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Jeff

Resto and restless

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Hello to the masses.

I am one of 2 or 3 healers in a raid that is just starting progression in 10 player TOT. We are only 3 bosses in at this point. I am always looking for ways to improve my healing skill and numbers. I find this easy to do with my dps characters because of simcraft; but I have no luck finding any such thing for shamans. So I read as much as I can from several sources. Haste break point has me confused. I believe my haste is likely too low and my mastery might be too high but it seems that every time I mess around with my stat weights, I am worse off. So I am wondering if any of the subject matter experts here can look at my char stats and tell me what you see? I do not have a raid that provides the 5% haste buff. I do have 4 piece. I do follow a stringent rotation..well, set of rules....for the fights that allow them. So my play style is not what is concerning me now, just my stats and how to set these up properly for Robot.

Thank you for taking the time to read all that dribble and thank you again for your time in responding.

http://us.battle.net...atloot/advanced

I have changed out the gem in my helm to rivers edge but armory has not updated that just yet.

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Your haste is high enough to reach the first soft cap without the haste buff and with your Ancestral Guidance talent. In fact, you only need 3039, so you can reforge slightly more out of Haste, but you likely wouldn't even notice the difference. Your stat priority is good as-is.

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As a 10man raider, resto shammy's are good but for throughput which is what I assume you are measuring, its hard to top an equally geared, equally competent, healer of any other class, other than Holy Priests which are about on par.

Mastery is awesome for shamans, if they can get full effect of it.

Mastery is said be to best for throughput but declines after 50% and you're running at 64%. I would recommend trying a high crit build. Drop a bit of mastery for crit, it won't make huge amounts of difference but will increase you mana regen (even though you have a good amount of spirit) which allows you to be a little less mana dependant.

Another option would be to drop your mastery a bit to boost your haste, Again this will increase throughput through allowing more heals to be cast and maybe beating your other healers to the punch allowing your mastery to be more effective.

These are both minor changes, neither should make significant difference as you are stat'd well to begin with. But if you are unhappy, do some testing. Try a full crit build (mastery ~50%, haste ~3300 {to account for any latency issues even with a good connection}).

Peoples play style really does have the biggest influence on output than anything you can do with the stats so have a play around. I gaurentee messing whole heartidly with your secondary stats will not make your healing useless. So unless you're only just killing bosses by the skin of your teeth, while you are testing you won't disadvantage the raid majorly.

You never know you may even find the solution to your problem. Although shammy's are behind on the healing in 10man even after the few buffs they got in 5.3. Don't get me wrong, they are a good healing class and in general are still within 10-15% of the highest healing class spec.

Also, your level 90 talent may not be optimal. Although unleashed elements looks good and with correct use can rescue your tank (along with your masses of mastery). Primal Elementist is much more likely to benefit you. Glyphed you can have 10% increased healing for 1 min out of 3. Thats a 33% theoretical uptime. This can obviously be stack with healing buffs/abilities such as healing tide totem and ascendance giving you an overall hps increase of better than 10% within that minute.

If you use your stone element you also have a 20% dmg reduction on yourself which increases your survivability and therefore the raids. Its simple to use and you have a visual remind in the form of a beam which connects you and your pet throughout its cast. Just a thought =)

Edited by Xinto
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Good info from Xinto there. My thoughts;

WALL OF TEXT WARNING

Companions

What stats you like is HEAVILY influenced by who you're raiding with. What classes are your fellow healers? Anyone who works with absorbs a lot (i.e. Disc or Paladin) makes your choice of heavy Mastery sub-optimal.

Haste Soft Cap

Effectively for Resto at the moment, you only have the Earthliving breakpoints as softcaps. You can take these if you want, but in 10-man it's worth bugger all IMHO. It does basically no healing unless you're running either the Riptide glyph or are getting loads of people in your Healing Rain (which in 10's is almost certainly not).

Haste is technically the best stat for throughput, but remember that it's mana-negative so you'll run OOM in a flash. This is why it's not chosen as a priority for us. The best way to approach Haste is to decide how much you're comfortable with in terms of cast-speed and go with that. For me, I choose to go with as little Haste as possible because I'm happy with slow cast times.

If you find that you're being beaten to the heals a lot, you might want to increase your Haste.

Gems

I notice you have Green Mastery/Spirit gems in your Yellow slots. I'd advise using Orange Int/Secondary instead, since the Int bonus gives a nice extra kick to your heals. You can probably afford to drop some Spirit since you're at ~30% more than I am unbuffed, and replacing green with orange is a good way to do that.

Spirit

As I said, you have LOADS of Spirit. Probably too much. Reforge that trinket IMO, get a nicer stat out of it. Remember that if you're not dropping Mana Tide around 2-3 times each fight you're not doing it enough; this will allow you to compensate for loosing regen.

Mastery / Crit

Mastery is extremely good IF you get the full benefit out of it, which in ToT (and especially with lots of absorb classes) you simply won't. It's great, but beyond 50% it's pretty much a waste of good stats. I'm considering lowering my Mastery even further, to about 40% if I can. The reason is that in ToT you tend to have to top people quickly and keep them there, so your healing is more on people in the high health region than low. Crit overtakes Mastery on single-target heals at *about* 50% health, and on AoE heals it's at *about* 65% iirc. Most of the time in ToT, your heals will be on players above this level. This is certainly what I find. What I'm saying is that I think you have more Mastery than you can possibly benefit from.

Crit is really good this tier. For two reasons; 1) It provides regen AND throughput, allowing you to gain throughput by reforging out of Spirit but still keep lots of regen. 2) Crits proc Ancestral Awakening, which is our best tool for tackling sustained spread-out raid healing. ToT has a LOT of that second one, to Crit is really useful for you (especially on, for e.g. Tortos). Crit procs are ALSO a smartheal, which means when you're raiding with absorb classes you have an extra edge to get your healing in.

Talents

I notice you're using Ancestral Swiftness and Unleashed Fury. I think that these are poor choices for the current tier, and I suggest that you play around with them. Take Primal Elementalist and consider glyphing Fire Elemental to give you a clutch +10% healing cooldown (useful on; Jin'rokh, Horridon, Council, Tortos, Megaera, Durumu, Primordius AT LEAST) every three minutes. You can even find a macro in the RShaman guide which allows you to 1-button the totem AND the buff that the elementals give you.

For this tier in particular I'd recommend Elemental Mastery over Ancestral Swiftness. I know people say "oh you run OOM faster" but hear me out here; it is insane when used at the same time as Ascendance. Use my suggestion for an Ascendance Macro to gain ALL THE BURST healing. It's absolutely insane.

General Comments

You mentioned that you use a sort-of rotation. I think that this is naive. Rotations are for DPS classes; healers must do whatever it takes to keep the raid alive first and foremost, and as a secondary priority react to whatever other healing needs to be done. If your "rotation" is Riptide, Chain Heal, Chain Heal, Chain Heal, Riptide, then it'll be useless on Ji-kun (and several other bosses). You must always be adapting your ability use to the environment and the situation, and there is no alternative to doing this if you're going to be a good healer.

Another thing that I think every Resto Shaman should be told is plan your cooldowns. I don't know if you do this, you didn't say, but plan exactly when you are going to use Healing Tide, Ascendance (macro'd), Spirit Link, your Elemental Totems, potions, and anything else you can think of. Plan them, and then execute that plan. You find that you can use all of the above AT LEAST twice a fight on average, and it's a complete shame to not use them because you "might need them later".

Summary

Glad to hear you want to improve. You're going the right way about it (talking to people about how you can improve) so take on board as much advice as possible. Let us know what classes you're healing alongside, and also take a look at the fight-specific tips we have for Resto Shaman.

Good luck!

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This is the type of information that makes me a better resto shaman. Thank you.

The other healers are Disc Priest and a Holy Pally.

As for a rotation, I guess that was the wrong choice of words as healing seems to be mostly reactionary in the group I am in. So outside of ES, rip, totems, rains, and CD's...I am healing what needs to be healed when it needs to be healed. Sometimes those other two healers have a very difficult time keeping the tanks up and I end up having to spam greater wave for awhile which is so bad for me. Takes away from my specialty as a raid healer and my mana. Also causes me to have to use CD's when they are supposed to used at more optimal times. So along with myself getting better, those other two are either getting replaced or better..and quickly.

I have wondered about those two talents in particular. I am going to make those changes and we are picking back up tonight on Council so that will be a good fight for trying these out.

Interesting comment on the haste. I think I have been more confused and worked up about all the haste information than anything else of late. Thank you for lending a sane mind to the haste madness!

Healing Surge. I never use it. I have been using chain, lesser or greater only. I don't think I understand what benefits (if any) there are in using surge instead of lesser or greater. Do you yourself typically use this in any particular circumstance?

Okay thank you for the information again. I am off to regem and reforge then I am on to the tips and tricks.

Edited by Jeff
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Crit is good for mana regen and comes in from direct heal crits so that may help in some respects and help with the on the spot GHW and HW's being used.

The Primal Elementalist is great (twice as good as I realised) as your elementals don't share a cd so thats 10% healing increase for 2min out of 3min if used optimally.

Let us know what you conclusion is. Good luck with the testing and indeed progress.

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Ended up working right up until raid time so I did not have the chance to make the changes prior. I was really bummed about that. Now I have to wait another week since we are a Wed/Thur raiding group.

I have now changed out a few gems, reforge changes and the talents are swapped out. Running through LFR tonight or tomorrow to see what its like for me. Mastery is down to about 50% now and rid myself of some spirit (11069) and forged into crit (18%). I think I might lop off a bit more spirit for crit. Really excited to go out and try all these new changes.

I have been using my own food for +spirit and I realize now that this is not needed. So moving to int food. How about flasking though? Still using spirit flask instead of int. I am going to try to swap that out too. I spoke to another heal shaman on the server and he said he doesn't even use either flask and instead he uses the crit elixir now. Not sure how to feel about that but my immediate thought is that this is an incorrect practice.

Thank you again.

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I would say Int is certainly better than crit elixir ... that is likely a cost thing these days.

Try Int flask and see tbh. It will increase your throughput making every heal you do more potent, as long as your not overhealing too much, thats more effective.

Good luck with the testing but remember 25man LFR and 10man Norm are two different beasts for a shammy healer, but you full well know that. It will give you an excellent chance to get use to an adjusted healing style.

Thanks for posting

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Firstly, you're completely welcome for all the information. This is the kind of thing I've been dying to do since I became mod here. Tell your friends about our awesome forum! Posted Image

Healing Surge: Oh yes that exists. It's as neglected as the 9-button on a microwave and twice as dirty. The ONLY situation I ever found for using HS over another heal is when you're in absolute urgency to get the heal out. Example: Dying tank, or the few seconds after Stomp on Tortos. In terms of mana cost, healing power, or Resurgence returns, HS is useless in PvE.

One thing I did think was that using a HS rotation during Ascendance would put through greater numbers, but when I ran some calculations the difference was minimal to nonexistent.

The Primal Elementalist is great (twice as good as I realised) as your elementals don't share a cd so thats 10% healing increase for 2min out of 3min if used optimally.

They can't be popped at once, and using one starts a short cooldown on the other. Expect a small delay between the two.

I have now changed out a few gems, reforge changes and the talents are swapped out. Running through LFR tonight or tomorrow to see what its like for me. Mastery is down to about 50% now and rid myself of some spirit (11069) and forged into crit (18%). I think I might lop off a bit more spirit for crit. Really excited to go out and try all these new changes.

I have been using my own food for +spirit and I realize now that this is not needed. So moving to int food. How about flasking though? Still using spirit flask instead of int. I am going to try to swap that out too. I spoke to another heal shaman on the server and he said he doesn't even use either flask and instead he uses the crit elixir now. Not sure how to feel about that but my immediate thought is that this is an incorrect practice.

Spirit is one of those things where there's technically no "correct" answer. Your Spirit is now a lot closer to mine, but remember that I'm running a Spirit proc trinket. I find that a comfortable level of Spirit fully buffed and flasked is ~13k (plus or minus maybe 1k). I tend to flask for Spirit, which is great for progression, but last night on our farm kills I tried the Intellect flask because I got one from a gold bag. It's not a bad choice, especially for farm kills. You will notice the difference both in terms of HPS and in terms of lack of mana; again, good use of Mana Tide (and other planned cooldowns) is essential for compensating.

In terms of food, go for +Intellect. It's much better these days IMO.

Glad to see you're excited! Keep us updated on how it goes! (Though I will be on holiday next week, I look forward to hearing of your inevitable success.)

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They can't be popped at once, and using one starts a short cooldown on the other. Expect a small delay between the two.

Thanks Stoove. I don't actually play a shaman, I research it for my wife.

How long is a short delay? As in seconds or 10s of seconds. Just curious tbh.

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You can't have both up together, expect ~30s between the end of one and the start of the next. Does need verification though :)

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just seen your question and like to give you an answer from my view. We are 2 Shaman Restro and 1 Disci Priest. If you want do heal Tanks dont get to less Mastery, 64% or more are ok if you going to heal tanks. We have 7/12 Bosses down on 10 normal and 3 or sometimes 2 heales feels good for all boss fights so far.

Most urgent thing for my oppinon is read as much as you can about Restro and then do what >you< think what is right because iam sorry i dont agree with all what is mentioned in the posts above. And i dont think you should say all what i say is true. Because it depends always on your group and how you can play the healer-role Posted Image...

take care Tha

--- and sry about my english

ps: i dont care about Primal Elementalist, because iam ok with the passive which you can have instead and also the bonus dont depends on an extra click Posted Image

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/der-rat-von-dalaran/Tha/advanced

Edited by Tha

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I'm not going to argue with you Tha, as I agree it is best to try and see what works best for you and your set up.

We are only giving hints and tips based on experience and our reading. I have to say your set up is pretty much what I suggested for Jeff to try (gems slightly different).

If you prefer the passive, good on you, it comes into its own with direct heals and could easily save a life at many times in a fight. But for overall throughput which is what it seemed Jeff wanted, Elementalist used well would do better. Not saying healing is about throughput but it should be considered and balanced with the overall.

Also Unleashed Fury through Unleashed Elements would be more button pressing than Elementalist to gain full effect.

Edited by Xinto

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Certainly, playing around with stats and finding what you feel good with is the way to do it. That said, if one's having problems finding a good direction I feel that's where threads like this really come in useful.

My experience of tank-healing is that it completely depends on your tank. We have three tanks, two of which take almost no damage and one is like his armour is made of paper - for the first two, I'd never want Mastery but for the last one Mastery is truly excellent. It really depends upon your situation and your team. I find that most of my healing is spread out across all targets, so I don't worry too much about tank healing.

ps: i dont care about Primal Elementalist, because iam ok with the passive which you can have instead and also the bonus dont depends on an extra click Posted Image

You're free to disagree with us on Primal Elementalist; it does take practice and discipline to get right. It does take button presses (hint: use the macro shown in the Resto Shaman guide here on Icy Veins) but it's throughput is the most when used correctly. This is directly in line with the dev team's philosophy of "active talents should be slightly more powerful than passive talents". There's a big gain in using PE where it counts.

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TLDR:

Drop Echo of Elements --> Ancestral Swiftness.

Drop Elemental Blast --> Unleashed Fury.

Drop Healing Tide Tot --> Conductivity.

Drop Fire Totem Glyph --> Glyph of Riptide.

Get good at dropping healing rain on packs of 4-5+ raid members. Takes practice but very doable. Obviously the more the better.

Healing rain >> Riptide >> LHW >> LHW >> Riptide >> LHW >> LHW........ (more sustainable throughput)

Ascendance >> Unleash elements >> Healing Rain >> Healing Stream Tot >> Riptide >> GHW >> GHW >> Riptide >> GHW >> GHW......

Other than that there isn't much to do. If healing rain isn't going to hit that many, its just riptide, maybe a chain heal, use your judgement. By that, I mean, sometimes you need to put out more aoe healing immediately.. so with less set up time, so you shuffle the rotation.

The Post

This is to improve throughput (more healing for same or less mana spent) - which I believe is your goal? Only personal from my experience. Fights with movement and players spread out evenly just aren't ever going to be a shaman's strength as we stand now. In the end you have to push yourself through this and I saw one guy tell you to go with what you feel is going to work for you. That's definitely the best idea.

  • Try different talents. Drop Echo of elements and get Ancestral Swiftness. Drop Elemental Blast and get Unleashed Fury. Drop your totem glyph and get Glyph of Riptide. Conductivity is absolutely under rated in my experience and opinion. I get massive throughput from that. Finding frequent places to use healing rain (which you have buffed with unleash elements) on 4-5+ members of the raid takes practice, but is often doable. At that point, it's riptide, LHW, LHW, riptide, LHW, LHW... (the efficiency of LHW counteracts cost of healing rain). Cast each spell on a different raid target that needs heals. Glyph of riptide is going to allow you to spam that rotation if needed. 30% of that LHW is diverted to whoever is in your healing rain, and they are already soaking up healing from the rain itself. Drop a healing rain and get the tank and 4-5+ melee dps in the radius and watch the effective healing numbers pour in with average drain on your mana. Drop a healing stream totem and switch LHW to GHW in that rotation and you have increased throughput even more, sacrificing mana. Pop Ascendance during this? Lights out.
  • Synergy. The changes above to your talents and some glyphs will increase how well your spec (and spells) will work together. You have 5% more spell haste passive, your riptide has no cooldown, which allows you to chain together 2 x LHW or GHW. Every time you use unleash elements (which should be on CD) next heal is now 50% more powerful (with conductivity, 30% of that buffed heal gets dumped to anyone standing in healing rain). Do you see the shift I'm trying to demonstrate? Trying to use the healing you're already doing (riptides, with LHW and GHW on different raid targets) and do more with it (dump it into Conductivity targets coupled with healing rain default effect).
Edited by Wierzbowski

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Interesting post there about maximizing healing from Conductivity. I might give it a go on one of our farm nights at some point, but I don't think it's very useful for progress IMO. Especially on fights like Tortos or Horridon where there's too much movement to get people in that Healing Rain all the time. Remember also that you'd have to drop Healing Tide Totem for Conductivity, which means you lose a BIG cooldown. I wouldn't risk that on Megaera or Ji-kun, for example. Also note that the Conductivity rotation in 10's is only useful when you have lots of melee DPS (which we tend not to have enough for).

If you're going to consider any few of Wier's tips but not all of them, remember a few things;

  • Glyph of HST is excellent on most fights (esp. Megaera, council, Jin'rokh, Horridon) so think over carefully replacing it.
  • Glyph of Riptide makes your standard HW rotation much more mana intensive. DO NOT use it to blanket Riptides on the raid. That'll eat your mana in no time. Even then, it's a non-trivial increase in mana-cost. The alternative that I use is to glyph Chain Heal and use that for my third spell after Riptide; RT - HW - HW - CH - RT etc...
  • Sacrificing Elemental Mastery for Ancestral Swiftness will gain you more long-term throughput at the cost of burst throughput. I recommended using EM with Ascendance to maximize the gain from both; that makes the result more than the sum of the parts, and you'll lose out on your Ascendance healing by a lot. I find that Ascendance overheals a LOT after the first couple of seconds (due to everyone else's AoE heals going off too) so I like the extra burst which gives me a chance to get more of that as effective healing.

Ascendance >> Unleash elements >> Healing Rain >> Healing Stream Tot >> Riptide >> GHW >> GHW

Not a good order to do it. Pop UE and place Healing Rain first, then use Ascendance (it's off the GCD) immediately. The cast time at the start of Ascendance is a waste of burst healing (the cast time is ~3s which is AGES in Ascendance). If Asc is still up and your HR runs out, it can then be worth recasting during Ascendance if you have a big Haste buff like Elemental Mastery.

While under Ascendance, you will get more net healing from ignoring HST until you have a spare GCD, but the extra smartheal could save lives so do this at your discretion.

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Hello to the masses.

I am one of 2 or 3 healers in a raid that is just starting progression in 10 player TOT. We are only 3 bosses in at this point. I am always looking for ways to improve my healing skill and numbers. I find this easy to do with my dps characters because of simcraft; but I have no luck finding any such thing for shamans. So I read as much as I can from several sources. Haste break point has me confused. I believe my haste is likely too low and my mastery might be too high but it seems that every time I mess around with my stat weights, I am worse off. So I am wondering if any of the subject matter experts here can look at my char stats and tell me what you see? I do not have a raid that provides the 5% haste buff. I do have 4 piece. I do follow a stringent rotation..well, set of rules....for the fights that allow them. So my play style is not what is concerning me now, just my stats and how to set these up properly for Robot.

Thank you for taking the time to read all that dribble and thank you again for your time in responding.

http://us.battle.net...atloot/advanced

I have changed out the gem in my helm to rivers edge but armory has not updated that just yet.

Been playing Shaman for 5 of my 8 years in wow, so I think I do have some knowledge in this.

I was a Priest healer for 2 years, and a Tank for 1 (first started WoW as a Warrior).

I have been DPS for pretty much ALL of my Shaman experience, and always as Elemental. Just recently I switched to Resto / Enhanced because it's time for a change.

Haste, is in my opinion the MOST important (after spirit) for heals. The faster you can cast, the quicker you can heal. Spirit is somewhat relative and you will get many different opinions, but from my view I like the scale that haste gives everytime it increases.. There is NO hast "soft cap" for heals.. that cap is for ticks on damage, but heals are short bursts and very little HoT, maybe 12 seconds.. so you won't ever need to worry about "ticks" just recast whenever they are off CD.. it's that simple.

There is a very interesting Youtube video (search for Mop Shaman Resto guide) the guy has ZERO spirit on his items, he has reforged haste, and he is doing heroic dungeons (yes I know not a RAID) and his mana stays high, he heals ALL the time regardless if anyone needs heals or not.. to "top off" as he calls it, the damage.

I tried this method, and it WORKS! I did 4 RAIDS last night, trying different strategies, you just need Riptide glyph and Chaining Glyph (for increase chain heal distance). I healed even when someone was only 5 to 10K damaged, I just alternated, riptide, earth shield, then heal wave, rinse repeat. I threw in occassional chain heals and greater heals and every CD I popped Heal totem and Tide totem and of course a well place heal rain.

Doing this my mana stayed high (even if it's low, if you are not out you have plenty). If you need mana you have mana tide totem as well.

You won't find any simulator to test your heals on.. there is no way you can compare, EVERY instance, and EVERY toon is different.. if they stand in fire, or boss decides to focus damage, or they take damage (such as fire) and they have 0% resistance to fire they take more damage than someone with 20% resistance.

NO way to predict any of this.. You just have to make it work with your style of play.

Having been DPS for YEARS, and tier full 7, 8, 9, 10.. I *WAS* number 1 DPS in every fight, period. so I am VERY familiar with the recount skada damage meters. I do NOT agree with the HpS meter, that's hogwash.

to me your heals are to keep people alive not a competition for how much you can throw out due to a situation and say your heals are better than mine.. maybe YOU waited for someone to get low so you can give a HUGE heal just to get your numbers high..

There is only 1 metric and is DEATH. Did anyone die on your watch? NO? Well then you did your job!

What else matters, nothing!

In looking at your toon I have this:

Get those glyphs I mentioned in addition to your elemental.

Take your Elemental spec, put your heal gear on. Go to askmrrbot and let it decide what you need to optimize your toon.

Use those as a guideline, don't reforge out of spirt as a healer, and change ALL gems that add spirt and make them appropriate.

For example you have spirit on your helm.. do NOT forsake Intellect for Spirit..Use the same gem as you have on chest, 80 int160 spirit..

That's my advice.

Don't let meters or other healers bother you, do the best you can, if your mana is still there at the end of fights then you did an efficient job. That's ALL anyone can say.

Edited by rjparker1

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Good info from Xinto there. My thoughts;

WALL OF TEXT WARNING

Companions

What stats you like is HEAVILY influenced by who you're raiding with. What classes are your fellow healers? Anyone who works with absorbs a lot (i.e. Disc or Paladin) makes your choice of heavy Mastery sub-optimal.

Haste Soft Cap

Effectively for Resto at the moment, you only have the Earthliving breakpoints as softcaps. You can take these if you want, but in 10-man it's worth bugger all IMHO. It does basically no healing unless you're running either the Riptide glyph or are getting loads of people in your Healing Rain (which in 10's is almost certainly not).

Haste is technically the best stat for throughput, but remember that it's mana-negative so you'll run OOM in a flash. This is why it's not chosen as a priority for us. The best way to approach Haste is to decide how much you're comfortable with in terms of cast-speed and go with that. For me, I choose to go with as little Haste as possible because I'm happy with slow cast times.

In general I agree with this post, however the fact that you run out of mana means you are reusing abilities more often than the fact the abilities are faster to proc... that makes no sense to me.

You press greater heal, it does 20K heal regardless if it's a 3.5 sec or a 5 sec cast..like you said at the end..

If you find that you're being beaten to the heals a lot, you might want to increase your Haste.

That's the key, for me FASTER is better but Haste does NOT consume more mana...

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This is the type of information that makes me a better resto shaman. Thank you.

The other healers are Disc Priest and a Holy Pally.

I have wondered about those two talents in particular. I am going to make those changes and we are picking back up tonight on Council so that will be a good fight for trying these out.

Interesting comment on the haste. I think I have been more confused and worked up about all the haste information than anything else of late. Thank you for lending a sane mind to the haste madness!

Healing Surge. I never use it. I have been using chain, lesser or greater only. I don't think I understand what benefits (if any) there are in using surge instead of lesser or greater. Do you yourself typically use this in any particular circumstance?

I reserve Healing Surge on myself, since I use Ancestral Swiftness, I macro the instant cast for an instant self heal.. healing surge is rather "needy" but useful just the same.

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That's the key, for me FASTER is better but Haste does NOT consume more mana...

Each heal costs the same mana, but since you can cast more (faster heals = more often). This means that you run out of mana faster. If you're not chain-casting heals, this is a valid way of playing but is likely to be sub-optimal in many cases. The fact remains that, when you stack Haste instead of another stat and use the same rotation you will run out of mana in less time. This is why Haste is known as being "mana-negative" formally in most theorycrafting circles.

The focus of most theorycrafting is usually to get the most HPS without foregoing on mana (with the idea being that when it is important, you will be gasping for mana regardless and it's therefore important to maximize your heals per mana [HPM]). Since Haste is mana-negative, we therefore only really want it when it gets us *extra free healing* (i.e. extra HoT ticks). This is only the case when you hit a haste "softcap" (technically a "break-point"), which is why we talk exclusively about Haste breakpoints. If you still disagree, then I imagine that some well-known theorycrafters would disagree with you in general.

If you need mana you have mana tide totem as well.

This is the wrong way to approach Mana Tide. Use it early (at ~80% mana) and then on cooldown throughout the fight. This maximizes your available mana pool. This is optimal, unless you are being used as a "mana-battery" for other healers, in which case you will already know when and how to use MTT.

There is only 1 metric and is DEATH. Did anyone die on your watch? NO? Well then you did your job!

I'm afraid this is a naive way of looking at the issue. Healers are all about metrics - you are correct in saying that HPS meters are not the way to tell whether one healer is better than another. However, HPS meters record your spell usage, what you did correctly, what you did wrong, and allow you to compare directly how you did on the last fight with how you did on that fight last wipe/kill. Use the meter as a self-improvement tool. What I'm saying is that Deaths are NOT the only metric. A good healer should use ALL of the metrics at their disposal.

Finally, and using my moderator voice, I will state that I disapprove strongly of people using their claimed excellence as a basis for their arguments. Any opinion must be backed up by a rational argument and/or data. "Look how good I am therefore I am right" does not cut it. I will warn, delete, or otherwise moderate posts of people who I feel are breaking this rule. Repeated offenders will not be welcome here, although nobody has broken this rule so far. Consider this fair warning.

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This is the wrong way to approach Mana Tide. Use it early (at ~80% mana) and then on cooldown throughout the fight. This maximizes your available mana pool. This is optimal, unless you are being used as a "mana-battery" for other healers, in which case you will already know when and how to use MTT.

I'm afraid this is a naive way of looking at the issue. Healers are all about metrics - you are correct in saying that HPS meters are not the way to tell whether one healer is better than another. However, HPS meters record your spell usage, what you did correctly, what you did wrong, and allow you to compare directly how you did on the last fight with how you did on that fight last wipe/kill. Use the meter as a self-improvement tool. What I'm saying is that Deaths are NOT the only metric. A good healer should use ALL of the metrics at their disposal.

Well since I have done Priests heals and now Shaman heals i figure if I still have mana left over, there is no efficiency to do better. If I take into account everything you stated, what I can do better and what can be done more efficiently, than the use of MTT isn't much help since mana management isn't my problem. I figure mana is still there, if I am not OOM at the end of the fight my tank is sufficient. Maybe other healers are beating me to the punch in a fight, so therefore I don't get to truly use all my "big" heals.. don't need to.

I look at HPS as a log, if you have a server and everything is working well, you never look at logs, no need to since nothing is broken. If the server crashes or locks up THEN logs become important because it's insight into what could be wrong.

In a boss segment everyone is alive, Boss dies before enrage and we all have our mana intact (as well as can be expected) then HPS is a worthless stat, there is no reason to diagnose or rehash what is obviously not broken.

If you go to horridon, and people constantly die, we never kill boss, over and over THEN you look at heals and someone says hey you aren't healing with xyz, when the adds appear, or whatever.. there is a problem, we adjust we retry now I find that when my heals are tossing about and I am suddenly dry in my mana pool.. ok now we can work on efficiency and working on the use of MTT to be used early.

That's why I said HPS isn't useful, it's there in CASE things are not done correctly, but like you said, claimed excellence (which is exaclty how I view the HPS meters) is abused.. it's a way to show off.

People have DPS meters, but in a RAID they ask, "do someone have DPS meters?" They can use that as a reason to BRAG, and that's why I say it's reliance is overused by a very wide margin, DPS and HPS. It's ALL relative, we are a TEAM, not a group of "experts" trying to attain the same goal.. the boss is dead, there are no winners no losers, there are only accomplished professionals doing satisfactory performance...

That's why I hate status reports, and graphs, and Employees of the month.. we have none of that in WoW, it's a game, pure entertainment.. we play for fun not be judged by others at how "well" we have fun. This isn't a competition..

The FUN is the reward for playing. If you take it more seriously than that, you have some VERY real problems. Yes there are people that need to keep the play entertaining for others, but that's why we have guilds.. play with you know, and virtual realms will also help fix this, and I believe when Virtual Realms becomes more routine, guilds will disband.. all of them. There is no need for guilds if you can have your "circle of friends".

There will not be any "gloating" among friends, because no one is going to care.

We should be simply gauging what we do by the outcome of the result, if a Boss dies and we all get loot (even if it's not what we expect) that should be reward enough, no difference in performance, no I can do better than you meters.. it's all in the journey not in the claim to fame.. there are no celebrities in WoW. You are a good player because you can play more often and when you want.. doesn't mean you possess more talent.

Edited by rjparker1

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I completely disagree that "killing the boss" is the only measurable outcome that matters, but that is a difference in philosophy rather than a difference in fact. The fact remains that for those people who want to do measurably better, the key word is measurably. That is why people are here, and that is why we talk about meters.

Since we talk about measurable improvements and statistics, using meters is unavoidable. However, the only bad reason to use meters is to compare different players. All other uses (at all other times) are good uses of meters. You can get a lot of information on your play style and room for improvement, and some people (myself included) derive a lot of joy from personal improvement. There is nothing fundamentally wrong with this, and indeed many of the players who come to the Icy Veins forums feel this way. There are many different reasons for playing WoW and we do not like any of them to be criticized.

Haste stacking can be a viable and fun playstyle, but when one is looking to do as well as one can, it's probably not optimal. If you have fun playing Haste-stacking, I'm not trying to take that away from you. What I'm saying is that those people looking to do better should not expect it to work well for them (although yes, it varies, try it out if you think you'd like it).

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I look at HPS as a log, if you have a server and everything is working well, you never look at logs, no need to since nothing is broken. If the server crashes or locks up THEN logs become important because it's insight into what could be wrong.

I disagree, using your server analogy, you have to check logs so you can plan ahead for what you can improve before you NEED to improve/fix. Looking at something only when its not working isn't something I agree with, monitoring how well it is doing is vital to continue a good "server uptime" and efficiency.

If you go to horridon, and people constantly die, we never kill boss, over and over THEN you look at heals and someone says hey you aren't healing with xyz, when the adds appear, or whatever.. there is a problem, we adjust we retry now I find that when my heals are tossing about and I am suddenly dry in my mana pool.. ok now we can work on efficiency and working on the use of MTT to be used early.

If you can improve your own healing you can make the encounter easier for other and give them room to improve/or conversely, give them an easier and more enjoyable gaming experience depending on the gamer.

That's why I said HPS isn't useful, it's there in CASE things are not done correctly, but like you said, claimed excellence (which is exaclty how I view the HPS meters) is abused.. it's a way to show off.

As Stoove pointed out, meters are VERY useful for SELF improvement, not to assessing yourself against others which is what you're infering, which hasn't been mentioned or implied once in this thread.

We should be simply gauging what we do by the outcome of the result, if a Boss dies and we all get loot (even if it's not what we expect) that should be reward enough, no difference in performance, no I can do better than you meters.. it's all in the journey not in the claim to fame.. there are no celebrities in WoW.

The aim of progression is to improve (to progress), from your point of view I can only see two outcomes (wipe or kill it) but thats not the case, the can kill the boss with only 1 person alive at the end. Or after 10min instead of 8 because you lost your main dps as you couldn't heal enough when it was needed ... even with enough mana at the end of the fight. Or ofc a tank had to use a major cd which had already been planed for a later part in the fight, meaning he dies later when he doesn't have the capacity to mitigate it when he had planned to.

It takes planning and knowing your class (I am in no way saying you don't know your class or your play style) but meters can really help you know your class much better and analyse how well you have been playing now compared to before, even if both times you killed the boss (or both times you wiped!)

Now going back to what this thread was about, the thread you decided to post it, self improvement of throughput in the meters. doing more effective healing through a fight. I like your suggestion and would happily try it but I would need meters to gauge how well it was working and if its an improvement over what I was doing before.

Also I would like to point out, if you have nothing to compare your healing with (which you clearly agree, other characters aren't appropriate) then you need to use logs of yourself to see how things worked out.

You are a good player because you can play more often and when you want.. doesn't mean you possess more talent.

I really don't agree with what I think you are saying here, it doesn't matter how much talent you have for playing the game, its skill which can be improved and wanting to improve your own skill at playing the game is natural and very enjoyable for some. Its actually what I guage my playing on, how well am I doing not to before.

In any case, thank you for post some suggestions and putting across a different point of view, for a lot of us we find it really interesting to know others views and experiences as they can lead to our own improvement.

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Haste stacking can be a viable and fun playstyle, but when one is looking to do as well as one can, it's probably not optimal. If you have fun playing Haste-stacking, I'm not trying to take that away from you. What I'm saying is that those people looking to do better should not expect it to work well for them (although yes, it varies, try it out if you think you'd like it).

I'm jumping in on this post because it is really interesting :)

I will start out by saying I strongly disagree with you on the haste point! I know most of the people in the discussion currently are gearing up in normal ToT which means that they don't have access to BIS items. Nothing wrong with that ofc. I'm currently sitting at 5/13 HC, which means I've got a bit more gear (around 530 ilvl atm). However, throughout my gearing I tried different setups and I see some clear tendencies!

As a starter - the good old shaman mastery rule still works: The harder the content, the more mastery you need. "Hard" means consistent, large amount of healing. If you are progressing on Horridon normal, you don't need huge amounts of mastery! Why? Because the dmg the raid receives is fairly low spike dmg. Esp. when playing with a priest, your raidmembers will stay at low health for a very short time, which greatly d evaluates your mastery. I would go a more crit heavy build if you are doing ToT normal. Simply because of the way the encounters are designed.

And here we come back to haste again. The point about haste being mana negative is true on a fight like Jink'rock or Iron Qon perhaps, where you have consistent AoE dmg over a long period of time. However, let's face it - very few encounters in ToT are designed like that. Instead, most of the dmg your raid will receive is spiky dmg. This is where haste becomes very handy! You want those spikes healed up as quickly as possible!!

Ofc, if you do not get the 5% spell haste buff it's gonna be hard for you to reach the breakpoints. Are you sure you don't have either a boomkin, Elemental shaman or hunter in the raid? If you have a hunter, he MUST pop a Sporebat (Spellhaste).

My advice would be to reach the highest haste-breakpoint you can, without having to use more than a few haste gems. Haste is NOT only to "heal before everyone else does", it actually boosts your output a lot, because of the extra tick on Healing raid, Healing Stream Totem etc. With my 532 ilvl I'm sitting at the 30% haste-breakpoint and my healing is really strong. Not only for the spike dmg, but also for fights like Megaera. I'm not a theory-crafter, I got most of my healing tips from actually raiding through many years, and the exact numbers for break-points I've found right on this site! So I have no theorycrafting to back what I'm saying up. But when that's said, I am pulling pretty decent numbers theses days, going heavy haste.

We did an experiment in my guild tonight, trying to see how high of an HPS I could reach. This was with 30% haste (5% from boomkin) and I ended at 190k HPS on Magaera normal... Say what you want, but haste is not as terrible a stat as you might think!

Anyways, I'm very interested in hearing what your further thoughts are! :)

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                        - Static Barrier is gained from using the head item: Electromagnetic Gigaflux Reactivator. The effect will stay even while unequipped.
       
      Threat Diminishers
      Aggro and threat from teammates is another daunting obstacle to tackle with. Conveniently, there are ways for heavy hitting classes to reduce their threat. To begin with, ranged classes are highly adored because if they were to mistakenly get aggro, they are likely at that sweet 30-40yrd range, so it's easier to supervise. Also characters standing out of the 30-40yrd range will not draw aggro until they exceed the threat level of the mob's current target by 30% as opposed to 10% for melee classes. Here are a few examples of diminishers or dumps in no particular order:
      Rogue reduce their threat w/Feint & flat our wipe threat w/Vanish. It might disrupt their rotation but it's appreciated. Mage who have taken the talent: Frost Channeling or the talent Burning Soul is their overall way to reduce threat. Druid who are mainly spending time in cat form have Cower & healing druids can obtain Subtlety through talents. Priest have two of the easiest threat reducers to acquire, within the discipline talent Silent Resolve and the spell Fade Shaman within the restoration talent tree can obtain: Healing Grace & casting the basic spell: Tranquil Air Totem. Additionally, there are some threat reducing items that drop in the latter portion of raiding content that are used in raids to combat the threat produced. This is good news because serious petal to the metal fury warriors generate a tremendous amount of threat. So we are grateful for the melee trinket Fetish of the Sand Reaver and the caster trinket Eye of Diminution used by fire mages and destruction warlocks. Advise your high dpser's to keep an eye out for these items. Also, an honorable mention should be made for the potion Limited Invulnerability Potion and its aggro reassignment effect as well as its halt on additional threat. All that was mentioned is also useful for bosses that reset threat globally due to a unique boss mechanic, a timely potion pop from teammates can help you quickly establish threat. There are some servers, where Flask of Petrification not only removes aggro but the debuff/buff it places can be clickable-off but these instances are rare and its unclear if that was the item's original intention. This guide will continue without considering this item as a key component to tanking.

      Rotations
      First, on the list is a simple rotation and we’ll be presuming the enemy is a simple tank-spank and has very minimal or no nature resistance allowing our totemic friend to freely cause havoc unhindered. For the time being we are sticking with a basic rotation. A more complex rotation will be addressed later on as well as a solution to completely nature immune targets. The following rotation is split into several sections to better highlight the course of action.
      Pre-pull: Begin by casting Lightning Shield Rank7. Next, make sure before pulling the mob all possible buffs are present on you and on their maximum duration. Refer to the section Buffs for suggestions. Next, position the appropriate totems on the ground. Lastly, if it hasn't been done yet, install the addon: KTM Threat, which displays the list of members and the amount of threat they each deal. I can't stress how much a scenario can go from peaceful to chaotic in the blink of an eye, so watch KTM at all times. At any moment, you need to be confident of the fitting Earth Shock rank to use, healers will be especially grateful. Pulling: Face the boss and cast a Rank10 Lightning Shield or Rank4 Chain Lightning and follow it up with a Rank7 Earth Shock. Bearing everything goes smoothly, proceed with a Rank5 Earth Shock and turn the boss away from the group. If the enemy suddenly targets a raid member or drops aggro due to a unique mechanic, lob a Rank7 Earth Shock to effectively redirect the boss to you, if engineering was chosen the next action is to throw a Goblin Sapper Charge. For foreseeable threat problems refer to the previous topic Threat Management. Secondly, is a rotation that deals with some bosses who are completely immune to nature. However, we can rectify this problem by replacing instances of nature damage with Frost Shock or Flame Shock. Because we lost the ability to use a massive threat inducing ability, we must cater to increasing the damage of Frost Shock/Flame Shock as much as possible. This means making sure debuffs, such as: Winter's chill are present. Funnily, enough Flame Shock can come very close to the threat produced by our lost brother, Earth Shock. This is possible with a near constant uptime of the debuff: Flame Buffet by fellow teammates among many other fire related debuffs.
      Thirdly is a rotation and as promised a more complex rotation against non-resistant nature targets, this rotation yields unbelievable results but requires good gear, buffs, etc... Only experienced shaman tanks should consider the following:
      Pre-pull: Equip spell damage gear and cast Rank7 Lightning Shield and drink mana. Equip 3 pieces of Stormcaller's Garb Equip the Augur's Regalia set. Place a Mana Spring Totem (it gives threat to you) Activate Oil of immolation. Place a Stoneclaw Totem in front of you and back up 25-30yrds. (This totem will later on make the boss stop for 0.5 seconds or boss will attack totem) Use Unconscious Dig Rat and cast Rank1 Lightning Bolt on the rat to proc the nature effect or try and get Flurry and Elemental Devastation instead, your choice. (a mage can polymorph the rat, until it triggers.) Pulling: Cast Rank10 Lightning Bolt While the bolt travels, equip tanking gear. Cast R6 Lesser Healing Wave twice on a warlock that has recently life-tapped. Cast R4 Chain Lightning, immediately after cast R7 Earth Shock. Activate Juju Flurry and Juju Escape, if the situation is ideal. Repeat max rank Earth Shock until boss is dead. Buffs
      As you probably know a character can have a theoretical cap of 32 beneficial buffs. The limit may differ from server to server or what is acknowledged as a buff. Prioritize collecting survival buffs before acquiring damage buffs, Agility for example has the added byproduct of helping with survival and threat. Disclaimer: because of the nature and duties of an OT, less damage is taken, therefore, it is not 100% necessary to aim for survival buffs. Also, some buffs are unobtainable due to certain patch restrictions or unable to stack with others. On a side note, I suggest installing NirkBuffRemover/NBR to help with overall buff management and ease of mind. Down below is a table of relevant buffs, separated into sub groups to better highlight their usefulness. Resistance buffs/totems are disregarded.
            Threat Increasing Buffs
      Rallying Cry of the Dragonslayer: +140 Attack power, +10% spell crit & +5% melee. Fengus' Ferocity: +200 Attack power Trueshot Aura: +50 Attack Power. Battle Shout: +185 Attack power for 2 min. (increased by warrior talent & T2 warrior set equipped before casting) Juju Might: +40 Attack power.   
      Sayge's Dark Fortune of Agility: +10% Agility or +10% damage. (A damage version of this buff also exists) Ground Scorpok Assay: +25 Agility. Elixir of the Mongoose: +25 Agility, +2% Melee Crit. (the agi won't stack w/Agamaggan's Agilitiy but the crit will) Agamaggan's Agility: +10 Agility for 30min. Grace of Air Totem: +77 Agility (effect is increased through a shaman talent) Call of the Raptor: +12 Agility for 30min. (non-repeatable quest reward item) Grilled Squid: +10 Agility for 10min. (does not stack with other food buffs)  
      Strength of Earth Totem: +77 Strength. (effect is increased through a shaman talent) Agamaggan's Strength: +10 Strength for 30 min.  
      Atiesh, Greatstaff of the Guardian: +2% spell crit to all party members within 30 yards. (Can't stack with Moonkin Form) Slip'kik's Savvy: +3% Spell Crit. Moonkin Form: +3% Spell Crit.   Wisdom of Agamaggan: +10 Intellect for 30 min. Headmaster's Charge: +20 Intellect. Arcane Intellect: +31 Intellect.  
      Gnomish Battle Chicken: +5% Attack Speed for 4 min. Warchief's Blessing: +15% Melee Haste, +300 Hp, 10 mana regen every 5 seconds. Fist of Shahram: Grants 25% haste to the party for 8 sec. Juju Flurry: +3% Attack Speed for 20 sec. Swift Wind: +40% run speed & +30% attack speed for 1 hr. (Only receivable upon completing the Call of Air shaman quest)  
      Mana Spring Totem: +10 mana every 2 sec. Mageblood Potion: +12 mana per 5 sec. Innervate: Increases Mana regen by 400% for 20 sec.  
      Oil of Immolation: Deals 50 Fire dmg to target within 5yds every 3 sec for 15 sec. Lightning Shield: Deals 226 Nature dmg to melee attackers until 3 charges are struck off by the enemy. Static Barrier: Deals 5 Nature dmg to melee attackers. Crystal Spire: Deals 12 Nature dmg to melee attackers. (the quest is repeatable and any class can cast this) Fire Shield: Deals 13 Fire dmg to melee attackers. Thorns: Deals 18 Nature dmg to melee attackers.(32 dmg talented + tier set)  
      Flask of Supreme Power: +150 damage done by magical spells & effects for 2 hr. Only 1 flask can be active at a time. Greater Arcane Elixir: +20 dmg dealt from spells & abilities. Traces of Silithyst: +5% dmg to melee, range and spell damage dealt. Power Infusion: The target receives +20% spell damage & healing for 15 sec.  
      Songflower Serenade: Increases a melee, ranged, or spell to crit by 5%, +15 all stats. Mark of the Chosen: 2% chance when struck in combat of increasing all stats by 25 for 1 min. Spirit of Zandalar: +10 move speed, +15 all stats. Mark of the Wild: +384 armor, +162 all attributes,+270 all resistance.  
      Elixir of Greater Firepower: Increases spell fire damage by up to 40 for 30 min.  Blessing of Blackfathom: Increases intellect and spirit by 5 and frost damage done by 15. Elixir of Frost Power: Increases spell frost damage by up to 15 for 30 min.  
      Dragonbreath Chili: Often deals ~68 dmg at targets in melee. (scales w/spell damage) (can't stack with other food buffs). Here is a screenshot of common threat dealing buffs. With the Threat Increasing buffs out of the way, lets proceed to look at buffs that increase our chances of surviving a fight. Although, there is no strict order, you should still prioritize getting world buffs before obtaining other buffs. In the scenario some of the following buffs are not obtainable for whatever reason, they will be separated into categories to provide alternative solutions.
            Survival Increasing Buffs
      Sayge's Dark Fortune of Stamina: +10% Stamina or +10% Armor. (A armor version of this buff also exists) Dirge's Kickin' Chimaerok Chops: +25 Stamina. (does not stack with other food buffs) Rumsey Rum Black Label: +15 Stamina. Power Word: Fortitude (Priest): +54 Stamina. Mol'dar's Moxie: +15% Stamina overall. Spirit of Zanza: +50 Stamina, +50 spirit. Admiral's Hat: +10 Stamina (must be applied by group member & then they logout) Blood Pact: +42 Stamina (the amount of stamina can be increased through a warlock talent)  
      Flask of the Titans: +1200 Hp. Elixir of Fortitude: +120 Hp. Regrowth Dreamwalker Raiment tier set bonus 6/6 (Druid): Increase max hp of target by 50, stacks 7 times.  
      The Lion Horn of Stormwind: When hit has a 1% chance of increasing the party's armor by +250. (2 can be equipped) Greater Stoneshield Potion: +2000 Armor for 2min. Elixir of Superior Defense: +450 Armor. Crystal Ward (allies can also cast): +200 Armor. Inspiration (Priest): Increases armor by 25% for 15 sec. (might not stack with Razorhide buff).  
      Power Word: Shield: Absorb 1105 dmg for 30 sec. When active, casting isn't interrupted by dmg... Scarab Brooch: Heals give a shield absorbing dmg equal to 15% of the amount healed for 30 sec. (can be item swapped) Greater Heal Vestments of Faith tier set bonus 4/4 (Priest): On critical hits, cast shield absorbing 500 damage.  
      Bloodkelp Elixir of Dodging: +3% dodge for 30 min. Juju Escape: +5% Dodge for 10 sec.  
      Healing Stream Totem (Shaman): Place a totem for 1 min healing group members within 20 yards for 14 every 2 sec. Greater Heal Renew Vestments of Transcendence tier set bonus. GH is now a Hot & equivalent to a rank5 Renew. Rejuvenation (Druid): Heal for 888 over 12 sec. Regrowth (Druid): Heal for 1064 over 21 sec. Renew (Priest): Heal for 970 damage over 15 sec.  
      Stoneskin Totem: Reduce melee damage taken by 30. (effect is increased through a shaman talent). Dampen Magic (Mage): Decreases damage from spells by 135 & healing spells by 270.  Amplify Magic: Increase dmg taken from spells by 112 & healing spells by up to 225.  
      Mind Control Buffs
      I wouldn't be thorough if I didn't mention the wonderful world of Mind Control buffing. It is possible for an alliance priest to use their basic shadow spell: Mind Control or someone with the engineering to create and use the head slot item Gnomish Mind Control Cap against players of the opposing faction. For that duration the mind controlled Horde character is now considered an Alliance player. This allows the character to receive buffs from paladins. In the many guild raids I’ve taken part, we'd have 2-3 players log onto to their lvl 60 pallies and level 60 priests and stationed themselves near the raid entrance or zone for mind control buffing. Before undertaking this endeavor, be sure that the server allows for the Mind Control possibility and find out its exact limits. Tip: Try and get Fear Ward from a dwarf priest and if survivability is not and issue get Curse of Recklessness from a horde warlock as well.
      Greater Blessing of Sanctuary: Reduce dmg from all sources by 24. If you block a melee attack the attacker takes 35 Holy dmg.  Greater Blessing of Salvation: Reducing the amount of all threat generated by 30% for 15 min. (higher threat reduction than Tranquil Air Totem) Tip: Although, this is not beneficial for a shaman tank, raid members with high threat should get this. Note: Sadly, this does not stack with Tranquil Air Totem.  Greater Blessing of Wisdom: +45 mana per 5 seconds. Note: Icon vanishes if Mana Totem casted but effect remains. Greater Blessing of Might: +222 melee attack power for 15min. (Grants more attack power than Strength of Earth Totem.) Note: Try and convince the others in the group to forgo WF totem (pref. tank group) because WF totem does not stack with Strength of Earth Totem or Might. However, Imp. Greater Blessing of Might has its place in a group without a shaman. Greater Blessing of Kings: +10% to all stats for 15 min.  Improved Lay on Hands: +30% bonus to armor value from items for 2 min. Tip: When the buff expires, leave raid & get rebuffed by nearby paladin/priest & resummon back into the instance.
      The fun doesn't stop there. It is also possible for a priest of any faction to Mind Control certain mobs which can be controlled to dish out beneficial buffs to all raid members. In order, to fully utilize the duration of these buffs, its advised to have warlock be ready for immediate summoning.
      Fury of Ragnaros: From Twilight Emissary in BRD, he increases the magical damage dealt by an ally by 25 for 30 min. Resist Arcane: From Scarlet Medic in Plaguelands, increases Arcane resistance by 78 for 1 hr.  Resist Fire: Scarshield Spellbinder in BWL, he increases an ally's Fire resistance by 81 for 1 hr.  Bloodlust: Gordok Mage-Lord in DM, increases an ally's attack speed by 60% for ONLY 30 sec.  Bloodlust: Hamhock in Stockades, increases an ally's attack speed by 30% for ONLY 30 sec.
        Special Event Buffs
      On an ending note for buffs, we can also get buffs from special events/holidays. An example, is The Midsummer Fire Festival a seasonal event that celebrates the hottest season of the year. It starts on the (earthly) northern summer solstice, and lasts about two weeks (mid-late June to early July, usually). The next ones are Love is in the Air, Lunar Festival, Wickerman Festival and Scourge Invasion that all feature some useful buffs for tanking. It is possible for the Love is in the Air Capital Gift Collection buffs to be stacked with each other, ask around to find out its exact limits. The following buffs are separated by their event.
      Stormwind Gift Collection: Increases Intellect by 30 for 1 hour. Undercity Gift Collection: Increases Intellect by 30 for 1 hour.  Orgrimmar Gift Collection: Increases Agility by 30 for 1 hour.  Darnassus Gift Collection: Increases Agility by 30 for 1 hour. Ironforge Gift Collection: Increases Stamina by 30 for 1 hour.  Thunder Bluff Gift Collection: Increases Stamina by 30 for 1 hour.   
      Fire Festival Fortitude: Increases Stamina by 30 for 1 hour. (stack with the stamina buff above) Midsummer Sausage: Increases damage done from spells by up to 23 for 1 hr.  Bonfire's Blessing: 30% chance to deal 60 Fire dmg on any melee, ranged, or spell attack. (works outside only) Fire-toasted Bun: Improves your chance to hit by 2% for 1 hr. Fire Festival Fury: Increases critical strike percent and spell critical strike percent by 3% for 1 hr.  
      Elderberry Pie: Increases Defense by 13 for 1 hr. Buttermilk Delight: Increases Defense by 13 for 1 hr. Very Berry Cream: Increases damage done from spells by up to 23 for 1 hr. Dark Desire: Improves your chance to hit by 2% for 1 hr.  
      Celebrate Good Times!: +10% to all stats for 30min.  
      Elune's Blessing: All stats increased by 10% for 1hr.  
      Invocation of the Wickerman: Increase health & mana regeneration by 25% and Stamina by 25%.  
      Soul Revival: Increases all damage caused by 10% for 30 minutes.
        Debuffs
      Having as many debuffs on the boss as possible is of paramount importance to tanking. Therefore, our interests are heavily tied to the release of patch 1.7, due to its extra 8 debuff slots introduction totaling to 16 debuffs. Tanking before patch 1.7 can be quite a troublesome route. All debuffs on the list below benefit us in either threat or survival and assumed to be at their maximum rank/talent improvement.
      Curse of Recklessness: - 290 armor but bolsters melee attack power by 45. Only 1 curse can be active on any 1 target. Expose Armor: Reduce armor per combo point. (can't stack w/Sunder Armor but reduces more than it)  Sunder Armor: Reduce armor by 450. Can be applied up to 5 times. Lasts 30 sec. Annihilator: Reduces an enemy's armor by 200. Stacks up to 3 times. Faerie Fire: Reduces armor by 505 for 40 sec. While active, the target cannot stealth or go invisible.  
      Imp. Shadow Bolt (Warlock): Shadow Bolt critical strikes bolster Shadow damage dealt to target by 20% until 4 non... Curse of Shadow: Reduce Shadow & Arcane resistance by 75 & increasing Shadow & Arcane damage taken by 10%.  Shadow Weaving (Priest): Shadow damage spells have a 100% chance to cause your target to be vulnerable to Shadow damage. This vulnerability increases the Shadow damage dealt to your target by 3% and lasts 15 sec. Stacks up to 5 times.   
      Wail of the Banshee: After a 1.5sec cast, reduce target's chance to hit by 10% for 12 sec. (usually casted by healers)  Insect Swarm (Druid): Reduce target's chance to hit by 2% & causes 324 Nature damage over 12 sec.   
      Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker: Periodically deal 300 Nature dmg & jumping to 5 nearby enemies. Each jump reduces the victim's Nature resistance by 25. The primary target is consumed by a cyclone, slowing attack speed by 20% for 12 sec.  Thunder Clap: Increases the time between attacks by 10% for 30 sec. Will affect up to 4 targets.   
      Improved Scorch: Scorch has a 100% chance to cause your target to be vulnerable to Fire damage. This vulnerability increases the Fire damage dealt to the target by 3% and lasts 30 sec. Stacks up to 3 times. Flame Buffet (Arcanite Dragonling): Inflicts Fire damage to an enemy and increases the Fire damage it takes by 40 for 45 sec. Stacks 5 times. (The numbers in the toolitp are possibly not exact) Curse of the Elements: -75 resistance to Fire & Frost and increase Fire & Frost damage taken by 10%. Only 1 Curse per... Winter's Chill: Gives your Frost damage spells a 100% chance to apply the Winter's Chill effect, which increases the chance a Frost spell will critically hit the target by 2% for 15 sec. Stacks up to 5 times.  
      Gift of Arthas: If an enemy strikes the imbiber, the attacker has a 30% chance of being inflicted with disease that increases dmg taken by 8 for 3 min. Lasts 30 min.   
      Nightfall: Spell damage taken by target increased by 15% for 5 sec.   
      Demoralizing Shout (Warrior): Reduce melee attack power of enemies within 10 yards by 140 for 30 sec.  
      Curse of Weakness: Damage caused by target is reduced by 31 for 2 min. (effect is increased through a warlock talent)
        Gear
      Finding the perfect balance of gear will be the hardest aspect of this subject. To this day there is still a debate between the usefulness of stamina over dodge in the tanking community. If unsure of your guild’s performance, I recommend carrying several focused gear sets: a Stamina, Dodge and armor set in your bags to accommodate any encounters that might arise. For some players, a mix and match of particular gear stats may be needed, to compensate in other lacking aspects. Down below is a document with a plethora of options for proper gearing.
                  Gear Spreadsheet Link
      A few things need to be remembered while gearing. Down the road, the universally top-grade gear gives hit chance as an unintended byproduct. Install the addon: “Outfitter” to assist with handling specific sets of gear against the numerous bosses out there. To give an example of a gear set, down below on image #1 is an armor centric set designed for bosses that deal high physical damage but don't require much threat. Image #2 to the right is a gear set focused on generating threat while retaining some survivability.

      An item of notable value in the image#1 is: Zandalarian Hero Badge in the first trinket slot. This trinket can be activated before a boss fight and swap out for another item, these types of items are referred to as "Pre-Activated Items". Note: Pre activating items are very situational and not included in the google doc spreadsheet above. However, some will be listed below.
      Zandalarian Hero Badge: Can be switched out for another trinket before pulling the boss.  Defender of the Timbermaw: Can be switched out... lasts 40 sec, will heal if caster is below 50%. Petrified Scarab: Can be switched... great against bosses that cast spells.  Similar to gear, enchants must be tailored against the specific boss you will be facing. Allies can also help us, by enchanting their own cloak with Formula: Enchant Cloak - Subtlety Note: To avoid constantly having to re-enchant a piece of gear to tailor to a specific boss fights, have different versions of that gear in the bank or backpack to save on time and money. Also, the talent: Toughness does not scale with armor enchants. Down below is a spreadsheet of enchants suited for our tanking duties:
                  Enchant Spreadsheet Link
      I also suggest to keep on you Faintly Glowing Skull if you are aiming to assure the takedown of a specific boss and stay on top of aggro. The skull scales with spell damage and shadow buffs alongside related debuffs.
       
      Totems
      We’ll be asking our shamanistic brothers from the restoration side to land a hand in optimizing totem utility, so be considerate and compliment each others strengths within the group. Each individual totem listed below is in order of importance per category. Keep in mind, there can only be one type of totem per shaman so having another totem slave in the group is largely welcomed. Also the handful totems in our stockpile have different durations and don’t scale with spell damage or similar effects.
            Earth
      Stoneskin Totem: Provides a decent bulk of melee damage mitigation and generally is placed by the tanking shaman or a fellow totem brother with 2/2 Guardian Totems in the enhancement talent tree within the group. Strength of Earth Totem: Boost to attack power. Alongside benefiting the dmg of other melee users in the group. Stoneclaw Totem: Diverts loose mobs off your tail and quickly allows readjusting of a target's positioning. Tremor Totem: Mainly a situational totem to use when a boss encounter has fear, charm and sleep mechanics. Earthbind Totem: A tool for kiting/running possible unbound trash in an instance.       Fire
      Searing Totem: Damaging fire totems are a luxury during a fight. All fire totems can crit but do not cause threat to the caster. Fire Nova Totem: Ideal for bursting down low hp adds on encounters. Magma Totem: Great for tanking multiple mobs. Frost Resistance Totem: Beneficial for fights involving high doses of frost damage.       Air
      Grace of Air Totem: Roughly comes out to about 4% dodge and agi is always a pleasant stat to have and also is appreciated by the majority of other classes. A priority totem within the air types that should be taken seriously. Windfury Totem: Sadly, we are unable to benefit from this totem's effect since it is a temporary effect enchant to weapons and we already have an active temporary effect enchant, Rockbiter. However, it is appreciated by melee dps in the group and enforced by a restoration shaman with 2/2 Enhancing Totem with nothing else to do. Nature Resistance Totem: Advantageous for fights involving high doses of nature damage, such as: Ahn’Qiraj. Tranquil Air Totem: Avoid dropping in the tank group within a raid. Grounding Totem: Useful for redirecting ranged spells from susceptible mobs and bosses. Windwall Totem: Unfortunately, doesn't see much utility in most fights.       Water
      Mana Spring Totem: A very valuable totem in our arsenal. Optimally, it should be arranged by a resto shaman in the group who has the talent: Restorative Totem within the restoration talent tree. Healing Stream Totem: Typically, is planted by a resto shaman if you both come to a mutual understanding and comfortable with not having an improved Mana Spring Totem with 5/5 in the Restorative Totems. In this scenario, return the favor by placing a regular MST. HST does not generate any threat. Poison Cleansing Totem: Indispensable on fights with high poison output, ex: AQ bosses. Fire Resistance Totem: Pragmatic for fights involving high amounts of fire damage, ex MC. Disease Cleansing Totem: Unfortunately, rarely sees the light of day.
        Professions
      During the harsh and lengthy process of leveling, select Herbalism and Alchemy. A valid case can be made for also having a lvl 5 alt stationed permanently in a major city to disenchant unwanted items through mail and store items at a bank for later use. Back to the subject at hand, herbalism contributes convenient reagents for alchemy and a strong source of revenue for our eventual endgame professions. It also prevents players from spending an exorbitant portion of time pestering strangers in Orgrimmar to craft potions. The objective is straightforward, gather a substantial supply of gold and a bank chock-full of fruitful potions the raid might need. Next, I advise dropping Herbalism once the quantity of gold in one’s bags is overflowing and adopt the late game profession: engineering to scoop up a few useful tools, such as: Goblin Sapper Charge and Gnomish Battle Chicken. Finally, for secondary professions, I urge grabbing all of them as they all provide valuable assets. In terms of fishing, you can farm those elusive Stonescale Eels that are highly contested after for Flask of the Titans. First aid grants bandages for healing that dont require any mana to use. Lastly, cooking has Dragonbreath Chili a sheer delight as it not only scales with spell damage but also alongside the trinket: Arcanite Dragonling fire increasing debuff. The fire debuff scales with Goblin Sapper charge as well. All these items nicely combine into a decent boost in threat. But be mindful as only one food buff can be active at a time, cautiously evaluate the best possible food buff for the specific fight.
       
      Races
      Races play a big part as we are grasping for any amount of extra efficiency possible. Unfortunately, shamans do not exist on the Alliance side, therefore, we are being relegated to spend our fighting days with the Horde. As for race, choose wisely as once the decision is made there is no going back. Some players might want to choose a certain race to assure the clearing of a specific boss or raid.
      Tauren
      War Stomp: After 0.5 sec, stun up to 5 enemies within 8 yds for 2 sec. 2min cooldown. Endurance: Total Health increased by 5%. Cultivation: Herbalism skill increased by 15. Nature Resistance: Nature Resistance increased by 10. What does this mean?: Considered the most suited race for surviving long fights and ideally clearing ZG/AQ, which will be the first raids where difficulties will arise. The 5% hp is great and is inherently based on absolute hp, so it will scale with the amount of hp obtained from gear and world buffs. In regards to War Stomp, be cautious you cannot dodge, block, or parry while casting the spell. However, its overall usefulness outweigh this slight inconvenience. The 15 skill increase to Herbalism is also helpful and nothing to scoff at while leveling.
       
      Troll
      Throwing/Bow Specialization: Skill with Throwing/Bow Weapons increased by 5. Regeneration: Health regeneration rate increased by 10%. 10% of total Health regeneration may continue during combat. Beast Slaying: Damage dealt versus Beasts increased by 5%. Berserking: Increases your casting and attack speed by 10% to 25%. At full health the speed increase is 10% with... What does this mean?: The second leading race that converges more on setting up threat instead of having extra health as an option. Generally, threat is not problematic, if you glaringly foresee having threat issues, than I unquestionably advocate for troll above all other races. Berserking intertwined with Rockbiter Weapon is seen as an “emergency button” that alleviates healers of anxiety as a random group member quickly escalates the hate list, this is a great solution to further extend the gap in threat. Additionally, Berserking proves handy against nature immune targets. To be as thorough as possible, our long legged friends do gain an added benefit from spirit because it synergizes with their passive racial Regeneration. However, the end amount of spirit when fully buffed is insignificant to make a big impact in tanking. Trolls will also produce more threat than any other race on bosses that are beast, such as: Magmadar in MC, Whirlaxis and Gahz'ranka in ZG, etc...
       
      Orc
      Blood Fury: Increases base melee attack power by 25% for 15 sec and reduces healing effects on you by 50% for 25... Hardiness: Chance to resist Stun effects increased by an additional 25%. Command: Damage done by Hunter and Warlock pets increased by 5%. Axe Specialization: Skill with Axes and Two-Handed Axes increased by 5. What does this mean?: Last on the lineup, as Orcs sadly fall short in both survival and threat categories. Akin to the troll our green comrades focal point is threat at the compromise of potential health points and is seen as a more riskier race option considering the -50% to healing, especially detrimental for non-attentive healers. In all honesty, through our rigorous testing, they do in fact come out on top of all other races for instituting threat but it made the majority of healers very nervous. On the bright side, they proved more effective in the off-tank position. In conclusion, they plunge too deep into the situational category to be justified.
       
      Talents
      For the sake of generality and simplicity these talents setups assume a server between patch 1.9 - 1.12 and taking part in a serious guild who are confidently clearing raids. As stated earlier, the later a patch is, the easier the content is to tank. 

      14/37/0
      https://classicdb.ch/?talent#hEczZxV0bExut The default talent Image build centered around this guide, calculated as the safest to pursue and viewed as a preliminary starter pack into the world of tanking 5mans/10mans/pre-raids. Highly, suggested if you are unsure of an upcoming boss fight or are still in the learning phase of tanking. If you are desperately in need of faster threat generation, withdraw 3 points from Convection and deposit them in Reverberation or Improved Lightning Shield.
      ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

      21/30/0
      https://classicdb.ch/?talent#hE0kVc0oZEV00vxz This talent setup is mostly centered around tanking multiple targets and revolves around Chain Lightning proccing with Eye of the Storm as the main conduit for dealing damage and preserving threat on multiple targets. Because it is not possible to dodge, block, parry while casting it is ideal to employ this build versus mobs that deal little to moderate damage. Against heavy hitting targets it is advisable to grab the weapon Hand of Edward the Odd and use EOTS procs occasionally during phases with less damage or avoid points in EOTS altogether and cater to proccing Edward as much as possible by prioritizing crit and haste. Feel free to use R1 Earth Shock to not only save mana but to increase the proc chance of ED and Elemental Focus, if you don't foresee at that instant a random mob leaving you to attack a teammate. Fiery Blaze Enchantment is also recommended for this type of tanking and “possibly” scales with EF and Elemental Focus. (ask around) Refer to: Gear, for additional help on this particular subject.
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      21/30/0
      https://classicdb.ch/?talent#hAczx0hoZxV00Exuo This is the solution to individuals heavily resilient or completely immune to nature damage. Good gear alongside a solid understanding of shaman tanking is required since we loose the ability to cast Earth Shock. Therefore, we will be casting max rank Frost Shock often and require the necessary mana related item to back it up. This path is frequently taken as a player reaches 3% hit chance from gear. Among the many other topics that briefly explain potential threat solvers, also refer to the Threat Management section for help.
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      Tank Compare
      On patch 1.12 a full BIS and buffed shaman will be the closest in stats to approach a feral bear tank, let take an in-depth look at the stats to see the differences. As a guideline, the Example Druid Tank below is BIS/buffed and able to clear most bosses without a problem. A shaman like other tanks tailors his gear in accordance with the boss he will be facing. Obviously, the Example Druid Tank can reach higher numbers and has a plethora of defensive spells, but the goal is to showcase the class with the closest similarity to a shaman in stats across the board that gets the job done in raids.

      Druids have the luxury of having multiple categories covered and a broader safety net on top of having access to join Alliance for the added advantage of paladins spells, while shaman tanks are required to significantly maximize a specific category for a certain boss.
      Now, let's explores the threat generated by other classes to showcase where shaman tanks stand. Remember, threat will depend on gear, boss mechanics, etc... But in general, the current standing of tanks that can do the most threat are:
            1. Feral Druid/Warrior.
            2. Paladin/Enh Shaman.
            3. Dem warlock.
            4. Priest tanks.
      The threat we can produce comes extremely close to Paladin Tanks using Holy Mightstone, if they don't use it we surpass them. We can reach an even higher threat ranking against bosses who have little to no nature resistance or the raiding group is capable of maintaining a consistent uptime of the Flame Buffet debuff.
       
      What If
      This section explores past private server bugs and theoretical bugs that push Shaman Tanks to new heights on the raiding content spectrum. An example, is: Inspiration or/and Healing Way can be applied multiple times through different ranks. Before continuing, be sure to read the section: Comparison, to know where we initially stand with other tanks. Down below, is a compiled list in no particular order:
      Razorhide's armor buff can stack with Inspiration. Rockbiter Weapon or Windfury Weapon triggers even if your auto attacks are dodged, parry, missed, etc.. Searing Totem can trigger ED and/or generate threat for the shaman. The talent: Toughness scales with the armor granted from agility. The buff cap is increased to 35 or some buffs are not considered buffs and do not consume a slot. The Windfury Weapon enchant can trigger weapon procs among other procs.  
      Raid Composition
      Raid composition differs with each boss but its considered an acquired technique that develops over time and reflects the playstyle of a guild or raid. The following image is an example raid comp with a few minor exceptions that differ from the norm. This image is by no means the perfect raid comp since raid comps drastically fluctuate along side: content patch, gear, experience, etc... With the raid leader's permission offer your advice on an ideal comp that caters to your needs without overstepping. A decent raid will always make sure that every group has a Tranquil Air Totem enforced by restoration shamans.

      In (Group 1): On the topic of suvivability, a fellow tank in your party can equip The Lion Horn of Stormwind, granted they don't need the trinket slot for anything else. A bear can replace a prot warrior in the tank party, if the raid is comfortable enough with the idea and could probarbly use an emergency Innervate or Rebirth Also, only bring the bare minimum of tanks. This will open a spot for either: a lock with Blood Pact, or a hunter with Trueshot Aura. Rogues are favored over fury warrior, they Feint, Sprint, Evasion and Vanish to manage their threat/aggro. Feral cat druids can offer similar utilities as a bear and can Cower and Dash to manage their threat/aggro. Discipline priest with experience and ease of mind may occasionally throw a Power Infusion on a shaman tank during the pull phase to help the tank gain a larger amount of threat. In (Group 6): The shaman is elemental since healing is not an issue and we are relying mostly on Tranquil Air Totem. In the situation, you are taking too much damage this spot can be replaced by a restoration shaman. In (Group 7): A mage could be replaced by a shadow weaving healing priest. In (Group 8): Traditionally, mages tend to switch to Fire Specialization after AQ, however, keeping a single as Frost with the talent Winter's Chill is advisable. A rogue can be replaced by a melee hunter on Nightfall duty. Thanks for reading!

      I hope you enjoyed exploring one of my favorite classes in World of Warcraft. If you are left with some lingering questions after having read the guide, feel free to swing over to the Discord: https://discordapp.com/invite/GYF3uNf and I would be more than happy to answer them. I will be continuously updating this guide as we learn more about Classic WoW.
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