point where the mastery enchantment will be better.

 

Ofc. it would be nice to have somebody who will calculate the crossing point of those two graphes.

 

I am sorry for my bad English guys.

 

Cheers,

Lyshima, Blackmoore

[Bumbum 0]

Hi,

what´s about the 'marked for death' trait? It empowers aimed shot by increasing the crit chance. It must be worth therefore to cast as many aimed shots as possible after marked shot and not before, isn´t it? I wonder why this point is not even mentioned in the guide. Quite the contrary, it says it doesn`t matter whether marked shot is cast at the beginning or at the end (whitin the vulnerable debuff).

What do i miss?

Edited October 22, 2016 by Bumbum

[Eagleeye1975 0]

1 hour ago, Bumbum said:

Hi,

what´s about the 'marked for death' trait? It empowers aimed shot by increasing the crit chance. It must be worth therefore to cast as many aimed shots as possible after marked shot and not before, isn´t it? I wonder why this point is not even mentioned in the guide. Quite the contrary, it says it doesn`t matter whether marked shot is cast at the beginning or at the end (whitin the vulnerable debuff).

What do i miss?

The problem is with maintaining Vulnerable with Sidewinders recharge rates and Patient Sniper making Vulnerable last only 6 seconds.

This means you have to weave in Aimed Shots between your Sidewinders and Marked Shots, in order to not run out of Sidewinders charges... it's better to be maintaining Vulnerable up-time... 

 

So you basically go: SW -> Aimed -> Aimed -> Marked -> Aimed -> Aimed... repeat.  If you fail to do that, you either consume SW charges too fast and are left waiting for new charges to come up... or you run out of Vulnerable time after Marked shots, which means losing that full 150% damage bonus.

[Azortharion 60]

Marked for Death is built into Vulnerable. If Vulnerable is up, the effect of Marked for Death is up.

[Bumbum 0]

Oh ok, I see, thank you. So the tooltip description totaly crap? How do we know that? Some blue post or just selfmade statistical tests?

 

[Azortharion 60]

Testing.

[Valks 2,373]

18 hours ago, Guest Lyshima said:

With every gear upgrade Satyr will become less and less effective and there will be a point where the mastery enchantment will be better.

Pretty much the sentiment, yes. 

Tagging @Eagleeye1975 to read, in case he didn't.

[Guest Joney]

Why askmrrobot puts Agi>mastery>crit and hast?

[Orthios 271]

11 minutes ago, Guest Joney said:

Why askmrrobot puts Agi>mastery>crit and hast?

We are not ask mr robot people, so we can't answer why they do what they do.  

[Guest Angharadh]

Azortharion, thanks very much for your comprehensive analyses and your response to my question regarding Bullseye vs. Legacy of the windrunners back on 9/9.

My question: any thoughts on the recently announced class balance changes in 7.1 for Marksmanship? Specifically "Vulnerable now increases damage by 50% (was 25%), stacking up to 2 times (was 3 times)."? How do you anticipate it will impact single-target and multiple-target DPS and rotations? Thank you.

[Guest Mike]

Hey Azor

Going off your Simc guide on YT. If I wanted to compare multiple different trinkets, would something like this be accurate or would I also need to change some settings within the rotation APL?

hunter="No Trinket"
level=110
race=human
region=us
server=frostmourne
role=attack
professions=mining=800/enchanting=66
talents=1113121
spec=marksmanship
artifact=55:0:0:0:0:307:1:308:1:309:1:310:1:311:1:312:3:313:3:314:3:315:3:316:3:318:3:319:3:320:3:321:1:322:1:1337:1

head=,id=139214,bonus_id=1806/1502
neck=,id=132444,enchant_id=5439,bonus_id=1811,gem_id=130222
shoulder=,id=139217,enchant_id=5882,bonus_id=1806/1507/3336
back=,id=133771,enchant_id=5435,bonus_id=3418/1808/1517/1813,gem_id=130222
chest=,id=134214,bonus_id=3414/1547/3337
wrist=,id=137405,bonus_id=3418/1517/1813
hands=,id=138214,bonus_id=1806/1502
waist=,id=137081,bonus_id=1811
legs=,id=139215,bonus_id=1805/40/1507/3337
feet=,id=139219,bonus_id=1806/1502
finger1=,id=138220,enchant_id=5429,bonus_id=1806/1808/1502,gem_id=130247
finger2=,id=134487,enchant_id=5429,bonus_id=3412/1808/1512/3336,gem_id=130222
trinket1=empty
trinket2=empty
main_hand=,id=128826,bonus_id=727,relic_id=1806:1512:3336/3417:1527:3337/3418:1517:1813,gem_id=139262/137544/137411/0

copy=Fulmination(870)
trinket1=empty
trinket2=,id=137367,bonus_id=3412/1522/3337

copy=Naraxas(865s)
trinket1=empty
trinket2=,id=137349,bonus_id=3412/1808/41/1517/3337,gem_id=130222

copy=BloodThirsty(835)
trinket1=empty
trinket2=,id=139329,bonus_id=3379/1457

copy=Oakheart(850)
trinket1=empty
trinket2=,id=137306,bonus_id=3413/1502/1813

copy=Chrono(850)
trinket1=empty
trinket2=,id=137419,bonus_id=3413/1502/1813

copy=Three-Toed-Mastery(830s)
trinket1=empty
trinket2=,id=134203,bonus_id=3396/1808/605/1492/3339,gem_id=130222

Cheers, Mike.

 

 

[Guest Gagboot]

??So it looks like we need to be replacing Potion of Deadly Grace  with  Potion of Prolonged Power-- a potion which increases stats by 2500 for 1 minute.??

[Azortharion 60]

How on earth did you reach that conclusion from the sims in the guide - there are no 3 target sustained fights.

[Guest WarmTürtle]

Hey, do we use the new 7.1 potions or is deadly grace still better? 

[Guest Aarath]

On 10/22/2016 at 3:31 PM, Eagleeye1975 said:

The problem is with maintaining Vulnerable with Sidewinders recharge rates and Patient Sniper making Vulnerable last only 6 seconds.

This means you have to weave in Aimed Shots between your Sidewinders and Marked Shots, in order to not run out of Sidewinders charges... it's better to be maintaining Vulnerable up-time... 

 

So you basically go: SW -> Aimed -> Aimed -> Marked -> Aimed -> Aimed... repeat.  If you fail to do that, you either consume SW charges too fast and are left waiting for new charges to come up... or you run out of Vulnerable time after Marked shots, which means losing that full 150% damage bonus.

If Barrage is off CD, I would replace your first aimed shot with it. Barrage does hella damage. Unless you get a LnL procced Aimed Shot. Also, if you are about to cap Focus, use Windburst instead of Sidewinders.

[Guest 7.1]

any trinket rank change with the new patch?