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932 MM looking for advice

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Hello fellow hunters!

I have more or less played hunter exclusively since Ulduar, and I've always done pretty decent, doing respectable DPS, using my utility to it's fullest and generally been a good raider. In Legion however, I felt as if that changed, and nothing ever "clicked" - I feel like I've done poorly the entire expansion so far, so much that I even quit for a while.

Well, now my pretty casual guild has started progressing in mythic, and even though we've managed the three first cakewalk bosses, I want to do better at the harder ones, so I'm reaching out to you guys for help. To be honest, I have no idea where to start to better myself. I really suck at handling an/or interpreting logs, but I can tell I don't do really well from the rankings... mostly gray numbers. Also, my live DPS is pretty much 200k lower than my simmed (using Raidbots quicksim feature).

Below, I will link the logs from our progress run in mythic last night, some wipes, but two kills (Demonic Inquisition and Harjatan). Hopefully you can gleam something I'm doing wrong from them - if not I can probably get some logs from our raid tomorrow. I'll also post a link to my armory, if that helps. Raidbots doesn't seem to function properly at the moment, the connection to armory fails all the time which means I can't post any sims. I will try and edit this post with some sims later on, if possible. :P

Logs from last night:



My armory:



I don't expect you guys to do wonders, but any help is appreciated!


Tobhi of Silvermoon-EU


1st edit:


Also, forgot to mention that I guess I'm willing to swap to BM if needed, but I really hate pets with a passion since the Deathwing fights, and having my pet swimming between the platforms, preventing me from using Kill Command...

Edited by Tobhi

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3 hours ago, Tobhi said:

but I really hate pets 

Sorry i can't help ya with MM but the b'yes can, i been ignoring that spec b/c i am old and they changed it to much. 

but that statement. If someone at blizzard ever says "where did we go wrong" it lies in that statement. 


A Hunter....that hates ...pets.....which WAS and always should be a core aspect of the class.

The sky isn't fallen it has already fallen. 

Edited by Banard
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Well, perhaps I was a bit harsh in my wording, but I really do dislike them since they're hard to control and the AI is a bit lacking... I think most people have stories about pets doing crazy stuff! ;) Just the other night, my pet bugged out and kited a mob away from me while doing WQ's on Argus. Probably by trying to hit the mob from behind, and the mob trying to face the pet, ending in them running away together... oh well, bye! *waves*

The point of the edit was, and is, to point out that if the conclusion you guys reach is "you suck, don't play MM" I would be willing to try BM, even though it revolves around pets... I just hate the feeling I have while raiding now, like I'm getting boosted through mythic content. I wanna carry my weight, and I considering my ilvl, I really should be doing more.

I would be very grateful to anyone having advice on how to better myself... <3 Still hoping!


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Heh, when I looked at your armory you had the Time-Lost Artifact on, with BM weapon and MM legendaries, and nothing made any sense, but the logs show you actually use a Tarnished Sentinel Medallion and your gear is not crazy. I still think you have too much Versatility though, that neck is horrible for MM.

Inquisition and Harjatan are a bit annoying to look at since they have sporadic AoE. A Goroth log would be more consistent for rotation purposes. For example, I can't really tell if your ratio of Marked Shots is good, because cleaving adds a bunch of marked shots. Inquisition is particularly bad because damage done to the Tormented soul does not count towards your dps on logs. You spent an entire minute in there, which is horrible for your parse.

You are hitting Aimed Shots without Vulnerable. Your minimum crit was 703k and your minimum hit was 255k, both of these values indicate that you missed Vulnerables, which is unnacceptable. So you need to practice a lot more. The same thing happened in Harjatan, with your minimum crit at 526k and your minimum hit at 242k. The easiest way to miss a vulnerable is trying to get an Aimed Shot at the very end and overshooting it, so you might need to reprogram at which point it's too late to shoot another Aimed Shot.

There may be a few more things, for example I didn't check if you're optimizing the tier bonus (it falls off if your pause between aimed shot windows is too long), but if you miss Vulnerable Aimed Shots consistently that's by far and away the largest portion of your dps loss, so focus on improving that as top priority.

Edited by Khallid
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Thanks alot for the input, I appreciate it! <3

First of all, sorry I fucked up the armory - why would they put the timewalking dudes on Timeless Isle!?! But yes, I use a Tarnished Sentinel Medallion, and yeah, the neck is bad. Actually noticed it last night (I'm slow...), so I scrambled and bought a relinquished neck that gave me alot more mastery and crit.

Secondly, I actually found a mythic Goroth kill where I attended a while back and compared it to another hunter I found, and even though his fight were shorter, he still did 20+ more Aimed Shots than I did, so that's a thing to check out. Also, he used Marked Shot alot less, which I guess means my ratio isn't very good.

Considering all this, it wouldn't be a far stretch to assume I fuck up the tier bonus as well. :D A hard awakening to be honest - I apparently suck alot more than I initially thought, but atleast I know now what to look at!

The log I spoke of; full Heroic clear and a Goroth kill, if you're curious and wanna dig deeper. ;)

Again, thanks alot for your help! <3

Tobhi of Silvermoon


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I could take a look at it, but the advice will be the same nonetheless. In single target you need to cast as few Marked Shots as possible. You only use it for opening Vulnerable, and you obviously don't need it if you have WIndburst to open it instead. So you should end up casting almost 3 times more Aimed Shots than Marked Shots. The thing with how many Aimed Shots you can fit will depend on a lot of factors. Good use of Trueshot, how much Haste you have and appropriate focus management are the main ones, but RNG will sometimes let you throw a ton of extra Aimed Shots if Lock and Load procs a lot, since it gives instant cast Aimed Shots with no focus cost.

However, all that is secondary to perfecting the Vulnerable rotation. Every single Aimed Shot has to land with Vulnerable on. A non-vulnerable Aimed Shot is weak shot that wastes a lot of time and focus, so it's extremely punishing to your dps. And my impression is that there is a systematic mistake in your rotation, so it's not like you only missed it once.

Edited by Khallid

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Azor recently put up a boss-by-boss guide where you can see which talents and legendaries to use, I think it will be a great help. Do you have any addons to help you keep track of vulnerable windows? This is very important because once you're more aware of filling vulnerable windows with aimed shots, timing them will be crucial and sets the good hunters apart from the excellent ones. The 4P bonus is really important to keep the buff up so try to shoot your aimed shots in pairs, back to back. It's also a good idea to know when to save your trueshot and when to use it. (Like spawning of priority/multi targets or when you have a good window to burst). For

Single target Marked shot is merely a means to get your vulnerable window, so don't spam it, save it for when you need it, but make Windburst a priority over marked shot. Windburst doesn't need much focus so even at low focus you can Windburst > arcane shot twice and shoot two aimed shots. When it's on cooldown you resort to marked shots. Make sure to have around 70 focus before you marked shot followed by one arcane and two aimed shots. Also, if Trueshot is about to come off cooldown, make sure you have near full focus.

For multi target fights your marked shots, multi-shot, legendary belt (and trueshot) become your bread and butter without neglecting your single target effort on the boss/priority target.

A long time did I stick to the meme build and it wasn't easy for me to adapt to the trickshot build, but after practising I steadily saw my dps and percentile improve. Now I mostly get orange and purple numbers thanks to taking the time to understand the spec, the encounter and practising! Remember, Marksmanship is an instrument of precision. Time it and you'll be rewarded. See it as a challenge.

PS You're not alone, I hate pets too, Lone Wolf for the win!

Edited by Ladyoftheforest
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Thanks for all your answers!

I have already checked out the boss-by-boss guide, and it does give some very good insights! And yes, I do have a weakauras which more or less handles everything connected to DPS, like focus, vulnerable windows, CD's and whatnot.

I have also done some raiding and I can already see some progress, solely from the fact that I am more "aware"; my rotation is indeed a bit lacking. I do from time to time get periods where Windburst is on cooldown and I don't have a Marked Shot ready - is that normal, or am I mismanaging something?

Also, should probably clarify the "hating pets" thing a bit: I hate pets from a DPS perspective since I find them unreliable, but I like the idea of having a pet companion... so I of course try and collect rare and useful ones. :P When Lone Wolf was introduced, it was a sigh of relief, finally no more wonky pet AI to babysit!

Well, I've learned much from this thread, and while I haven't fixed all my errors (apparently there were alot of them... heh) I now atleast know where to look. Many thanks for all your input, it was truly an eye opener! :)


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Yes, sometimes you will find no marked shot procs, though it's really uncommon. In that event you build up focus till you have 95 and dumb the focus with aimed shot untill you get a proc again. It happens, but it's not a worry. Just make sure you only use marked shot when you need to (when you have 70 focus).

For multitarget fights you will have periods of no procs since you're spamming multi-shot and marked shot on groups. In this case it's a matter of RNG.

This video of SignsofKelani is a nice example of how it's done:


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bonsoir j ai un souci avec la quete pour l altcatraz je rentre dedans et pour finir la quete impossible de passer l autre salle   c'est trouver l inquisiteur Raagdar  le cristal bloque le passage et je n arrive pas a entrer pouvez vous me dire  si  c'estun bug ou autre merci d avance pour votre aide

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10 hours ago, babydollus said:

bonsoir j ai un souci avec la quete pour l altcatraz je rentre dedans et pour finir la quete impossible de passer l autre salle   c'est trouver l inquisiteur Raagdar  le cristal bloque le passage et je n arrive pas a entrer pouvez vous me dire  si  c'estun bug ou autre merci d avance pour votre aide

Well this is fun.

Ta question n'a rien a voir avec le sujet. Je n'ai aucune idée de quest-ce que tu parles. En plus, celle-ci n'est pas un forum français.

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