Kanai

Need Help with DPS!!

18 posts in this topic

Hello all, 

I've recently been falling behind in DPS despite getting better gear and iLvl, and I know I could be doing way better.

I used to get purples and oranges almost every fight but as of late I've been getting blues and sometimes even greens.

I finally got shoulders the other day and I think I'm not using them correctly as well, also have seen a lot of people using NBF even with shoulders instead of DoS after the subterfuge patch, idk what's better.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated, also any trinket / legendary changes for certain fights would be a great help.

Legendaries: KJ, Cloak, Bracers, Shoulders

Trinkets: NBF 890, DoS 895, CoF 890

Also idk if my stats are current anymore as well, LMK. Been stacking crit since ever since I got 150% mastery, I don't know if this is optimal anymore.

 

My character: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/proudmoore/Rickysmores/simple

 

Logs from yesterday's heroic: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ZRM2jvkXQ7DyGrhc#fight=35 (First run using shoulders)

 

Opener I've been using with shoulders: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20753905531?page=1 (Nightstalker w/ Dos)

 

 

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13 hours ago, Kanai said:

172 views, no reply? =(

Lots of them are bots. 

Give me at LEAST a couple days before you start complaining about a reply, okay? I have a life too :P

That said I'll look at it late tonight, in all likelyhood. It takes time to comb through logs and take a proper look at everything - and time is something that I had in short supply up until today

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You may want to give KJ a shot over Convergence and the bracers. I personally simmed higher and did higher DPS using KJ over it very consistently. The stats on KJ are pretty terrific and it's probably worth using to see how you do. Convergence did not start pulling ahead of KJ for me until I got the legendary boots and that that point Convergence was a very huge upgrade vs. anything else. The one caveat I'll say with you using KJ over the bracers is that the bracers are one of the few legendaries I don't have, so I don't know how it compares vs. KJ since that's what you would be giving up to use it.   

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On 5/1/2017 at 1:09 AM, Kanai said:

Hello all, 

I've recently been falling behind in DPS despite getting better gear and iLvl, and I know I could be doing way better.

I used to get purples and oranges almost every fight but as of late I've been getting blues and sometimes even greens.

I finally got shoulders the other day and I think I'm not using them correctly as well, also have seen a lot of people using NBF even with shoulders instead of DoS after the subterfuge patch, idk what's better.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated, also any trinket / legendary changes for certain fights would be a great help.

Legendaries: KJ, Cloak, Bracers, Shoulders

Trinkets: NBF 890, DoS 895, CoF 890

Also idk if my stats are current anymore as well, LMK. Been stacking crit since ever since I got 150% mastery, I don't know if this is optimal anymore.

 

My character: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/proudmoore/Rickysmores/simple

 

Logs from yesterday's heroic: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ZRM2jvkXQ7DyGrhc#fight=35 (First run using shoulders)

 

Opener I've been using with shoulders: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20753905531?page=1 (Nightstalker w/ Dos)

 

 

So i currently have two of the worst dps legendarys and my dps is around the same. i think its all in the opener. ive found that if you get a pretty bad start on an opener then it sets you up to fail. i.e procing KB too early could be a bad thing.

so my rotation is as follows.  Poison i use is agonizing.

start off stealth. 

open up with Garrote> Mutilate > Rupture (doesnt matter if its not 5 combo points as this is to keep energy up for the next bit)

pop Vendetta > Multilate > Garrote > Vanish > Rupture > x5 combo points and Envenom > kingsblood

Then go into the normal rotation of keeping up rupture and garrote as much as possible. i only use kingsblood after ive used Envenom

doing this opener this way i hit 1.6 mill dps, then it steadys out to around 670k

 

my character: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/stormrage/Daveak/simple

Dps logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/K692Nrq4nHaGgtyb/#fight=10

Edited by dayvurd

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1 hour ago, dayvurd said:

So i currently have two of the worst dps legendarys and my dps is around the same. i think its all in the opener. ive found that if you get a pretty bad start on an opener then it sets you up to fail. i.e procing KB too early could be a bad thing.

so my rotation is as follows.  Poison i use is agonizing.

start off stealth. 

open up with Garrote> Mutilate > Rupture (doesnt matter if its not 5 combo points as this is to keep energy up for the next bit)

pop Vendetta > Multilate > Garrote > Vanish > Rupture > x5 combo points and Envenom > kingsblood

Then go into the normal rotation of keeping up rupture and garrote as much as possible. i only use kingsblood after ive used Envenom

doing this opener this way i hit 1.6 mill dps, then it steadys out to around 670k

 

my character: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/stormrage/Daveak/simple

Dps logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/K692Nrq4nHaGgtyb/#fight=10

Instead of hijacking somebody else's thread, you should make your own so your feedback doesn't get mixed up with his and confuse people

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After taking a quick look, I think you are missing out on a large damage increase without that 4-set bonus.  Could be wrong, but if you have the Doomblade Cloak ilvl 875+, I'd take a few runs on a target dummy with that puppy equipped.

 

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13 hours ago, pizzaboo said:

After taking a quick look, I think you are missing out on a large damage increase without that 4-set bonus.  Could be wrong, but if you have the Doomblade Cloak ilvl 875+, I'd take a few runs on a target dummy with that puppy equipped.

 

Holy shit, I didn't even realize that I no longer had my 4 set. Thank you so much for pointing that out. I feel really dumb now.

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17 hours ago, dayvurd said:

So i currently have two of the worst dps legendarys and my dps is around the same. i think its all in the opener. ive found that if you get a pretty bad start on an opener then it sets you up to fail. i.e procing KB too early could be a bad thing.

so my rotation is as follows.  Poison i use is agonizing.

start off stealth. 

open up with Garrote> Mutilate > Rupture (doesnt matter if its not 5 combo points as this is to keep energy up for the next bit)

pop Vendetta > Multilate > Garrote > Vanish > Rupture > x5 combo points and Envenom > kingsblood

Then go into the normal rotation of keeping up rupture and garrote as much as possible. i only use kingsblood after ive used Envenom

doing this opener this way i hit 1.6 mill dps, then it steadys out to around 670k

 

my character: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/stormrage/Daveak/simple

Dps logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/K692Nrq4nHaGgtyb/#fight=10

Really dude.

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21 hours ago, Carrn said:

Lots of them are bots. 

Give me at LEAST a couple days before you start complaining about a reply, okay? I have a life too :P

That said I'll look at it late tonight, in all likelyhood. It takes time to comb through logs and take a proper look at everything - and time is something that I had in short supply up until today

I didn't mean to come off complain-y by any means - my bad. Also, I wasn't aware of the bots.

Thanks for taking a look if you do, means a lot. 

Edited by Kanai

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18 hours ago, Kryptknight said:

You may want to give KJ a shot over Convergence and the bracers. I personally simmed higher and did higher DPS using KJ over it very consistently. The stats on KJ are pretty terrific and it's probably worth using to see how you do. Convergence did not start pulling ahead of KJ for me until I got the legendary boots and that that point Convergence was a very huge upgrade vs. anything else. The one caveat I'll say with you using KJ over the bracers is that the bracers are one of the few legendaries I don't have, so I don't know how it compares vs. KJ since that's what you would be giving up to use it.   

I'll have to look into this, but I feel like bracers are still better. I don't know for sure. I know they're losing value though since my guild has heroic on farm, the bosses go down way faster than progression, so that's a factor, I guess. 

 

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On 2017-5-1 at 1:09 AM, Kanai said:

Hello all, 

I've recently been falling behind in DPS despite getting better gear and iLvl, and I know I could be doing way better.

I used to get purples and oranges almost every fight but as of late I've been getting blues and sometimes even greens.

I finally got shoulders the other day and I think I'm not using them correctly as well, also have seen a lot of people using NBF even with shoulders instead of DoS after the subterfuge patch, idk what's better.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated, also any trinket / legendary changes for certain fights would be a great help.

Legendaries: KJ, Cloak, Bracers, Shoulders

Trinkets: NBF 890, DoS 895, CoF 890

Also idk if my stats are current anymore as well, LMK. Been stacking crit since ever since I got 150% mastery, I don't know if this is optimal anymore.

 

My character: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/proudmoore/Rickysmores/simple

 

Logs from yesterday's heroic: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ZRM2jvkXQ7DyGrhc#fight=35 (First run using shoulders)

 

Opener I've been using with shoulders: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20753905531?page=1 (Nightstalker w/ Dos)

 

 

Okay so

For trinkets I really don't like DoS. I think it's clunky, awkward, and not really that much of a damage boost. Frond is just as good if not better in terms of numbers, it gives Agi instead of Haste, and is significantly easier to use - Frond won't get you killed cause you messed up a timer and pressed it in a bad spot. There's just too many downsides to DoS to make it worth using over a trinket which is equal in terms of numbers but also doesn't have those downsides.

For stats you'll want to Sim yourself - I'm going to assume that your armory bugged cause you logged out in stealth or something, as it's showing you with 132% crit, and 32% seems like a much more reasonable number :P. So you've got a good amount of Crit and Mastery - I'm pretty sure Mastery will still be most beneficial for you, but your Vers is pretty low so that's not a bad option to pick up. Again, sim yourself to figure out what your specific weights are.

 You also probably want to give some careful consideration to your relics - make sure you have good ones, probably 2x Vendetta cooldown and 1x Envenom damage (after 4set it's better iirc, although not by much so Rupture damage is still completely viable). 3x Vendetta cd is only better if you have the boots.

For your opener you'll want to at least try something like Garrote > Rupture > Kb > Mut > Vend > Envenom > Mut > Wait > Vanish > Envenom > Mut > Envenom etc. It takes full advantage of your shoulders to buff some really massive Envenom hits, which benefit more from your Old War pot, and will overall be more of a damage boost than buffing a Rupture out of Vanish and having a couple of those ticks crit. 

As for other pointers, make sure you use Kingsbane on cooldown. The new trait means you can get basically 40% uptime on it, and you're on the low end of this. Rupture and Garrote uptimes should be improved as well, although they aren't as bad - it's a smaller detail but you need to push the small things if you want to really iron out your damage. Keep Envenom up while Kingsbane is active whenever possible. Your Vendetta uptime is important too; it's kind of impossible to compete without the boots, because you can get up to 50% uptime or higher, but I'm sure you can push it a little more.

Lastly, use potions. They help a ton, double potting Old War is like 6% of your total damage.

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2 hours ago, Kanai said:

if you do

I always do :P

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So NBF over DoS huh? I'll try it out. 

 

Thanks for telling me about Kingsbane, I wasn't sure if i should use it on CD with new trait, so I didn't. I guess I was too used to using it + Vendetta.

 

Also, for aoe fight, should I keep using KJ with CoF? or another combination.

 

 

Thanks for taking the time to look at my logs, I appreciate it!

 

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9 hours ago, Carrn said:

Okay so

For trinkets I really don't like DoS. I think it's clunky, awkward, and not really that much of a damage boost. Frond is just as good if not better in terms of numbers, it gives Agi instead of Haste, and is significantly easier to use - Frond won't get you killed cause you messed up a timer and pressed it in a bad spot. There's just too many downsides to DoS to make it worth using over a trinket which is equal in terms of numbers but also doesn't have those downsides.

For stats you'll want to Sim yourself - I'm going to assume that your armory bugged cause you logged out in stealth or something, as it's showing you with 132% crit, and 32% seems like a much more reasonable number :P. So you've got a good amount of Crit and Mastery - I'm pretty sure Mastery will still be most beneficial for you, but your Vers is pretty low so that's not a bad option to pick up. Again, sim yourself to figure out what your specific weights are.

 You also probably want to give some careful consideration to your relics - make sure you have good ones, probably 2x Vendetta cooldown and 1x Envenom damage (after 4set it's better iirc, although not by much so Rupture damage is still completely viable). 3x Vendetta cd is only better if you have the boots.

For your opener you'll want to at least try something like Garrote > Rupture > Kb > Mut > Vend > Envenom > Mut > Wait > Vanish > Envenom > Mut > Envenom etc. It takes full advantage of your shoulders to buff some really massive Envenom hits, which benefit more from your Old War pot, and will overall be more of a damage boost than buffing a Rupture out of Vanish and having a couple of those ticks crit. 

As for other pointers, make sure you use Kingsbane on cooldown. The new trait means you can get basically 40% uptime on it, and you're on the low end of this. Rupture and Garrote uptimes should be improved as well, although they aren't as bad - it's a smaller detail but you need to push the small things if you want to really iron out your damage. Keep Envenom up while Kingsbane is active whenever possible. Your Vendetta uptime is important too; it's kind of impossible to compete without the boots, because you can get up to 50% uptime or higher, but I'm sure you can push it a little more.

Lastly, use potions. They help a ton, double potting Old War is like 6% of your total damage.

Sorry, I meant to quote this post with my reply but, I don't know how to delete it. 

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maybe it`s not gear related,
and there`s always the matter of the AP grind. since it`s been greatly increased now.
maybe try some perfomance macros ? have you tried gnome sequencer?

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On 2017-5-4 at 10:58 PM, Kanai said:

So NBF over DoS huh? I'll try it out. 

 

Thanks for telling me about Kingsbane, I wasn't sure if i should use it on CD with new trait, so I didn't. I guess I was too used to using it + Vendetta.

 

Also, for aoe fight, should I keep using KJ with CoF? or another combination.

 

 

Thanks for taking the time to look at my logs, I appreciate it!

 

It depends on the fight, but I would lean towards using KJ's yeah.

I'm always around, feel free to drop by any time :P

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