Aleco

Whats the Move? #2 - Improving at Hearthstone One Play at a Time

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In episode two of "What's the Move?" Aleco discusses an open-ended situation which doesn't have a clear answer.

We kicked off this new series by analyzing a tricky situation which had only one optimal line of play. In episode two we'll take a look at a very different kind of situation, one where there might not be a perfect move at all.

Please let us know in the comments what you would have done in this situation! One of the primary goals of this series is to foster improvement at Hearthstone by generating discussions. We would also love to hear your feedback on the video itself, as the series is still very new and has plenty room to improve on its format.

- Aleco

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Solid video! I would like to say that to me, it feels like a deck tracker or at least a decklist would be useful pieces of information. Also, I feel that you should avoid having things that draw or give cards in your hand, otherwise, knowing that we're making the decision with the available information, we know that we won't be using anything we draw or get from the glyph.

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I like that vid, too.

SMOrcMan, I assume that's the point. It's an important part of the game how you deal with variables, knowing your own deck and the unknown. This hand in the vid including the Glyph as well as an Arcane Intellect made it a really interesting choice and an educative lesson as well.

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1 hour ago, Caldyrvan said:

I like that vid, too.

SMOrcMan, I assume that's the point. It's an important part of the game how you deal with variables, knowing your own deck and the unknown. This hand in the vid including the Glyph as well as an Arcane Intellect made it a really interesting choice and an educative lesson as well.

What I mean is that say we that it was a different scenario in which playing glyph was the right play. It would be impossible to do a what's the play since we're unable to see the options before we use it.

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42 minutes ago, SMOrcMan said:

What I mean is that say we that it was a different scenario in which playing glyph was the right play. It would be impossible to do a what's the play since we're unable to see the options before we use it.

Why is that? If you play cards like glyph you know what you do if you get what you need and what you do if you don't get what you need.

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Yeah, I don't see the problem with having discover/draw cards involved. If you're playing those cards you still need plans for when they do or don't provide you with anything you want to play. Like here, the plan is arcane intellect into frostbolt, but if we luck out and draw our, um, Obliterate, we'll use that instead.

Edited by Bozonik

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Nice video again Aleco. I felt the hint maybe made it a bit too easy. I like the addition of the rope! It'd be nice to see the play leading up to the position rather than the clip from another game at the start. Guessing maybe that's because you weren't recording until you reached the decision point though.

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3 hours ago, Strongpoint said:

Why is that? If you play cards like glyph you know what you do if you get what you need and what you do if you don't get what you need.

Yes, but this series is about what's the play, and I feel that what you just mentioned is an aspect of the play that also needs consideration. In essence, another play by itself. Like opting for the frostbolt over the arcanologist. By the basic assumption that the episode is about one play, we can therefore deduce that the optimal cards already exist in our hand and not in our deck. Do you see what I'm saying? (See what I provided below as well)

20 minutes ago, Bozonik said:

Yeah, I don't see the problem with having discover/draw cards involved. If you're playing those cards you still need plans for when they do or don't provide you with anything you want to play. Like here, the plan is arcane intellect into frostbolt, but if we luck out and draw our, um, Obliterate, we'll use that instead.

There are definitely cases in hearthstone in which you will make different plays based on what you draw, but the premise of these episodes has the underlying assumption that you won't draw something that will change your play, which in turn, already gives away part of the answer.

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Great video, keep it up!

Pressing pause blocks the hand.

Edit: clicking the youtube video link brings you to a player that doesn't hide the hand during pause.

Edited by Nathan5678

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Thanks for all the feedback guys! There's some really useful insight in these comments and I'll be sure to incorporate some of these tips into the next episode. I think its very relevant to show cards that are remaining in my deck and cards which have already been played by my opponent, so at a minimum I'll try to work that in to episode 3.

As to the debate about including cards which have hidden information (like Arcane Intellect and Primordial Glyph), I'm of the opinion that these cards should be treated no differently in the context of "what do you do right now?" than any other card. Sure, you don't have the luxury in this series of being able to draw cards before deciding what your next move is, but you don't have this luxury on ladder either. First you must commit to drawing cards, which is a decision in and of itself. With that said I totally see the point about how having cards like these involved in the equation muddies up the waters and don't anticipate that I will frequently include these cards in future episodes. Hope this clears things up!

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3 hours ago, Aleco said:

Thanks for all the feedback guys! There's some really useful insight in these comments and I'll be sure to incorporate some of these tips into the next episode. I think its very relevant to show cards that are remaining in my deck and cards which have already been played by my opponent, so at a minimum I'll try to work that in to episode 3.

As to the debate about including cards which have hidden information (like Arcane Intellect and Primordial Glyph), I'm of the opinion that these cards should be treated no differently in the context of "what do you do right now?" than any other card. Sure, you don't have the luxury in this series of being able to draw cards before deciding what your next move is, but you don't have this luxury on ladder either. First you must commit to drawing cards, which is a decision in and of itself. With that said I totally see the point about how having cards like these involved in the equation muddies up the waters and don't anticipate that I will frequently include these cards in future episodes. Hope this clears things up!

I see your point. Good luck on your next video! It's an interesting series. I feel like it would have been even more amazing back in patron days, but those days are gone. RIP warsong commander

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Nice video. Thank You - I like your solution.

Also like your answers to the relevant questions SMOrcMan had.

A deck list would be nice. But the hint about agression was OK also 

Looking forward to the next one

Best regards

PanPan

 

 

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Got to the same conclusion as shown in the video. It even says in the topic that there is no absolute correct decision.

Still the explanation in the video makes it clear why he makes the plays (and why he is in no need to play the glyph, because there are better solutions already availible)

Nice episode!

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On 9/19/2017 at 4:52 AM, Bozonik said:

Yeah, I don't see the problem with having discover/draw cards involved. If you're playing those cards you still need plans for when they do or don't provide you with anything you want to play. Like here, the plan is arcane intellect into frostbolt, but if we luck out and draw our, um, Obliterate, we'll use that instead.

I personally chose to "use" AI, then paused after it drew so I could see what came from it. Don't know if others did the same.

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