isendier

Subtlety Rogue help?

25 posts in this topic

Hello, I am currently trying to raise my dps as a subtlety rogue, usually it lays around the 25-30k but it seems like my regular melee attacks does way more damage than any of my abilities. which doesnt seem right?

 

 

I am currently mostly pvp geared for assasination.

 

 

here is my armory :http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/grim-batol/Isendier/advanced

log is in the comments.

 

 

I hope that i posted this the "right" place and that someone out there can help me smile.png

 

-Isendier

Edited by isendier

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry, but your post is sort of confusing me - are you looking for more damage as Sub in PvP? Or in PvE? Cause the two play very differently. Either way I can help you not a problem, I'm just looking for some clarification :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ive come to realize that the problem may be because of the high mastery stat i have. I'm currently working on getter stats that suites subtlety better.

 

But any tips at all?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ive come to realize that the problem may be because of the high mastery stat i have. I'm currently working on getter stats that suites subtlety better.

But any tips at all?

Stats are a small portion of your dps, changing your stats around won't change your dps as much as tightening up and perfecting your rotation will.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Few things on your rotation (I've looked only the Brackenspore kill)

 

- Overusage of Garrote. Use once on opener to trigger SV. That's all folks. Damage is super negligible, you got Rupture for that.

- Vanish + Prep. You could've fit 3 Vanishes in there, and thus extending your biggest "CD" - Find Weakness. You took too long to blow your first Vanish - should've been right before the first FW fell, followed by Preparation. Your second Vanish is 30s later after it's off cooldown, so you're wasting at least 15s on boss without Find Weakness (which sometimes can be the difference between a kill and a wipe).

- Rupture should NEVER fall off. It's your main damage, even some small downtime means a significative damage loss. 93% isn't abysmally bad, but you should aim for 99%+;

- Bracken is a cleave fight, you can Rupture-tab the other add and use it to generate CPs faster with FoK while your Rupture ticks and Evisc away your hearts' content. Remember, if there are adds you can FoK and a main target, do it and dump everything else on main - else, Rup-tab;

- It's more practical, but not optimal: don't macro your Shadow Reflection with your Shadow Dance. You should be making your shadow copy your Rupture, and you shouldn't be Rupturing inside Shadow Dance. So, make it 2 buttons, gives you better control. Shadow Reflection > Rupture > Shadow Dance;

- Hemo does negligible damage, just use it as a cushion for your Rupture timing (it's a pain in teh ass to control it with MS proccing 24/7). Don't use it to generate combo points (except on extreme positional requirements), and don't overlap it before it's pandemic timer.

 

As for stats, I don't know how the weights are now (you should sim your toon), but MS and Mastery are good 2nd stats for Sub.

 

So, yeah. tl;dr

 

tighten your timers;

unbind your cds;

use more vanish/prep;

99% Rupture uptime;

 

Hope it helps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lipsinch: Yeah, I am stil working on the rotation, I am currently getting better at openers etc, but about the mastery part, I get 61% weapon speed from SnD and therefore i assume i should get more multistrike.

But thanks for the opener advice, I guess i've been trying to save the cd's or something like that, I'll try it out.

and the macro with shadowdance and reflection, Yeah i get your point and will remove it, however the Icy veins guide as i recall says its best to use it as a macro.

 

Overall thanks for the advice :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mastery doesn't increase only SnD effectiveness, but also the damage from your finishers, Evisc, Rupture and CT. So you can expect heavy Eviscs and hard hitting DoTs. Though I don't know at what extent MS outweights Mastery and vice versa, so the best bet is simming your toon really. =)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

uhm.. Simming my toon? can i get a translation? smile.png

Simming your toon means getting simulationcraft (or go to shadowcraft, I'm not sure which is better for rogues tbh) and running a sim with stat scaling turned on in the options.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Both Shadowcraft and SimCraft are good, but Shadowcraft is much easier to use for beginners so that's where I would recommend starting. I gave your character a quick Sim for you, and your damage is pretty close to where you can be

 

I have a couple suggestions: 

 

1) What Lip said is good advice, so I won't expand on that

 

2) In order to get comfortable with the rotation, sit on a target dummy for 4 minutes at a time (drop combat after Shadow Reflection comes up the second time). It won't be perfect, but it will help you get used to timing your openers and cooldowns

 

3) Getting new trinkets, a ring, and the set bonuses will be very beneficial to you. Your ilevel is plenty high enough to get a group for normal HFC (Heroic too, even) and you can use those to get some good upgrades which will push your damage a lot

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I dont think any group will take me because most of my gear is pvp related :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I dont think any group will take me because most of my gear is pvp related :)

There's no penalty for wearing PvP gear in PvE content, it just doesn't scale up to it's PvP level.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh, I have a friend that says the opposite, anyways ill give it a try :)

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry, but your friend still lives in Pandaria. Tell him to search for PvP Pallies back in 6.0 (or 6.1?) with their absurd PvP 4pc topping meters in PvE.

 

No offense. :>

 

Edit:

 

isendier, keep us updated! I'd like to see how our fellow Rogues are evolving. =)

Edited by lipsinch

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey!

 

Ok, feedback time:

 

Tyrant:

 

- Try pre premeditation - use it before the pull and activate SnD like 2s before Premeditation resetting (it has 20s for usage, but the 2CP you earn wears off in 18s - try to time with that count)

- Too much Garrote. You use it only once @ opener. No more than that.

- You can cast more Vanishes. 1m30 per Vanish CD, the fight lasts 6 min. That means you can at least cast it 4 times if you use on CD PLUS 2 times with Preparation. So, you gotta use it 6 times.

- SnD uptime was under 90%. Remember, 99% uptime. No SnD = no energy = no damage.

- Rupture was good with 97%. Work on those 2% left, but try to not overlap them.

- Kidney Shot. Prolly a misclick. tongue.png

- Only use Hemo when you're unable to provide a full 5CP Rupture on the target or either it'll die really quick that's not worth using Rupture on it (or due to positional requirements). For everything else, forego it. You overlapped Rupture with Hemo on adds twice and 4 times on boss when Rupture was active yet.

- The adds were stacked for a while on boss, so you could've used that situation to generate more CPs using FoK. That makes your life easier, the CP flow increases and you have room to wiggle with your buffs (or even squeeze more DPS).

- Make use of your other defensive CDs. You don't have only Feint, you got CoS, Sprint, Smoke Bomb... You could've taken less damage, specially if you're on soak duty.

 

And I'ma sleep, wrote this while having a DR, lol.

 

Tomorrow or some time later I check the other fights. If anyone is willing to take a look, please do so. It's 1am and I'm sleepy enough to let something slip away (or I didn't have the knowledge really, I'm no master).

 

Edit: Forgot to mention - nice squid hat.

Edited by lipsinch

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

heres a log from highmaul earlier today, i have to remember to delete old logs because some HFC is in there too.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/WB6ycPdYqRVH34fX

Also the high amount of hemorrhage is because the LFR tanks kept turning the bosses -.-¨

And thanks tongue.png I've been fishing before i log 

 

But I've got a question about the SnD because if find weakness is about to run out, but SnD is too. Isnt the priority to get another eviscerate on him while the debuff is up? (and then reapply SnD as quickly as possible afterwards)

 

 

Thanks for the feedback smile.png It's good to see what i can do better smile.png

 

edit: 

and heres one from HFC up till kilrogg - https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/nA9BR7DaXrYKWqd6/

 

I really screwed up in some of these fights with rupture at 70% at one, i feel bad for uploading it but well any feedback is good feedback :D

Edited by isendier

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Keeping the energy regen from SnD is more important than using Evis, but it really depends how many combo points you have at the time - if you have enough to use both finishers right in a row, then Evis > SnD

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've got another question guys :) During shadowdance, and theres like 4 sec left but you got full combo points and anticipation. should you throw an eviscerate and maybe a single ambush (depending on energy) or try to get 2x ambushes in instead?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you're full CP, Eviscerate; last second of SD you Ambush to extend Find Weakness 10s more. It's pointless Ambushing while full CP, you'll just throw away potential damage (CPs).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another question here :) I have a headpiece and legs, 715 ilvl non tier piece. and i have a 710 headpiece and 685 legs both tier pieces. would it be better to go for higher ilvl or to get the bonus from tier pieces? (keep in mind i only have those two tier pieces)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think it's worth dropping 2pc, losing 5CP and 30% dmg on Vanish seems big to me.

 

I'm not sure of it (better if someone else confirm this), but I wouldn't drop it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah I wouldn't drop it either. Keep the offset pieces just to see what Tier you do get, but the tier pieces are better 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By hippi87
      Hey guys im struggling to get the dps i should do (raidbots and logs from player with euqal ilvl)
      maybe you can check my gear and my logs to help me improve something :) thanks
      Armory: https://worldofwarcraft.com/de-de/character/khazgoroth/hiippiih
      Single Target log : https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Lncj8ZM2gGtPkwrN/#fight=5
      Multi Target log: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Lncj8ZM2gGtPkwrN/#fight=7
      Multi Target log 2 :https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Lncj8ZM2gGtPkwrN/#fight=11
      thx at @ all 
    • By Dredd
      <Return With Honor> PvP/PvE[9/9] looking to recruit new members. For guild information such as raid times and guild activities or to simply apply please visit at returnwithhonor.shivtr.com


      Who Are We?
      Established in Tichondrius during WoD expansion, Return With Honor is a guild lead by military veterans who are also veteran players of World of Warcraft. We offer great conversations, crude humor, active guild environment, and a home for individuals looking to be apart of a tight nit group. We also have a guild point system used by our members to earn great prizes from the WoW Shop, BOE items(xmog gear, pets, mounts, etc) and game time. These points can be earned by staying active on our guild website, volunteering to assist the guild, and being involved in any guild groups. 


      RAID SCHEDULE Alternating raid weeks Tues, Friday, Sunday and Wed, Thu, Mon: 1800-2000 EST. We expect everyone to be prepared and ready to go 15 minutes before raid time (1745 EST) to start pulls at 1800 EST. We get Saturdays off every week.
      https://www.wowprogress.com/guild/us/emerald-dream/Return+With+Honor


      RATED BATTLEGROUNDS The RBG schedule varies on a week by week basis. Multiple groups will be formed to accommodate mostly everyone.
      Guild Events Guild Events are held every week with prizes for members to earn like high ilvl BOE gear, gold, pets, and mounts.


      If interested please contact Hoodxd or myself(Dreddmourne) by in-game message or mail Contact me at #ActionJack11202
    • By punkienurse
      I am looking for advice on how to improve my performance and numbers in raid. I have linked armory and logs form normal TOS below. Any and all advice is welcomed and appreciated.
      https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/r17y29YZGcF8wbt3
      https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/shandris/adleia
    • By Chumani
      Aka'magosh my raider friends! Chumani here from Corrupted Destiny guild (Horde) on Skywall/Drak'thul realms. We are currently recruiting for our core team for mythic raiding. We are 10 /10 Heroic Nighthold (10/10 N NH in about 1 1/2 hours) (Providing we arent cutting up and getting yelled at.... by a certain mage in our guild.... who cuts up too.... and won't admit it..... and puts down fake portals.... every week..... and people still take them.... to their death..... really......week..... after week.... to their death...... seriously)
      As always we are recruiting raiders and non raiders.
      *****GIRLS***** We have a large number of female gamers who do not have to worry about harrasment of any kind...we just will not tolerate this... and our group is like family. Come see for yourself!
      Tired of the ridiculous harassment from the opposite sex? You will be safe with us! Mature gamers who do not condone this behaviour!
      Our raid schedule is Tuesday/Thursday/Sunday 6:30pm to 9:00pm server time(pst)
      We currently have an "Alt" raid for alts and non-progression raiders on Mondays at the same time! MEGA amounts of fun there, alot of us use our mains to carry this raid and help gear these raiders up!
      Other guild events include: Herb Drives, Fishing Expo, Mog off! (Best transmog wins), Old Raids for Transmog gear & Mythic Plus runs. We do random guild events with prizes up to and including a FREE MONTH OF WOW! (Mog-Off is going on NOW!!)
      We have quite a bit of fun when we get together, as we always have over the years! Come join us and get corrupted (Disclaimer: Infections have been found to be the leading cause of corruption in many raiders) We've always been here and will continue to be here! Of course you will be required to sacrifice a goat or an alliance player once a week to the Horde gods..... You will also be required to laugh and have fun as well! We do have fun!
      So.......COME.......GET.......CORRUPTED!
      Swiper#1939 - Deni#1743 - Loki#15391
      ***Newest video highlighting some of our girls!****
      (We are just huge nerds who see ourselves as badass warriors!... ok!)
      ******We also have one of our members who has published some 'how to' videos for certain in game mounts!!*** Keep eye out for Barcat, one of our casual members and professional mount hoarder and his youtube channel for these vids! Will post one in comment below*******
      http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=247413